Jeff Green - 2nd worst contract of the summer

[Celtics18]

I'll be honest, I've been pretty disappointed with some the arguments being put forth here.

I've seen a lot of "Contract A is bad, but Contract B is worse, so therefore Contract A is actually pretty good!" Ehm, what???

Let's face it, even most people on this forum think Green was overpaid, at least somewhat. Now if you take off your green goggles and look around, that contract has been pretty much the laughing stock of the rest of the league. I haven't heard a single person say, "man, what a steal by Ainge!"

If Jeff Green goes out there and plays like garbage, and Danny ends up desperately trying to unload him, then he's overpaid.  If he goes out and puts up around his career numbers, stays healthy, and plays big minutes for a contending team, then he'll be very valuable.  He'll be both tradable and keepable, depending on how Danny feels about his fit for the future.

The value of an NBA contract is never as simple as a straight dollars per statistical production comparison.  And, it's certainly way too early to evaluate how good a deal someone is before he has played a single game on his new contract. 

Here's hoping he ends up being worth it.

[2short]

Jeff Green=paid well by a team that really needs him to perform at his usual level , good chance he can produce better than that in a good TEAM situation and can also be ready to take over for Pierce in a few years

Jermaine O'Neil=overpaid, dictionary term

[Interceptor]

Danny needed the roster spot last year so he had to let Green go.  The only other path that might have worked would be if the league might have granted an injury exception.  But that apparently went nowhere.

I guess that explains it. I thought that they could hang on to the QO rights even if he wasn't on the 15-man roster.

[BudweiserCeltic]

Danny needed the roster spot last year so he had to let Green go.  The only other path that might have worked would be if the league might have granted an injury exception.  But that apparently went nowhere.

I guess that explains it. I thought that they could hang on to the QO rights even if he wasn't on the 15-man roster.

We could have, but for what? You're basically paying for one year contract in which Green would become free to go elsewhere the year after on our dime. So it was better for both parties, once the 9 million contract was voided, to part ways for the year.

[fairweatherfan]

I'll be honest, I've been pretty disappointed with some the arguments being put forth here.

I've seen a lot of "Contract A is bad, but Contract B is worse, so therefore Contract A is actually pretty good!" Ehm, what???

When you start with the premise that a contract is the "2nd worst of the summer", naming at least 2 that are worse seems like the most direct way of refuting that, doesn't it?  If I made a thread called "Rondo is the worst FT shooter in the league", and someone replied that Reggie Evans was worse, does that mean they think Rondo's pretty good at free throws?

I don't think Green has a "good" contract right now, but it's not a terrible one either, and he has a solid chance to overperform that salary over the life of the contract.  We'll have to wait and see - and first, see what he actually winds up signing for.

[BballTim]

  From draftexpress, here's a list of players who earned between $8.5M and $10M last year:

  Salmons, Landry, Kidd, Stuckey, Mo Williams, Scola, Odom, Beidrins, Diaw, Devin Harris, Bargnani, Stephen Jackson, Richard Jefferson, Gerald Wallace and Calderon.

  Like it or not, but all of those players were given those contracts by teams other than the Celtics. Pretty tough group, but who's going to look at that list of players and then say that there's no way another nba team would offer Jeff Green similar money? Who's going to say that Green's too far below that level of player to get a similar offer, or even multiple offers?

[Surferdad]

  From draftexpress, here's a list of players who earned between $8.5M and $10M last year:

  Salmons, Landry, Kidd, Stuckey, Mo Williams, Scola, Odom, Beidrins, Diaw, Devin Harris, Bargnani, Stephen Jackson, Richard Jefferson, Gerald Wallace and Calderon.

  Like it or not, but all of those players were given those contracts by teams other than the Celtics. Pretty tough group, but who's going to look at that list of players and then say that there's no way another nba team would offer Jeff Green similar money? Who's going to say that Green's too far below that level of player to get a similar offer, or even multiple offers?

Again, it comes down to how he performs, then you can evaluate the contract.  I think Green is right in the talent range of the guys listed there, maybe a tab lower, but only because he's younger and hasn't shown it over a longer period of time.

[RockinRyA]

I'll be honest, I've been pretty disappointed with some the arguments being put forth here.

I've seen a lot of "Contract A is bad, but Contract B is worse, so therefore Contract A is actually pretty good!" Ehm, what???

Let's face it, even most people on this forum think Green was overpaid, at least somewhat. Now if you take off your green goggles and look around, that contract has been pretty much the laughing stock of the rest of the league. I haven't heard a single person say, "man, what a steal by Ainge!"

Ainge overpayed for green I agree, but sometimes you have to overpay to an extent to get services away from competition. and most of the time that makes up for the slight overpay.

What I dont agree is the article you linked in which you said you agree on all fronts. Green never came close to average really? if 15 ppg isnt close to average then maybe you think 20ppg is?

Pretty much scratching my head on GM wannabe's who insinuate they know more than Ainge regarding if there are really competition for Green's services. And to those who think they can come up with better deals than Ainge. What, you expecting to get DH on the vet min? lol

[The Rondo Show]

I'm not familiar with the website, but that seems like slanted rhetoric and in large parts nonsense.

Seriously?  Jason Terry is "waaay" past his prime, despite his Finals performance one season ago?  Jeff Green has never approached average? 

I agree that 4 years, $36 million fully guaranteed is a mistake, but I don't think this article added anything more than a biased, slanted forums post.

^^^^

[Interceptor]

Well, the fact of the matter is, Green's agent had Ainge by the short hairs anyway. We needed a SF to back up Pierce, Jeff gives us that and thensome, but the realities of the CBA and the need to ALSO replace that guy who played SG for us, means that options are limited. Throwing money and years at the guy that we own the Bird Rights to is our best option, which doesn't give Ainge a lot of leverage.

