OJ Mayo is signing with Dallas (Confirmed)

[RJ87]

I like this move for both parties. Mayo - for all of the complaints about him - is still talented. If he can get his head into the game, he could be a great scoring guard. As a starter, he showed he can be a difference maker. I think Dallas can help him by getting him around some quality vets like Dirk and Shawn Marion. For Dallas, if Mayo can reach his potential, he could extend Dirk's career.

Wonder how this affect them bringing back Delonte?

[Roy H.]

yeah just on ainge, he can't resign ray, can't trade for mayo(twice, now and at the deadline), and don't forget couldn't resign tony a few years ago. don't think selling players on their future with the team and attracting FA is strong suit for ainge.

I still like him as the GM.

It's just we aren't willing able to pay usually

I think the Celtics would gladly outbid other teams in a lot of instances, if the cap rules allowed us to.  Unfortunately, they don't.

Hmmmm. Don't the Mavs have a Trade Exception from the Lamar Odom trade? If so they might have used that.

I think so. A sign and trade with Memphis, slotting into that TE, would be possible.

The trade would put them over the cap, which would also give Dallas back their MLE, no? They could use it to S&T Terry to Boston, although I would think they would want more than a collection of filler contracts in return. Again, the third team would be necessary.

It doesn't work that way. 

To exercise cap room, the Mavericks would have had to renounce both their trade exception and their MLE.  Once those are renounced, they don't come back.

I am pretty sure that I have seen teams under the cap also having a TE stemming from an earlier transaction months earlier.

It's a mistake in the reporting, then.  Teams can't both use cap space and have a trade exception.  Trade exceptions count against team salary; just like a free agent's cap hold, there is a cap hold in the amount of the trade exception.

Larry Coon concurs:

If a team is below the cap, then their Disabled Player, Bi-Annual, Mid-Level (either the Taxpayer or Non-Taxpayer Mid-Level, whichever applies to the team) and/or trade exceptions are added to their team salary, and the league treats the team as though they are over the cap1. This is to prevent a loophole, in a manner similar to free agent amounts (see question number 38). A team can't act like it's under the cap and sign free agents using cap room, and then use their Disabled Player, Bi-Annual, Mid-Level and/or trade exceptions. Consequently, the exceptions are added to their team salary (putting the team over the cap) if the team is under the cap and adding the exceptions puts them over the cap. If a team is already over the cap, then the exceptions are not added to their team salary. There would be no point in doing so, since there is no cap room for signing free agents.

http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q26

[CelticSooner]

@DLord_DBdotcom

Mavs had NO exceptions after Brand claim ...rules required they get under cap for claim (under cap = no exc's)

[btabakin]

Including cap holds, etc, the Mavericks only have $4 million in cap space currently. That would mean Mayo signed WAY BELOW his market value of $8-10 million per year. Thus it would seem there may be another move coming such as potentially a 3-team sign and trade involving Boston, Dallas and Memphis.

Terry goes to Boston. Some combination of draft picks, JJJ, Moore and Dooling to Memphis. And Mayo goes to Dallas

[Galeto]

I wonder if Dallas freed up the cap room to sign Mayo by renouncing Terry.  I hope not because I was hoping a sign and trade that would allow Ainge to offer Lee the MLE was still possible.

It's been reported that the Mavs already renounced their Bird rights on Terry. 

Was it really announced?  As late as a couple of days ago, there was still no news about any renouncement.  Dallas started free agency with a ton of cap space even with Terry's cap hold.  They didn't for instance need to renounce Terry to sign Kaman or win the bidding for Brand.  They would however need to renounce Terry in order to fit Mayo if it's not a sign and trade.

I'm not sure that renouncing Bird rights is something that is typically reported.

Dallas' current team salary is around $52.2 million, not counting cap holds / charges.  Jason Terry's $16+ million cap hold would put them way over the cap. 

Yeah, I'm not sure what's going on.  If you include Terry's cap hold after the amnesty of Haywood and trades of Odom and Azubuike, they had about 52 million of space.  It's possible that Terry hasn't been renounced if the signing of Kaman isn't official yet in the way that Terry and Green's aren't official.

