Bill Simmons idea: JO+our two 2012 first round picks for Verajao

[KG_ended_Bias]

Out of all the terrible, terrible, terrible trades I've seen here over the past few years, this has to be the worst one I've seen.  

I 2nd that! Bill Simmons needs to work on new ways of ruining his New team the Clippers. I'd have hard time giving up 2 2nd rounders for Verajao! Talk about a over reaction to a good game. Mikki Moore & Brandon Hunter looked like good bigs on bad teams. Let's calm down!

[StartOrien]

Thats 34 mil without Bass and 38 if Bass picks-up his option.

http://hoopshype.com/salaries/boston.htm

But with the year he is putting together its hard to see him coming back for 4 mil.

I thought the same, but doing some quick math it appears as if they figure the qualifying option in the number.

[StartOrien]

Out of all the terrible, terrible, terrible trades I've seen here over the past few years, this has to be the worst one I've seen.  

I 2nd that! Bill Simmons needs to work on new ways of ruining his New team the Clippers. I'd have hard time giving up 2 2nd rounders for Verajao! Talk about a over reaction to a good game. Mikki Moore & Brandon Hunter looked like good bigs on bad teams. Let's calm down!

Outside the anti-Simmons sentiment, I disagree with literally everything said here.

- It's a good trade idea
- The Cavs aren't a bad team
- No, Mikki Moore & Brandon Hunter have never looked good on any team.

[Change]

Out of all the terrible, terrible, terrible trades I've seen here over the past few years, this has to be the worst one I've seen.  

I 2nd that! Bill Simmons needs to work on new ways of ruining his New team the Clippers. I'd have hard time giving up 2 2nd rounders for Verajao! Talk about a over reaction to a good game. Mikki Moore & Brandon Hunter looked like good bigs on bad teams. Let's calm down!

I knew it. Simmons sabotaging the Celtics.

[Roy H.]

If the big three were two years younger, I'd do this in a heartbeat.

At this point, I don't know.  Does Varejao put us over the top?  Does he put us on equal footing with Chicago or Miami?  I don't think so, so I'd probably have to pass. 

But, I'm conflicted.  Varejao is a good player on a reasonable enough contract.  I might pull the trigger regardless.

[EvilEmpire]

Thats 34 mil without Bass and 38 if Bass picks-up his option.

http://hoopshype.com/salaries/boston.htm

But with the year he is putting together its hard to see him coming back for 4 mil.

I thought the same, but doing some quick math it appears as if they figure the qualifying option in the number.

Your right, so that 34 mil with Bass picking up his option and 30 without. Again doubtful he takes that option.

[GreenFaith1819]

If this happens, won't this take us out of the running of signing someone significant next season?

I thought Andy was 10 mil a yr?

 $7,700,000 (this season)
   
$8,400,000
   
$9,100,000
   
$9,800,000 (team option)

Ah - so hypothetically we COULD sign him and Dwight?

Would Dwight accept only 16-17 mil to come here? Getting both of these guys would max out the reported 25 mil we have available, right?

And - would Andy V/Rondo be enough to get Dwight here?

[Roy H.]

For a breakdown of our cap situation, see here:  http://www.celticsblog.com/2012/1/27/2752081/how-much-money-do-we-have-for-free-agents-anyway

[chambers]

Out of all the terrible, terrible, terrible trades I've seen here over the past few years, this has to be the worst one I've seen. 

I 2nd that! Bill Simmons needs to work on new ways of ruining his New team the Clippers. I'd have hard time giving up 2 2nd rounders for Verajao! Talk about a over reaction to a good game. Mikki Moore & Brandon Hunter looked like good bigs on bad teams. Let's calm down!

Over reaction to a good game?
The guy is having a great season and has always been an excellent role player. He is big, mobile and can run the floor with Rondo, Green the young bucks etc...
He single handedly crushed all of our bigs on the rebounding end and he is the number one offensive rebounder in the NBA- an upgraded version of Kendrick Perkins is a good example.
People are willing to pay Perkins 8-9 million a year for his defense when this kid can defend, finish under the rim and rebound- the thing we are struggling with the most.
You obviously don't watch any other NBA teams regularly because his rebounding is up there with the best in the NBA.

I think you both need to calm down, and the comment about the worst trade ever seen here is laughable- you have no idea buddy.
Shipping two late/middle draft picks and a one legged big for a young, hustling 7 footer who can finish under the rim and rebound gives us a much better shot this year, and gives us trade power for future picks. We can replace at least one of those late round picks by trading Verajao to someone like the Mavs/Lakers in the future who are one piece/big man away from a crown.