[Galeto]

Well, the fact of the matter is, Green's agent had Ainge by the short hairs anyway. We needed a SF to back up Pierce, Jeff gives us that and thensome, but the realities of the CBA and the need to ALSO replace that guy who played SG for us, means that options are limited. Throwing money and years at the guy that we own the Bird Rights to is our best option, which doesn't give Ainge a lot of leverage.

I don't think Falk did.  Resigning Green had little to do with getting the replacements for Ray.  They could have let him go and still have replaced Ray.  I would have been more than happy if Ainge had brought back Pietrus and Stiemsma with the money he paid Green.  It would have been cheaper and more flexible going forward.

With Terry as another shot creator on this team, the backup SF does not need to be an iso scoring threat, just a defender/shooter would've been adequate.  For perimeter defense, I'd take Pietrus over Green.

The thing that bothers me about Green's contract is that if he doesn't meet expectations, they might not have the MLE to fill a need.  Nearly the entire freaking team is signed for next season and the team is close to the tax apron.  Even if the cap goes up, it might not go up enough to fit in 5 million and stay within the luxury tax apron. 

[Neurotic Guy]

Well, the fact of the matter is, Green's agent had Ainge by the short hairs anyway. We needed a SF to back up Pierce, Jeff gives us that and thensome, but the realities of the CBA and the need to ALSO replace that guy who played SG for us, means that options are limited. Throwing money and years at the guy that we own the Bird Rights to is our best option, which doesn't give Ainge a lot of leverage.

I don't think Falk did.  Resigning Green had little to do with getting the replacements for Ray.  They could have let him go and still have replaced Ray.  I would have been more than happy if Ainge had brought back Pietrus and Stiemsma with the money he paid Green.  It would have been cheaper and more flexible going forward.

With Terry as another shot creator on this team, the backup SF does not need to be an iso scoring threat, just a defender/shooter would've been adequate.  For perimeter defense, I'd take Pietrus over Green.

The thing that bothers me about Green's contract is that if he doesn't meet expectations, they might not have the MLE to fill a need.  Nearly the entire freaking team is signed for next season and the team is close to the tax apron.  Even if the cap goes up, it might not go up enough to fit in 5 million and stay within the luxury tax apron.

Ainge has given the team flexibility to trade for expiring contracts if the goal becomes to lower our cap number in the next 12 months (which I doubt it will).   I guess the decisions of a GM fall into the realm of d-mned if you do, d-mned if you don't.  Pietrus/Steimsma instead of Green/Collins -- as you prefer -- would probably not have been preferred by many. 

[cman88]

the talent difference between Green/Pietrus is pretty big IMO....green is much more versatile whereas pietrus is 3 and D...without Green we have NO way to matchup against Miami when they go small.

overpay or not, Ainges moves basically have said we are going all in the next 2-3 years. its not like we could just give that $9million we are giving to Green to someone else, or keep it as free space

[ScoobyDoo]

I'm really not looking at Green's contract dollars and then tying that specifically and "only" to the numbers he puts up this year.

I see Ainge's as championship chasing moves:

1. KG, Pierce, Rondo, Bass - basically the core of our playoff run this last year

2. You bring back Wilcox, Dooling and a healthy Bradley, add Jason Collins and draft Melo, Sully and Joseph (who I think will absolutely make this roster).

3. Your team:

KG / Collins / Melo
Bass / Wilcox / Sully
Pierce / Joseph
Brad / Chrsitmas (?)
Rondo / Dooling

3. The question is - do the additions of Green, Lee and Terry, when added to an already much upgraded team that even "much depleted" last year by the time we got to the ECF's, make this team a true championship threat? That's the question for me - not just what numbers that Green, Lee and terry put up...

They are all great team guys with a real desire to be "in Boston" and on this team.

If Green comes in and averages 12 and 6 AND keeps Pierce ultra rested all year and that greatly enhances Pierce's performance come playoff time - he's worth every bit of that $9 mil.

It's about championships, that's it. Does this team have a legit shot?

KG / Collins / Melo
Bass / Wilcox / Sully
Pierce / Green / Joseph
Lee / Bradley / Xmas
Rondo / Terry / Dooling

For me the answer is yes - I think we can crush Miami if healthy - beat them up in fact.

Without Green, Lee and Terry I would say we have very little chance at a ring.

Great signings from a team building perspective.

I'm all in on it. Love it.   
 

[Galeto]

the talent difference between Green/Pietrus is pretty big IMO....green is much more versatile whereas pietrus is 3 and D...without Green we have NO way to matchup against Miami when they go small.

overpay or not, Ainges moves basically have said we are going all in the next 2-3 years. its not like we could just give that $9million we are giving to Green to someone else, or keep it as free space

I don't think Green is that versatile.  If anything, he's shown that he shouldn't play PF at all because his lack of rebounding and defense as a big, coupled with his inability to take advantage offensively, makes him a negative at PF. Thinking of how he'd look as a SF, imagine the guys he's compared to, Granger or Gay as PFs.  Defensively they might struggle although I think they would rebound better but offensively, they would be better going against PFs.  Green's inability to exploit PFs is a huge red flag about his scoring potential against SFs.

My point about Green is that 9 million a season is a heck of a lot of money to pay to a role player.  And as long as Pierce is here at SF and Terry is the lead scorer off the bench, Green is a role player.  Paying Green, Terry, Bass and Lee 25 million combined leaves very little room to add anything for the next two seasons.  If Green doesn't work out, they might be stuck.