Author Topic: Paul Pierce is the most Underrated Player Ever  (Read 19634 times)

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Paul Pierce is the most Underrated Player Ever
« on: February 09, 2012, 05:52:49 PM »

Offline OsirusCeltics

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Paul Pierce just recently was moved to 2nd all time in points scored on the Boston Celtics, and theres been a discussion on his place in Celtic history, and even NBA history. Pierce is an extremely underrated player. And a Top 3 Celtic in my opinion. He doesn't get the respect he deserves

Here are my reasons why I think he is underrated


1) When I see the list of the all time great Celtic players, there is an aura about them. All the Championships they won, and all the glory attached to it. But when I really look at it most of the players that are regarded as the Top 5 Celtics players, they are not better than Paul Pierce. The only players I put above Pierce are Russell and Bird

-Bob Cousy
Besides passing/assists, Paul Pierce is better than Cousy at ever facet of the game. Pierce is better at scoring, defense, rebounding, creating his own shot. Theres no doubt Cousy's legend is bigger that Pierce's, but not his game

-Kevin Mchale
 As far as skill, they are about equal. But Pierce is a better leader and a better scorer

-John Havlicek
He has incredible basketball IQ, and I feel he is a more smarter and patient scorer. But he got most of his points off of the Celtics system offense, and understanding where to be at certain times. Pierce is a better overall scorer, can run the offense better, and can create his own shot. He's also a better passer, and a better defender than Havlicek



2)Most of NBA awards are popularity contests

-The other knock on Paul Pierce is his lack of individual awards. Well honestly, NBA awards are based of off whos the most commercially viable. You look at Kobe Bryant, who has had loads of hardware. He is not a better defender than Paul Pierce. But yet he gets 1st team all defense because of his name and fame as a player. Its almost comical he would win those awards when at that time, Bruce Bowen, Ron Artest, and Shane Battier were clearly better perimeter defenders than Kobe

-Regular season MVPs are kind of like a mixed bag. Its all a function of team success. If your team is number 1 or 2 in your conference, you're basically a shoe in. And lets not forget how horrible Paul Pierce's teams have been in his earlier years. I wish I could see the a lot of great players be on a team where you're the only great player. Even Jordan before he won his titles missed the playoffs because of the people around him. The MVP is basically being the best player on the best team. And for Pierce he only had about 4 years of being on one of the best teams in the NBA, which limited his opportunities to win one


3) Paul Pierce doesn't have that “WOW” factor. When he makes his moves, they aren't really jump off your seat type scoring. He's efficient, patient, utilizes footwork, doesn't run fast, doesn't jump out the gym, etc. Also his personality isn't really that outgoing, sort of polarizing. He isn't a recluse, but he's not the life of the party either. And I think he doesn't draw a lot of fans to him. I don't think I ever seen a huge commercial explicitly for Paul Pierce (if anyone knows, please let me know). Its the popular players that get most of the recognition for being great. In that 2008 championship year, Paul outplayed both MVPs Lebron and Kobe to win the title. He should also be in the discussion of one of the greatest wing players of his generation
« Last Edit: February 09, 2012, 06:17:09 PM by OsirusCeltics »

Re: Paul Pierce is the most Underrated Player Ever
« Reply #1 on: February 09, 2012, 06:03:00 PM »

Online Roy H.

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Did you watch Havlicek play?  I'm surprised you'd call him an inferior defender to Pierce.  That's just not true.  Pierce spent long periods of his career being indifferent on defense, while Havlicek made the All-Defense team seven times.  Similarly, what are your claims that Pierce was a better passer based upon?

Havlicek was a better player than Pierce, especially as compared to his peers.  Hondo made first- or second-team All-NBA 11 times (!!).  Pierce has done that once (and has made the third team three other times).  Pierce has never been all-defense.  He's won one title, compared to Hondo's eight.  Hondo was top-10 in scoring six times, and top-10 in assists on seven occasions.  Pierce was top-10 in scoring five times, but was never top-10 in assists or rebounding.  

