PP's role on the team and our starting guards' value

[LeoMoreno]

Those nights when you just can't sleep after watching a game we lose and think what went wrong. Happened a lot after Miami debacle last year, but not once this season until the recent Knicks loss. I was wondering about Pierce and his play in general.

The side of Pierce that everyone loves is that he's there when we need him (but it goes unnoted that he misses more game winners/tiers than he makes...) and you can always count on him if the team isn't working. But that makes me remember the other games this season that we won with Pierce scoring barely over 10 points. He always gets some 6 assists, takes a few shots and that's it. It really makes me wonder if the only time Pierce can score and is willing to play is when the whole team is down. Because if that's the issue, we're in deep trouble. This team is pass-first, it's not built for 1-man-team and that can bring the whole team chemistry down, affecting not only offense but defensive side as well.

I can see the bad and the good side here, so I am posting this to see more opinions... However, there's another thing that bugs me so much: WHY THE HELL DOES ANYONE WANT TO TRADE RONDO AND BRADLEY?!

Offensively they run and gun. One drives, the other shoots, or both drive and both shoot (Rondo does drop a lot more than in previous years). They're incredibly fast and possess mesmerising quickness.

Defensively they're even a better duo: One takes care of the better guard on the team while the other lurks around deflecting passes, stealing the ball and breaking up the plays. They are both steal artists, they both play great 1 on 1 and they both run great fast-breaks. THEY ARE BOTH EXTREMELY YOUNG AND EXTREMELY ATHLETIC, starting guards solution for the next 5 years!

Why on Earth would anyone want to trade such an incredible duo whose skills are yet far from the second floor of the Nakatomi skyscraper? Here, unlike from Pierce's role, I see only one side. Help me understand this sudden urge for trading them...

[thestackshow]

Its because people have pipe dreams and think they are a real GM.

People around here seem to view Stephen Curry as some godlike superstar thats a top 5 player and they view Rondo as a glorified role-player thats not even a top 10 point guard because he cant shoot consitently.

The internet is the internet, in the end it doesent matter what we think, Danny is in control, and he would laugh at some of these suggestions.

Earlier in the year people wanted Rondo traded for Nick Collison and some picks, now they want to get Derek Jeter for Bradley.

I remember a fanpost saying "We should trade Rondo for Lin, but Lin is so much better NY would turn it down"

Borderline trolling if you ask me.

Charles Barkley said it best. "Fans are stupid and dont know a clue about basketball." I agree with him.

The Golden State Warriors are a perfect example of how a team would turn out if they were run by fans.

Keep trading away and getting rid of every talented player you ever have, and still never make the playoffs.

[OmarSekou]

The side of Pierce that everyone loves is that he's there when we need him (but it goes unnoted that he misses more game winners/tiers than he makes...) and you can always count on him if the team isn't working. But that makes me remember the other games this season that we won with Pierce scoring barely over 10 points. He always gets some 6 assists, takes a few shots and that's it. It really makes me wonder if the only time Pierce can score and is willing to play is when the whole team is down. Because if that's the issue, we're in deep trouble. This team is pass-first, it's not built for 1-man-team and that can bring the whole team chemistry down, affecting not only offense but defensive side as well.

You're arguing against yourself here. You're saying that PP can take over games when others are struggling and seamlessly blend in when they aren't. That sounds like he can be Melo-lite or Luol Deng-lite depending on what we need, the best of both worlds. He's been playing great recently.

As far as trading our guards...I have no clue. My guess is that some people have a logic that goes like this: "Rondo/Bradley's playing really well. He might become better than (insert proven star whose more accomplished). I wonder if (star's team) would make that trade."

There seems to be some bizarre trade logic that teams will trade away their best players because our guys have shown some potential. That logic is supported by the fact that historically a lot of franchises have made dumb trades that we've benefited from (the most recent being KG).

The other thing that happens is that people look for negatives. Our guys flaws are more obvious because we see them every night, and we talk ourselves into the fact that other guys are better than they really are.

[Senninsage]

The side of Pierce that everyone loves is that he's there when we need him (but it goes unnoted that he misses more game winners/tiers than he makes...) and you can always count on him if the team isn't working. But that makes me remember the other games this season that we won with Pierce scoring barely over 10 points. He always gets some 6 assists, takes a few shots and that's it. It really makes me wonder if the only time Pierce can score and is willing to play is when the whole team is down. Because if that's the issue, we're in deep trouble. This team is pass-first, it's not built for 1-man-team and that can bring the whole team chemistry down, affecting not only offense but defensive side as well.

You're arguing against yourself here. You're saying that PP can take over games when others are struggling and seamlessly blend in when they aren't. That sounds like he can be Melo-lite or Luol Deng-lite depending on what we need, the best of both worlds. He's been playing great recently.

As far as trading our guards...I have no clue. My guess is that some people have a logic that goes like this: "Rondo/Bradley's playing really well. He might become better than (insert proven star whose more accomplished). I wonder if (star's team) would make that trade."

There seems to be some bizarre trade logic that teams will trade away their best players because our guys have shown some potential. That logic is supported by the fact that historically a lot of franchises have made dumb trades that we've benefited from (the most recent being KG).

The other thing that happens is that people look for negatives. Our guys flaws are more obvious because we see them every night, and we talk ourselves into the fact that other guys are better than they really are.

Fantastic analysis. I agree with pretty much everything you said. We see our guys' flaws almost every night, so there's a tendency for us, on a much smaller sample size, make assumptions about how much better other players might be than our own guys without having the same extended experience of seeing them in action and watching them make mistakes so we can get a better idea for the flaws that might be present in their own game.

Another thing that I feel a lot of fans don't put enough of a premium on is simply smart play. Playing the game the right way. You can have all the scoring and athletic talent in the world, but if you aren't playing the game the right way that's something that naturally decreases a player's value. A lot of our guys, for what they may lack in any number of areas, it's arguable, more than make up for their deficiencies by being much smarter players. And at the end of the day, I tend to think that it's those players who are smarter and know how to play the game the right way that usually carry the day over the more gifted and flashy offensive players. It's what makes the Celtics such a dangerous wild card. They have very talented players who are also proven to be true students of the game in the biggest possible games and pressure situations.

That's not something you just trade away. I admit that earlier in the season I was more open to this idea, but now that I have a better idea of what's what, I'm no longer so in favor of that. Bradley and Rondo should remain on this team. Brdley's improvements are incredible. His confidence next season will be unbelievable.

Jeff Green, if his shot with the Celtics wasn't stolen from him at the start of this season, would have a lot of people singing a vastly different tune about his game right now, too.