Author Topic: Nicholson Vs Quincy Miller  (Read 10978 times)

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Nicholson Vs Quincy Miller
« on: June 13, 2012, 10:23:10 PM »

Offline arambone

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I wrote a long post about this last night, but it got erased.

I'll try to make it quick.

Physically, they are quite similar. Just shy of 6'9" without shoes, long arms, similar standing reaches. Nicholson is 235 pounds to QMiller's 220. Nicholson should be a steady 245-250 pounds within the next 2 years. Miller should get to 235 within 2 years, great weight for a 3, and acceptable for a stretch 4.

Miller is 19. Nicholson is 22.

Both players have upside, because Nicholson's only been playing 6 years, and his outside shooting was a revelation this year. QMiller has major upside, because of his young age, injury-limited freshman year, and a physique that is now starting to fill out.

Miller has better versatility, in that he projects to an above average offensive player and competent defender at both the 3 and the 4. Nicholson is strictly a 4.

Miller is the better athlete, the better ball handler, possibly a better passer, and the better player in transition, both offensively and defensively.

Nicholson, as of now, is stronger, the more polished post scorer, the better outside shooter, the better post defender, and the more mentally consistent scorer in general.

At the Combine, Nicholson looked like he hadn't lifted weights since last offseason. He came into last season at around 245, but gradually lost 10 pounds over the season. With consistent strength training in the offseason AND during the season, Nicholson should be able to stay close to 245 going forward.

Nicholson is probably more intelligent, definitely more mature, and more ready to contribute immediately. I think he will always have problems guarding other stretch 4s on the perimeter, because of his lack of athleticism. He will also have his share of difficulties defending down low, but those will be less of an issue as he gets more experience in the weight room. However, he will still get beat by his share of quick moves from the post.

Miller will also struggle defending deep in the post, even when he gets up to 235 pounds. But he will be a better perimeter defender against stretch 4's, and better as a transition defender because of his (recovering) athleticism. Even playing post defense, QMiller should be able to better track quick lateral moves by PFs than Nicholson.

Nicholson is the safer pick, is more ready to contribute, and may end up as the better player long-term.

Quincy Miller projects as better at creating his own shot as either a 3 or a 4, because of his better athleticism, clever ball handling, use of pump fakes, and long pivot steps to get his shot off. His post game isn't as finely honed as Nicholson's, but he has an obvious talent for it, and got some good experience at PF this year against top college competition all year.

As smooth as Nicholson's post game is, I think he is going to have a difficult time getting his shot off down low against most NBA PFs. He should still end up as a great spot up shooter from even NBA range, but he'll have a hard time taking NBA PFs off the dribble because of his sub-par athleticism.

As ManUp just pointed out in another thread, the Celtics may have a logjam at PF next year. Wilcox, Bass, Williams, Johnson, Garnett, and possibly Jeff Green, who I'd rank as Bass' equal or better as a PF, even though Green is more of a SF.

With such a logjam at the four (assuming most or all of these guys return), we have little need for an instant contribution from Nicholson.

Because QMiller should be a passable defender at the 3, and because his versatility as a scorer could make him the long-term replacement to Paul Pierce, I can see an argument for taking Miller instead of Nicholson as one of our 2 first rounders. Miller may be able to find a niche getting some minutes at the 3 as a rookie behind Pierce and Green, if Green comes back.

Pierce would be an ideal mentor for Miller, whether or not Miller remains a 3 for the rest of his career. Miller has some of the same herky-jerky scoring style as Pierce, and Miller could also take his lessons from Pierce and apply them as a stretch four down the road.

If Miller had gone back to Baylor with his healed knee and 15-20 more pounds of muscle (he's already put on 10, so not a stretch at all), I think he might have had a better sophomore season than PJ3 had this year, and gone top 5 in next year's draft Miller was the higher ranked player in high school. Food for thought.

Nicholson vs Miller is a very tough question in my opinion, even as Nicholson's stock is apparently rising and Miller's apparently falling.

For the long-term future of the Celtics, Miller may be the better pick for the Celtics, even if he washes out as a SF because of foot speed on defense.

Can't wait to hear about Miller's defense against other 3s in workouts, and can't wait to get a better idea of what our roster is going to look like at the PF position next year.

Miller + a center would be perfectly acceptable to me, especially if we have a glut at 4 next year.

Here's video of each.

Imagine these same moves with 20 more pounds of muscle, which is what Miller will have by his second season in the NBA. The NBA is more spread out than college, meaning Miller will have more room to break down his man and hit the open teammate when the double team comes:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AhnOApGV3QM

Here's what Miller looks like with the added 10 pounds and a better knee. Still just a baby in development terms:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HZdq6lodXpk
QMiller, Combine chatter
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HKJvXmIpmek
Here's Nicholson's post season brilliance:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NAQ9ZqcYFKI&feature=related

And Combine chatter:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsy6EJoFZbk&feature=related
« Last Edit: June 13, 2012, 10:29:08 PM by arambone »

Re: Nicholson Vs Quincy Miller
« Reply #1 on: June 13, 2012, 10:31:00 PM »

Offline BleedGreen1989

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Quincy miller please, not a big fan of Nicholson for this team
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Re: Nicholson Vs Quincy Miller
« Reply #2 on: June 13, 2012, 10:32:02 PM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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I hope we get guys other than these two.  There are a lot better out there than these two...

