The Bradley 20-8 Run was overrated

[GreenFaith1819]

Another thing with Game 15 Post ASB -

Yes, AB has 23 pts, but Stiem also had 10 pts and 7 rebs - significantly above his avg.

Bass blocked 3 shots - his season avg prior to that was 0.7 blocks.

BOS's winning margin was only 12 - take away Bass' blks and Stiem's above avg game - do we win?

[CelticsFanNC]

  Looking at box scores is kind of a bogus way to judge these kind of things but I will play along.

  During that stretch of games Rajon Rondo was consistently GREAT night in and night out and that was at least partially due to Bradley's young legs being in place of Ray Allen's old legs.  Rondo plays so much better when he has a running mate as we all saw last season.  This team goes as Rondo goes.  Why you ask?  Because we NEED easy baskets to compete with the best teams in the NBA.  We didn't get many easy baskets when we were starting four old guys along with Rondo but just as soon as some younger legs were put into the mix we started getting to loose balls, getting out into the open court, getting easy baskets and winning games consistently.

  Is that all due to Bradley?  No but he played a big hand in it with his ball pressure and his ability to get out in front of Rondo.  Making Rondo walk the ball up the court and wait on Ray Allen to clear a bunch of picks is taking away our best players(Rondo) deadliest weapon.  Rondo is a special player in the open court and he wasn't getting there much starting alongside of Ray.

  It's not a slight on Ray.  It is what it is.  We need more speed and quickness to allow Rondo to truly thrive and Ray doesn't bring that to the table at his advanced age.

[Fafnir]

Ianboyextreme, Mctyson - you both are picking and choosing, unfortunately.

Even with the games you both chose, AB has bad games...Stiem has a few great games...KG continues his tear, etc, etc, etc....

It's just NOT about AB...Look, I absolutely LOVE the kid...but BOS's just not about one player.........

During those games that each of you pick, pls look at the OTHER players' contributions....not just AB.

I don't think anyone ever said that Avery Bradley scored all of the points or was the only guy who played well.

[GreenFaith1819]

Ianboyextreme, Mctyson - you both are picking and choosing, unfortunately.

Even with the games you both chose, AB has bad games...Stiem has a few great games...KG continues his tear, etc, etc, etc....

It's just NOT about AB...Look, I absolutely LOVE the kid...but BOS's just not about one player.........

During those games that each of you pick, pls look at the OTHER players' contributions....not just AB.

I don't think anyone ever said that Avery Bradley scored all of the points or was the only guy who played well.

But isn't the gist of the thread to attempt to show posters that there was no "clear-cut" player that started BOS's run? Or for that matter, a particular game?

I just believe that BOS's run started right after the ASB.

With that being said - I personally believe that Avery Bradley is "right-rated" as a player. I know there is no such word, but for the time being he has rcvd recognition from Wade and rcvd Defensive team votes.

The purpose of my posts (and others here) are to point out that there were significant contributions from other players post ASB - not just AB.

[Smitty77]

GreenFaith,

Great information.  However, how are stats from a game at the end of the season at Atlanta relevenat at all when Bradley was the ONLY starter starting vs. a Hawk team playing their starters.  About all those games at the end of the season are irrelevant when we were not playing our starters in terms of our won/lost record.

Peace,

Smitty77

[Celtics4ever]

A W is a W!   It was real, it happened.   I don't think he is all world but he is servicable.   I think he improved vastly once Doc learned he was not a PG>

[GreenFaith1819]

GreenFaith,

Great information.  However, how are stats from a game at the end of the season at Atlanta relevenat at all when Bradley was the ONLY starter starting vs. a Hawk team playing their starters.  About all those games at the end of the season are irrelevant when we were not playing our starters in terms of our won/lost record.

Peace,

Smitty77

Great Point - but I included those games, too. I wanted to, in order to get a complete picture.

Notice that I didn't really focus on those games, much - my writeup for them was small.

Even if I took away the games where starters rested, then that would paint an even hazier picture of AB's contributions.

I think from beginning of March til end of Apr, Rondo and perhaps KG were our most consistent starters. Out of those two, KG gets my MVP - how many of us expected 36 y/o KG to put up the numbers he did?

During that same time period, Rondo had such a patchwork lineup to work with that seemingly no player played the same position or at the same time on the floor.

Don't forget that KG's move to C buoyed that run, too.

Doc Rivers is a genius coach. If anyone is under-rated in the NBA, it's him.

[CelticsFanNC]

  The Celtic's go as Rondo goes and Rondo goes a whole lot better when he has a running mate.   Ray Allen for all of his greatness as a shooter cannot fill that role as Rondo's running mate at his age.  It is as simple as that.

  Doc and Danny seem to have realized this.  Early last season when we were starting four old guys and Rondo we were wasting our best asset because we weren't getting into the open court. 

[mctyson]

Ianboyextreme, Mctyson - you both are picking and choosing, unfortunately.

Even with the games you both chose, AB has bad games...Stiem has a few great games...KG continues his tear, etc, etc, etc....

It's just NOT about AB...Look, I absolutely LOVE the kid...but BOS's just not about one player.........

