Better without Ray?

[Celtics4ever]

No we are not better without Ray, period.

[clover]

Not better with out Ray, but the offense needs to run like it has, and thats threw Peirce. To many times Rondo will be waiting for Ray to come off of screens and there is only 8 seconds left when they start to actually do some thing.

I wouldn't even mind him coming off the bench, Pietrus and Sasha have been giving energy to the starting line up. Its nice to see.

I agree, except we've seen how Pierce helps Bradley and Moore to be effective, so having Pierce play when the second team is in--or having the 1st and 2nd teams thoroughly mixed and matched overall--may be the more important.

I believe Doc had plans to change their offense this season, but then nixed them for lack of training camp time (and also probably because Jeff Green isn't playing).  Looks like Doc may need to change more on the fly than he had intended.

[green7]

and looking at the pacers team faces they did not look confident.like how they was in the first 2 games there is a reason for that.

[Marcus13]

Yeahh, we're better without the team's most efficient player - lol.

In reality, the Celtics just don't do a very good job at utlizing him.  He is such a dangerous weapon when used properly.

[galvinx10]

I don't think the offense is better without Ray. That being said, I wouldn't be opposed to having him come off the bench every once in a while

[OttawaCeltic]

When the best backcourt in the NBA returns, look out, league!!

Isn't Monta+Stephen already playing

[Marcus13]

When the best backcourt in the NBA returns, look out, league!!

Isn't Monta+Stephen already playing

Staff stuffers.  Not winners.

[BballTim]

I know this is heresy, but is the recent surge (especially on defense) connected to the absence of Ray Allen? I have been noticing that Ray gives us nothing besides scoring anymore. He gets TORCHED night after night on the defensive end... maybe having a guy like Pietrus that will dig in at the 2 has made us much better all around? The eye test certainly says it is so.

He can't cover these quicker 2 guards... I mean I love him, and his big shot ability is obviously enormous, but is he better suited as a 6th man or even trade bait now?

I think we can point to the awakening of Paul Pierce and Kevin Garnett as elite NBA players as the primary reason for our recent surge.  The contributions from the entire bench have helped as well. 

When the best backcourt in the NBA returns, look out, league!!

  KG literally looks like he's about 5 years younger than he did a couple of weeks ago.

[Celtics18]

When the best backcourt in the NBA returns, look out, league!!

Isn't Monta+Stephen already playing

That's not a bad back court, but those guys sure could use some wins for their rookie coach who guaranteed that they'd be a playoff team this year. 

[greenpride32]

In reality, the Celtics just don't do a very good job at utlizing him.  He is such a dangerous weapon when used properly.

I agree with this.  Ray is soley an offensive threat at this stage of his career.  But if we're only going to get him 8-10 shots a night that's not going to make up for his defensive liablities unless he shoots 100% each night which isn't going to happen.  So if we aren't going to utilize him yes we are a better team without him.

I started a thread the other day asking if we're better without both Ray and Rondo. They both give up way too many easy baskets.  How many times have you seen Rondo gamble and come up empty only to see the other team get a clear lane to the rim or an open jump shot?  I know it frustrates the heck out of Doc.

[CelticSooner]

In reality, the Celtics just don't do a very good job at utlizing him.  He is such a dangerous weapon when used properly.

I agree with this.  Ray is soley an offensive threat at this stage of his career.  But if we're only going to get him 8-10 shots a night that's not going to make up for his defensive liablities unless he shoots 100% each night which isn't going to happen.  So if we aren't going to utilize him yes we are a better team without him.

The problem with this is it takes much more work to get Ray a shot. There has been plenty of times the C's have run out of the shot clock trying to get Ray open while he is running around screen after screen.

[LooseCannon]

How many times have you seen Rondo gamble and come up empty only to see the other team get a clear lane to the rim or an open jump shot?  I know it frustrates the heck out of Doc.

I think Rondo should be gambling.  I think it is less of a problem if KG is playing the way he has recently versus the way he looked earlier in the season.

[Meadowlark_Scal]

Th Celts need to evolve here....as for Ray Allen, he needs to accept the role of specialist instead of starter....Whereas a starter might play all game, Ray woul.d now go in, and see what he has tonight, and how the matchup is working. He is still a great shooter..!

[Marcus13]

Th Celts need to evolve here....as for Ray Allen, he needs to accept the role of specialist instead of starter....Whereas a starter might play all game, Ray woul.d now go in, and see what he has tonight, and how the matchup is working. He is still a great shooter..!

I don't think Ray would have a problem with doing this if there was someone on the roster worthy of starting over him...but there's not.  In fact, when you look across the starting Shooting Guards in the Eastern Conference, Ray is amongst the top.

[Marcus13]

In reality, the Celtics just don't do a very good job at utlizing him.  He is such a dangerous weapon when used properly.

I agree with this.  Ray is soley an offensive threat at this stage of his career.  But if we're only going to get him 8-10 shots a night that's not going to make up for his defensive liablities unless he shoots 100% each night which isn't going to happen.  So if we aren't going to utilize him yes we are a better team without him.

The problem with this is it takes much more work to get Ray a shot. There has been plenty of times the C's have run out of the shot clock trying to get Ray open while he is running around screen after screen.

Yes, but the thing is Ray shouldn't be ONLY looked for coming off of screens like he is in our offense.  Ray is rarely used for a kick out shot when Rondo penetrates.  We follow our plays very closely and it doesn't allow  for a lot of those opportunities