Basically, if Terry hasn't been renounced, then the other way they can afford Mayo is signing and trading Terry for 5 million a year and freeing up 11 million of his cap hold.

[Kane3387]

yeah just on ainge, he can't resign ray, can't trade for mayo(twice, now and at the deadline), and don't forget couldn't resign tony a few years ago. don't think selling players on their future with the team and attracting FA is strong suit for ainge.

I still like him as the GM.

It's just we aren't willing able to pay usually

I think the Celtics would gladly outbid other teams in a lot of instances, if the cap rules allowed us to.  Unfortunately, they don't.

Hmmmm. Don't the Mavs have a Trade Exception from the Lamar Odom trade? If so they might have used that.

I think so. A sign and trade with Memphis, slotting into that TE, would be possible.

The trade would put them over the cap, which would also give Dallas back their MLE, no? They could use it to S&T Terry to Boston, although I would think they would want more than a collection of filler contracts in return. Again, the third team would be necessary.

It doesn't work that way. 

To exercise cap room, the Mavericks would have had to renounce both their trade exception and their MLE.  Once those are renounced, they don't come back.

I am pretty sure that I have seen teams under the cap also having a TE stemming from an earlier transaction months earlier.

It's a mistake in the reporting, then.  Teams can't both use cap space and have a trade exception.  Trade exceptions count against team salary; just like a free agent's cap hold, there is a cap hold in the amount of the trade exception.

Larry Coon concurs:

If a team is below the cap, then their Disabled Player, Bi-Annual, Mid-Level (either the Taxpayer or Non-Taxpayer Mid-Level, whichever applies to the team) and/or trade exceptions are added to their team salary, and the league treats the team as though they are over the cap1. This is to prevent a loophole, in a manner similar to free agent amounts (see question number 38). A team can't act like it's under the cap and sign free agents using cap room, and then use their Disabled Player, Bi-Annual, Mid-Level and/or trade exceptions. Consequently, the exceptions are added to their team salary (putting the team over the cap) if the team is under the cap and adding the exceptions puts them over the cap. If a team is already over the cap, then the exceptions are not added to their team salary. There would be no point in doing so, since there is no cap room for signing free agents.

http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q26

So Roy. Good stuff. Question though. What if Dallas did do a Sign and Trade that put them over the cap?

Hypothetial scenario:

Memphis S+T Mayo to Dallas with a salary starting at 6.5 mill. (This is 2.5 mill more then their cap room) and Dallas S+T a player, like Delonte for 2.5 mill, or even trades Vince (3 mill) in return to Memphis. Now Dallas is 2.5 mill over the cap with Mayo. Technically they never used up all their cap room in a signing because this was a trade. Do they now get the MLE and BAE?

[btabakin]

I wonder if Dallas freed up the cap room to sign Mayo by renouncing Terry.  I hope not because I was hoping a sign and trade that would allow Ainge to offer Lee the MLE was still possible.

It's been reported that the Mavs already renounced their Bird rights on Terry. 

Was it really announced?  As late as a couple of days ago, there was still no news about any renouncement.  Dallas started free agency with a ton of cap space even with Terry's cap hold.  They didn't for instance need to renounce Terry to sign Kaman or win the bidding for Brand.  They would however need to renounce Terry in order to fit Mayo if it's not a sign and trade.

I'm not sure that renouncing Bird rights is something that is typically reported.

Dallas' current team salary is around $52.2 million, not counting cap holds / charges.  Jason Terry's $16+ million cap hold would put them way over the cap. 

Yeah, I'm not sure what's going on.  If you include Terry's cap hold after the amnesty of Haywood and trades of Odom and Azubuike, they had about 52 million of space.  It's possible that Terry hasn't been renounced if the signing of Kaman isn't official yet in the way that Terry and Green's aren't official.

Basically, if Terry hasn't been renounced, then the other way they can afford Mayo is signing and trading Terry for 5 million a year and freeing up 11 million of his cap hold.