During those games that each of you pick, pls look at the OTHER players' contributions....not just AB.

I am decidedly not picking or choosing anything. 

Anyone who watched last season knows that the team played differently when AB was starting and getting 30 minutes a game.  I am not talking about his stats. I am not talking about his individual contribution. I am talking about the team performance.

And I am stating facts.  The Celtics had a 70%+ winning percentage with him in the starting lineup.  You cannot dispute that.

[cman88]

Looking at this soley from ppg is missing the point...bradleys offense was a plus but it wasn't what helped turn this team around.

It was his defense which allowed him to take the opposing teams besylt wing allowing rondo to gamble and kg to not need to help out as much.

There were other factors that played imto our run. But bradley was a huge part of it

We were the best defensive team in the league with him starting

Plus I'm not so surewhy everyone is so eager/expecting a 21yo player to regresa..
chances are he will only improve...kids got a great work ethic

[nickagneta]

As I said earlier, there is nothing over rated about what the Celtics did collectively or what Avery Bradley did individually after the All Star Game. The Celtics collectively and Bradley individually tremendously improved their game against some seriously stiff competition.

Ray was hurt and Bradley gave the team a defensive spark Ray has never given the starting unit in all his time here. Bradley was assigned the toughest backcourt opponent which freed Rondo from having to do it. Ray could never do this. This led to a defensive efficiency of 86PP100 that this defense has never performed, even during their run in 2007-08 when most of these players were much younger and more spry.

I love Ray and what he did for this team and wish he were still here, but lets not play revisionist history here. Ray was hurt and Bradley stepped in and did what Ray never could or did for this team, he provided a defensive spark that got contagious and made the entire starting team a better unit. For last year, he was a better FIT. And in a game where you have to sacrifice individual play for the betterment of the team sometimes you need the better FIT not the better PLAYER.

And that people is my 20000th post

[celtics2]

I don't care who we beat or how when Bradley was instrumental in those wins, he showed what he is capable of. He is a great harasser of the ball and can hit the shots. His scoring, defense and enthusiasm gave the Team what it needed. We went from Turtle to the Rabbit when he was on the floor. Ray Allen was pacing himself and got boring infecting the team. Good Riddance!! He may have hit the wall after 40 games. I expect him to come back strong.

[Fafnir]

Ianboyextreme, Mctyson - you both are picking and choosing, unfortunately.

Even with the games you both chose, AB has bad games...Stiem has a few great games...KG continues his tear, etc, etc, etc....

It's just NOT about AB...Look, I absolutely LOVE the kid...but BOS's just not about one player.........

During those games that each of you pick, pls look at the OTHER players' contributions....not just AB.

I don't think anyone ever said that Avery Bradley scored all of the points or was the only guy who played well.

But isn't the gist of the thread to attempt to show posters that there was no "clear-cut" player that started BOS's run? Or for that matter, a particular game?

I just believe that BOS's run started right after the ASB.

With that being said - I personally believe that Avery Bradley is "right-rated" as a player. I know there is no such word, but for the time being he has rcvd recognition from Wade and rcvd Defensive team votes.

The purpose of my posts (and others here) are to point out that there were significant contributions from other players post ASB - not just AB.

No the purpose of this thread was to tear down Bradley from a poster who is a huge Ray Allen fan to the point where the backlash has bothered him (and has posted about that fact a couple of times).

If you want to pump up what the rest of the team did post ASB I'm all for it, but that's not what this thread was ever about.

[screwedupmaniac]

All I know is Ray looked fugly rolling off picks this year...if he can't roll of picks quickly and lose defenders, then I really don't see his worth to the future of this team. I miss him too, but I think we're better off being forced into a position to get younger on the wing.

[rayallen1934]

Ianboyextreme, Mctyson - you both are picking and choosing, unfortunately.

Even with the games you both chose, AB has bad games...Stiem has a few great games...KG continues his tear, etc, etc, etc....

It's just NOT about AB...Look, I absolutely LOVE the kid...but BOS's just not about one player.........

During those games that each of you pick, pls look at the OTHER players' contributions....not just AB.

I don't think anyone ever said that Avery Bradley scored all of the points or was the only guy who played well.

But isn't the gist of the thread to attempt to show posters that there was no "clear-cut" player that started BOS's run? Or for that matter, a particular game?

I just believe that BOS's run started right after the ASB.

With that being said - I personally believe that Avery Bradley is "right-rated" as a player. I know there is no such word, but for the time being he has rcvd recognition from Wade and rcvd Defensive team votes.

The purpose of my posts (and others here) are to point out that there were significant contributions from other players post ASB - not just AB.

No the purpose of this thread was to tear down Bradley from a poster who is a huge Ray Allen fan to the point where the backlash has bothered him (and has posted about that fact a couple of times).

If you want to pump up what the rest of the team did post ASB I'm all for it, but that's not what this thread was ever about.

The purpose was to make a fair assesment of Bradley

you get tired of seeing people that think players like Moore deserve to be playing 30 minutes of game time...

as sad as it is, this is the case in celticsblog.

Ludicrous things like that.