As Roy said, I don't know if I would pull the trigger on this now, because we are probably a bit too past it to potentially miss out on some gem picks this year. But it's intriguing and I think it's one of the better trade ideas I've seen on this forum for long time.

And to that one guy who said 'why do the cavs do this? they get nothing for Verajao'.
They get two extra picks and losing Verajao means that they go straight to the lottery next year and probably the year after that. They could potentially have:

*Our 2 first round picks
*The pick from the Heat from Lebron
*Their own first round pick from finishing middle/bottom this year.
*Losing Verajao means they go from pick number 6-10 to 1, 2 or 3.

So instead of being a fringe playoff team for 2-3 years with Verajao and Irving and Gee, they go directly to the cellar and potentially end up with 5 first round picks.
 

[Cman]

Out of all the terrible, terrible, terrible trades I've seen here over the past few years, this has to be the worst one I've seen. 

Then you either (a) don't click on the many trade idea threads floated on celticsblog, (b) don't properly value Varejao, or (c) greatly overvalue late 1st round picks...

Just messing with you.

This is not a bad trade, IMHO. Varejao's contract is decent, he is starter quality, and really the only thing of value the Cs would be giving up is cap space flexibility this next summer. But if it is pretty clear that Howard, the one big FA next summer, isn't coming to Boston, then I don't see a lot of harm in a trade like this.  I'd be very tempted if I were Boston....

[StartOrien]

For a breakdown of our cap situation, see here:  http://www.celticsblog.com/2012/1/27/2752081/how-much-money-do-we-have-for-free-agents-anyway

Roy, correct me if I'm wrong, but if I read this article correctly, if we were to acquire Varejao we'd still be left with roughly 16.5 million dollars in cap space.

I'm essentially going through the 25 mil figured you'd give and subtracting the 8.5 varejao is due.

Hmm... you could do A LOT worse than Rondo, Pierce, Varejao, Jajuan Johnson and 16.5 million dollars.. 

[Roy H.]

For a breakdown of our cap situation, see here:  http://www.celticsblog.com/2012/1/27/2752081/how-much-money-do-we-have-for-free-agents-anyway

Roy, correct me if I'm wrong, but if I read this article correctly, if we were to acquire Varejao we'd still be left with roughly 16.5 million dollars in cap space.

I'm essentially going through the 25 mil figured you'd give and subtracting the 8.5 varejao is due.

Hmm... you could do A LOT worse than Rondo, Pierce, Varejao, Jajuan Johnson and 16.5 million dollars..  

Yeah, that's basically right.  Actually a little bit more, since we wouldn't have the holds for the #1 picks.  So, another $2.3 million, minus one additional cap hold...  $1.8m + $16.5m = $18.3 million in cap space, approximately.

[Who]

I mentioned this in a previous Varejao thread but it bears repeating -- the Celtics would easily be able to find a taker for Varejao next summer if they wanted to move his contract to fund a maximum contract signing.

There are no cap implications. It's about the draft picks.

Whether you are willing to give up those picks for Varejao and for one last shot at a title before rebuilding.

[StartOrien]

I mentioned this in a previous Varejao thread but it bears repeating -- the Celtics would easily be able to find a taker for Varejao next summer if they wanted to move his contract to fund a maximum contract signing.

There are no cap implications. It's about the draft picks.

Whether you are willing to give up those picks for Varejao and for one last shot at a title before rebuilding.

Even if not, all of a sudden some of those more middle of the pack free agents become a lot easier to plug in (Wilson Chandler, OJ Mayo, Kris Humprhies, even Bass - who I like but think will get overpaid)

Rondo / Avery Bradley
Chandler / Mayo
Pierce
Humphries / Bass
Varejao / Jajuan Johnson

Is a pretty good team.

[jmei]

Honest question-- who are you saving the cap space for next season? There are literally no unrestricted free agents worth signing to a long-term deal once you get past Deron Williams and Dwight Howard, and let's be honest-- Dwight won't be signing in Boston. You're going to have a tough time prying one of the restricted free agents away (Eric Gordon, Brook Lopez, Nicolas Batum, JaVale McGee, Roy Hibbert) and even if the other team doesn't match, that only means you've probably overpaid for a good but not great player.

Losing the first round picks will definitely hurt long-term rebuilding (and I probably don't do this trade unless we only give up one pick), but if it's March 1st and this team is one piece away from seriously contending in the East (maybe Wade's injury lingers or Chicago starts looking vulnerable), Varejao is one of the better pieces semi-available who fits well with this team.