Dallas renounced Terry's bird rights but not Terry entirely. Not entirely sure but I believe that means there is still a cap hold

[KGs Knee]

Including cap holds, etc, the Mavericks only have $4 million in cap space currently. That would mean Mayo signed WAY BELOW his market value of $8-10 million per year. Thus it would seem there may be another move coming such as potentially a 3-team sign and trade involving Boston, Dallas and Memphis.

Terry goes to Boston. Some combination of draft picks, JJJ, Moore and Dooling to Memphis. And Mayo goes to Dallas

If we hope to get Terry without using the MLE, this is basically the last hope.  Let's hope!

[Roy H.]

Hypothetial scenario:

Memphis S+T Mayo to Dallas with a salary starting at 6.5 mill. (This is 2.5 mill more then their cap room) and Dallas S+T a player, like Delonte for 2.5 mill, or even trades Vince (3 mill) in return to Memphis. Now Dallas is 2.5 mill over the cap with Mayo. Technically they never used up all their cap room in a signing because this was a trade. Do they now get the MLE and BAE?

No, they don't get the MLE and/or BAE.  Once a team loses the MLE and/or BAE, it's gone for that season.

Dallas has a "room exception" of $2.575 million they can use, though.

[Roy H.]

I wonder if Dallas freed up the cap room to sign Mayo by renouncing Terry.  I hope not because I was hoping a sign and trade that would allow Ainge to offer Lee the MLE was still possible.

It's been reported that the Mavs already renounced their Bird rights on Terry. 

Was it really announced?  As late as a couple of days ago, there was still no news about any renouncement.  Dallas started free agency with a ton of cap space even with Terry's cap hold.  They didn't for instance need to renounce Terry to sign Kaman or win the bidding for Brand.  They would however need to renounce Terry in order to fit Mayo if it's not a sign and trade.

I'm not sure that renouncing Bird rights is something that is typically reported.

Dallas' current team salary is around $52.2 million, not counting cap holds / charges.  Jason Terry's $16+ million cap hold would put them way over the cap. 

Yeah, I'm not sure what's going on.  If you include Terry's cap hold after the amnesty of Haywood and trades of Odom and Azubuike, they had about 52 million of space.  It's possible that Terry hasn't been renounced if the signing of Kaman isn't official yet in the way that Terry and Green's aren't official.

Basically, if Terry hasn't been renounced, then the other way they can afford Mayo is signing and trading Terry for 5 million a year and freeing up 11 million of his cap hold.

Dallas renounced Terry's bird rights but not Terry entirely. Not entirely sure but I believe that means there is still a cap hold

"Renouncing Terry" and "Renouncing Terry's Bird rights" mean the same thing.  Or, more accurately, the latter is just the more accurate way of saying the former.

There's no cap hold for Terry.

[btabakin]

I wonder if Dallas freed up the cap room to sign Mayo by renouncing Terry.  I hope not because I was hoping a sign and trade that would allow Ainge to offer Lee the MLE was still possible.

It's been reported that the Mavs already renounced their Bird rights on Terry. 

Was it really announced?  As late as a couple of days ago, there was still no news about any renouncement.  Dallas started free agency with a ton of cap space even with Terry's cap hold.  They didn't for instance need to renounce Terry to sign Kaman or win the bidding for Brand.  They would however need to renounce Terry in order to fit Mayo if it's not a sign and trade.

I'm not sure that renouncing Bird rights is something that is typically reported.

Dallas' current team salary is around $52.2 million, not counting cap holds / charges.  Jason Terry's $16+ million cap hold would put them way over the cap. 

Yeah, I'm not sure what's going on.  If you include Terry's cap hold after the amnesty of Haywood and trades of Odom and Azubuike, they had about 52 million of space.  It's possible that Terry hasn't been renounced if the signing of Kaman isn't official yet in the way that Terry and Green's aren't official.

Basically, if Terry hasn't been renounced, then the other way they can afford Mayo is signing and trading Terry for 5 million a year and freeing up 11 million of his cap hold.

Dallas renounced Terry's bird rights but not Terry entirely. Not entirely sure but I believe that means there is still a cap hold

"Renouncing Terry" and "Renouncing Terry's Bird rights" mean the same thing.  Or, more accurately, the latter is just the more accurate way of saying the former.