Pierce may be underrated, but the proper response to that isn't to overrate him, exaggerating his place in team history.  Pierce is, and always will be, firmly behind Hondo.



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Re: Paul Pierce is the most Underrated Player Ever
« Reply #2 on: February 09, 2012, 06:08:51 PM »

Offline syfy9

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I agree that he is underrated, but he's only at most a top 5.

I think McHale had the more overall skill sets and moves than Pierce, Larry, or Jordan. Pierce is not McHale's equal. You can argue that about Larry, but McHale was ridiculously skilled. Get the ball to McHale, he'll make it most of the time. Pierce, on the other hand, won't. A lot of it has to do with position, however McHale is still arguably a top 2, maybe 3 post player of all time.

Havlicek, I believe is also better than Pierce. You can't knock his scoring game because of the Celtics system. He's 1st all time in Celtics scoring for a reason. Havlicek was at least an equal on defense in par with Pierce, though I admit Pierce is a better floor general. Havlicek, though, is a lot better of a leader - He led 2 or 3 titles without Russell...

That said, Pierce is still amazing, and deserves top 5 recognition.
I like Marcus Smart

Re: Paul Pierce is the most Underrated Player Ever
« Reply #3 on: February 09, 2012, 06:11:23 PM »

Offline Who

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Pierce = Top 10 SF All-Time?

Re: Paul Pierce is the most Underrated Player Ever
« Reply #4 on: February 09, 2012, 06:27:57 PM »

Online Roy H.

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Pierce = Top 10 SF All-Time?

Hmm...  I would say he's right on the cusp.  A few of these guys played multiple positions, but off the top of my head, here are Pierce's competitors:

Guys who are clearly better:  Bird, Pippen, Dr. J, Baylor, Hondo

Guys who might be better:  Worthy, Dominique, Barry, King, English

Younger guys who will / could pass him:  Lebron, Durant, Carmelo

 


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Re: Paul Pierce is the most Underrated Player Ever
« Reply #5 on: February 09, 2012, 06:37:52 PM »

Offline OsirusCeltics

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Pierce = Top 10 SF All-Time?

Hmm...  I would say he's right on the cusp.  A few of these guys played multiple positions, but off the top of my head, here are Pierce's competitors:

Guys who are clearly better:  Bird, Pippen, Dr. J, Baylor, Hondo

Guys who might be better:  Worthy, Dominique, Barry, King, English

Younger guys who will / could pass him:  Lebron, Durant, Carmelo

 

I'll say Dr. J, Bird, Baylor, Rick Barry are no question above him
But Pippen is not on Pierce's level. No doubt Pippen has him on defense, was probably the best perimeter defender ever. But Pierce is a better scorer, leader, passer, and can create his own shot

Re: Paul Pierce is the most Underrated Player Ever
« Reply #6 on: February 09, 2012, 06:48:28 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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Did either of you guys above even SEE Havlicek play?

Pierce is a better defender than Hondo?
Pierce is a better passer than Hondo?
Pierce is a better floor general than Hondo?

I am sorry but claims of this nature are demonstrative of a clear lack of knowledge about the subject of John Havlicek. Pierce is none of the things above. Not even close.

In all my time watching basketball I am convinced there is only one player in the history of the game that could make Michael Jordan struggle and that is John Havlicek. Why, because Havlicek had a condition that allowed him to process oxygen at an insanely inhumane rate which meant, he never got tired. So he never let up and his performance never suffered do to exhaustion. Then add to that his insane skills both physical and mental along with those of basketball and what most people don't realize is that Havlicek is a lot closer to Bird for being the #2 Celtic all-time than he is to being #4 all-time.

Re: Paul Pierce is the most Underrated Player Ever
« Reply #7 on: February 09, 2012, 06:53:52 PM »

Offline OsirusCeltics

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Pierce = Top 10 SF All-Time?