Re: Nicholson Vs Quincy Miller
« Reply #3 on: June 13, 2012, 10:33:12 PM »

Offline The One

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The more I see and read of Miller, the more I like him.  It might be blasphemous but could he be a facsimile of Durant.

We need some crazy offense up in here!


Re: Nicholson Vs Quincy Miller
« Reply #4 on: June 13, 2012, 10:37:48 PM »

Offline Change

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Quincy miller please, not a big fan of Nicholson for this team

I don't understand Nicholson phenomena either. 2 for Quincy Miller

Re: Nicholson Vs Quincy Miller
« Reply #5 on: June 13, 2012, 10:42:06 PM »

Offline arambone

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Re: Nicholson Vs Quincy Miller
« Reply #6 on: June 13, 2012, 10:47:39 PM »

Offline EDWARDO

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Re: Nicholson Vs Quincy Miller
« Reply #7 on: June 13, 2012, 10:47:51 PM »

Offline Evantime34

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I think they both could be picked. From where we are positioned with the players available at 21 or 22 I see us drafting a 4 and a 5 or a 3. I see us picking from two groups:
1. Moe Harkless, Quincy Miller, Fab Melo
2. Andrew Nicholson, Royce White
DKC:  Rockets
CB Draft: Memphis Grizz
Players: Klay Thompson, Jabari Parker, Aaron Gordon
Next 3 picks: 4.14, 4.15, 4.19

Re: Nicholson Vs Quincy Miller
« Reply #8 on: June 13, 2012, 10:57:36 PM »

Offline Yoki_IsTheName

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We pick these guys, JJJ gets pushed to the end of the bench more. SMH.

Pick a Center and a wing.
2019 CStrong Historical Draft 2000s OKC Thunder.
PG: Jrue Holiday / Isaiah Thomas / Larry Hughes
SG: Paul George / Aaron McKie / Bradley Beal
SF: Paul Pierce / Tayshaun Prince / Brian Scalabrine
PF: LaMarcus Aldridge / Shareef Abdur-Raheem / Ben Simmons
C: Jermaine O'neal / Ben Wallace

Re: Nicholson Vs Quincy Miller
« Reply #9 on: June 13, 2012, 11:14:52 PM »

Offline hwangjini_1

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boy. miller has almost NO lift when he shoots. i doubt he even get 12 inches off the ground.

since he is 6'9" he can shoot over people in college. in the nba, i am not so sure.

of the two based upon the videos, nicholson seems better...not great, just better.
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Re: Nicholson Vs Quincy Miller
« Reply #10 on: June 13, 2012, 11:17:02 PM »

Offline arambone

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Quincy Miller is currently a 3, and I suggested we also draft a center. Or check out the post at the top that I wrote.

But now that you mention it, we don't know what JJJ is looking like right now either.

Either way, Miller would mostly be a 3. Maybe take Pietrus' place.

SMH

Re: Nicholson Vs Quincy Miller
« Reply #11 on: June 13, 2012, 11:28:16 PM »

Offline Atzar

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We pick these guys, JJJ gets pushed to the end of the bench more. SMH.

Pick a Center and a wing.

So what?  If a couple of rookies eat JJJ's playing time, then that means he's not worth playing.  Let him prove that he's good enough to see the court.  

As for the topic, I'd take Miller over Nicholson every time.  Miller has tremendous upside and showed himself at the combine to be a better athlete than previously thought.  

If he's there at our picks, hallelujah, grab him.

Re: Nicholson Vs Quincy Miller
« Reply #12 on: June 13, 2012, 11:38:45 PM »

Offline clover

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We pick these guys, JJJ gets pushed to the end of the bench more. SMH.

Pick a Center and a wing.

So what?  If a couple of rookies eat JJJ's playing time, then that means he's not worth playing.  Let him prove that he's good enough to see the court.  

As for the topic, I'd take Miller over Nicholson every time.  Miller has tremendous upside and showed himself at the combine to be a better athlete than previously thought.  

If he's there at our picks, hallelujah, grab him.

Of course, for where the C's pick now if both players are there  they can take them both.

But Miller seems so much like where Bradley was two years ago: a high potential one-year player who probably hasn't shown his best and who'll drop some because of the effects of injury.

Except he plays the 3.  Perfect.

Re: Nicholson Vs Quincy Miller
« Reply #13 on: June 13, 2012, 11:44:11 PM »

Offline ManUp

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To be honest, Miller  has slowly become my draft binky. I love the type of potential he represents. My main concerns are with his speed and quickness more specifically his ability to guard small forwards. If he has enough quickness to stay with his man his height and length will make him a very capable defender. If Danny doesn't select him I'll understand, but if he does I'll be ecstatic.

Note:He definitely has to change his shot a little bit, but it looks like he has in the combine videos.

Re: Nicholson Vs Quincy Miller
« Reply #14 on: June 13, 2012, 11:51:08 PM »

Offline Atzar

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Of course, for where the C's pick now if both players are there  they can take them both.

But Miller seems so much like where Bradley was two years ago: a high potential one-year player who probably hasn't shown his best and who'll drop some because of the effects of injury.

Except he plays the 3.  Perfect.

I'd rather grab a big with the other pick, if a decent one is available.  But I definitely agree with you on Miller.  

Also, I think it's worth noting that Pierce may be the perfect mentor for Miller.  Neither one is really a guy who can consistently outquick his man to get an open look, so they have to do it with footwork and craftiness instead.