There's no cap hold for Terry.

Are you sure? I'm pretty sure I read that there was a subtle yet important difference.

[Roy H.]

I wonder if Dallas freed up the cap room to sign Mayo by renouncing Terry.  I hope not because I was hoping a sign and trade that would allow Ainge to offer Lee the MLE was still possible.

It's been reported that the Mavs already renounced their Bird rights on Terry.  

Was it really announced?  As late as a couple of days ago, there was still no news about any renouncement.  Dallas started free agency with a ton of cap space even with Terry's cap hold.  They didn't for instance need to renounce Terry to sign Kaman or win the bidding for Brand.  They would however need to renounce Terry in order to fit Mayo if it's not a sign and trade.

I'm not sure that renouncing Bird rights is something that is typically reported.

Dallas' current team salary is around $52.2 million, not counting cap holds / charges.  Jason Terry's $16+ million cap hold would put them way over the cap.  

Yeah, I'm not sure what's going on.  If you include Terry's cap hold after the amnesty of Haywood and trades of Odom and Azubuike, they had about 52 million of space.  It's possible that Terry hasn't been renounced if the signing of Kaman isn't official yet in the way that Terry and Green's aren't official.

Basically, if Terry hasn't been renounced, then the other way they can afford Mayo is signing and trading Terry for 5 million a year and freeing up 11 million of his cap hold.

Dallas renounced Terry's bird rights but not Terry entirely. Not entirely sure but I believe that means there is still a cap hold

"Renouncing Terry" and "Renouncing Terry's Bird rights" mean the same thing.  Or, more accurately, the latter is just the more accurate way of saying the former.

There's no cap hold for Terry.

Are you sure? I'm pretty sure I read that there was a subtle yet important difference.

Yes, I'm 100% sure.  

Even after a player is renounced -- meaning his Bird rights, Early Bird rights, non-Bird rights, etc. are renounced -- the team can still sign him, and may still sign-and-trade him.  They just need cap room to do so.

[Django]

Interesting...

Honestly...I thought the Bulls would have been PERFECT for him.

Glad he didnt go there...

[btabakin]

I wonder if Dallas freed up the cap room to sign Mayo by renouncing Terry.  I hope not because I was hoping a sign and trade that would allow Ainge to offer Lee the MLE was still possible.

It's been reported that the Mavs already renounced their Bird rights on Terry. 

Was it really announced?  As late as a couple of days ago, there was still no news about any renouncement.  Dallas started free agency with a ton of cap space even with Terry's cap hold.  They didn't for instance need to renounce Terry to sign Kaman or win the bidding for Brand.  They would however need to renounce Terry in order to fit Mayo if it's not a sign and trade.

I'm not sure that renouncing Bird rights is something that is typically reported.

Dallas' current team salary is around $52.2 million, not counting cap holds / charges.  Jason Terry's $16+ million cap hold would put them way over the cap. 

Yeah, I'm not sure what's going on.  If you include Terry's cap hold after the amnesty of Haywood and trades of Odom and Azubuike, they had about 52 million of space.  It's possible that Terry hasn't been renounced if the signing of Kaman isn't official yet in the way that Terry and Green's aren't official.

Basically, if Terry hasn't been renounced, then the other way they can afford Mayo is signing and trading Terry for 5 million a year and freeing up 11 million of his cap hold.

Dallas renounced Terry's bird rights but not Terry entirely. Not entirely sure but I believe that means there is still a cap hold

"Renouncing Terry" and "Renouncing Terry's Bird rights" mean the same thing.  Or, more accurately, the latter is just the more accurate way of saying the former.

There's no cap hold for Terry.

Are you sure? I'm pretty sure I read that there was a subtle yet important difference.

Yes, I'm 100% sure. 

K. However, if my math is correct, even by renouncing Terry's rights the Mavericks only have roughly 4 million in cap space which is not enough to sign Mayo with.

[Kane3387]

If Terry had to settle for the rest of Dallas Cap Space to do a S+T then I don't see it happening. I can't see him taking 4 mill after he agreed to 5 mill. It looks like OJ took a paycut or Memphis is getting something from Dallas.