I think he is
The Top 4 would be Dr. J, Bird, Rick Barry, Elgin Baylor
Havlicek and Dominique Wilkins you can argue ahead of him also
After that its anyone's spot
So maybe the 5th-7th spot for Paul

Re: Paul Pierce is the most Underrated Player Ever
« Reply #8 on: February 09, 2012, 06:55:49 PM »

Offline IrishGreen

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To me Paul Pierce is possibly one of the most technically gifted basketball players to ever grace a basketball court, largely because he never had to rely on being physically dominant or quick.  

Additionally, Cousy, Russell, Bird, Havlicek etc all played on Celtics' teams that were dominant in every position. Pierce did not and when we had a half decent team he carried us through that that 08 final.

For that, I raise my glass. When he retires, 34 will hang proudly amongst the other greats. That, I know is for certain.

Re: Paul Pierce is the most Underrated Player Ever
« Reply #9 on: February 09, 2012, 06:56:09 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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Best SFs in NBA history that are better than Pierce

Larry Bird
Julius Erving
John Havlicek
Rick Barry
LeBron James
Dominique Wilkins
Scottie Pippen
James Worthy
Elgin Baylor
Alex English
Adrian Dantley
Bernard King

I have 12 better than Pierce with Durant probably surpassing him eventually.

Re: Paul Pierce is the most Underrated Player Ever
« Reply #10 on: February 09, 2012, 07:01:05 PM »

Offline Redz

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Being underrated is overrated.
Yup

Re: Paul Pierce is the most Underrated Player Ever
« Reply #11 on: February 09, 2012, 07:03:14 PM »

Offline Redz

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Did either of you guys above even SEE Havlicek play?

Pierce is a better defender than Hondo?
Pierce is a better passer than Hondo?
Pierce is a better floor general than Hondo?

I am sorry but claims of this nature are demonstrative of a clear lack of knowledge about the subject of John Havlicek. Pierce is none of the things above. Not even close.

In all my time watching basketball I am convinced there is only one player in the history of the game that could make Michael Jordan struggle and that is John Havlicek. Why, because Havlicek had a condition that allowed him to process oxygen at an insanely inhumane rate which meant, he never got tired. So he never let up and his performance never suffered do to exhaustion. Then add to that his insane skills both physical and mental along with those of basketball and what most people don't realize is that Havlicek is a lot closer to Bird for being the #2 Celtic all-time than he is to being #4 all-time.

Amazingly Hondo has become under appreciated as the years go by.  He definitely sacrificed a lot in the name of the team too.

I only remember the tail end of his career, but even then he was awesome.

Yup

Re: Paul Pierce is the most Underrated Player Ever
« Reply #12 on: February 09, 2012, 07:16:48 PM »

Offline letsgoblue86

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....aaaaand ten time all-star!!!

Re: Paul Pierce is the most Underrated Player Ever
« Reply #13 on: February 09, 2012, 07:36:52 PM »

Offline b13special

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Why, because Havlicek had a condition that allowed him to process oxygen at an insanely inhumane rate which meant, he never got tired. So he never let up and his performance never suffered do to exhaustion.

I'm going to have to call bull Edited.  Profanity and masked profanity are against forum rules and may result in discipline. on this one. I haven't seen one piece of evidence supporting this "condition", other than other celticsblog articles... posted by guess who? YOU

Re: Paul Pierce is the most Underrated Player Ever
« Reply #14 on: February 09, 2012, 07:43:01 PM »

Offline LeoMoreno

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Guys you're discussing about different basketball. I really want to see a simulation of McHale trying to outrun LeBron or get past Tony Allen. Now if you tell me the NBA was as extreme then as it is today, I probably won't buy it. Bill Russell was a great player but Dwight could throw him out of the building...

Jeez, these things are impossible to discuss.