Hollinger on Baby for Bass deal

[LB3533]

Whether Baby has more muscle or just more definition remains moot, because the point is that Baby is in better shape now, than he was when he finished last season.

[action781]

i think hollinger underrates players because he looks at stats only, no intangibles whatsoever.

I think people underrate Hollinger because they think he only looks at numbers.  Hollinger clearly acknowledges Davis has value on defense, something that has historically been difficult to accurately assess with statistics.  Some people also tend to overrate intangibles because they hate math geeks.

TP.  Intangibles are important, but if one player has a TS% higher than the other, he is going to score more points given the same number of shots.  At the end of the day, the team with the more points wins.  Stats are very important and as much as Hollinger overvalues stats, I'd say almost every other analyst out there undervalues them.

[Q_FBE]

I like this move for Boston too. Brandon Bass is a better athlete and more complete player than Baby. He could be a taller quicker version of Leon Powe. That would be a good thing. Plus he is an expiring contract, too.

[ScoobyDoo]

I don't think Davis fits into the Celtics long term rebuilding. I think whether Chris Paul came in or Rondo stayed, Ainge is goig to build a high octane team.

Davis just doesn't fit into a "get up and down the court" team.

Bass, like J. Johnson, can run the floor and while neither currently projects to be a starter, if Bass stays long term, they would be a nice 1-2 punch off the bench at PF.

Add in the Cap friendly move...

I'm good with it.

[bbd24]

Is there anybody out there not OK with this ?  Better player, better deal, better future...How can you not like this ?

Thanks to how well your organization is ran, you straight stole Bass & upgraded a position of need. This was a huge deal when it comes down to it in all aspects of the game.

[wdleehi]

I am fine.


Similar players.


Celtics have the cheaper one.

[Ersatz]

There's a big difference between the Davis of last year, the BBD of his previous years in a Celtics uniform.  If the earlier version of Davis had been around the 2nd half of last season, I think he'd still be a Celtic.  

I think Baby was gone regardless. He was in the 6th man race for the majority of last season.

I don't think he was necessarily gone. In fact, I think the Perk trade was as much a gamble on Davis as it was anything else. For the first part of the year, Boston's D with Davis was as good as it's ever been in the Garnett era and Davis was hitting those mid-range jumpers. Those two facts made Perk expendable. But then Davis just lost everything: the defense was still okay, though it slipped, but the offense was terrible.

So the gamble failed, which makes it even more incredible that Ainge turned Baby into Bass.

[LooseCannon]

In fact, I think the Perk trade was as much a gamble on Davis as it was anything else.

I actually think it was the opposite and it was a gamble because of Davis.  I suspect Ainge wanted an option for an end-of-game lineup that did not include Big Baby and he hoped Green could be an upgrade.  However, it was too late in the season for Doc to feel comfortable using Green in that spot.  I think Doc was willing to experiment with a small ball lineup that had Marquis Daniels instead of Glen Davis, but injury killed that idea.

[Zev Love X]

Did any body see How Jacked davis is now SMH He really worked out over the summer i wounder how he plays and if he stays in shape from now on. I love the trade for bass


http://www.redsarmy.com/home/2011/12/where-the-hell-did-super-jacked-glen-davis-come-from.html

Oh pleeaaaaaasseeee. lol this literally happens every year at the start of the season. Everyone raves about how Baby is actually in shape  and looking slimmed down and then by mid season towards the end of the year, you'll be saying, what happened? Seriously. Every year.

[MBunge]

There's a big difference between the Davis of last year, the BBD of his previous years in a Celtics uniform.  If the earlier version of Davis had been around the 2nd half of last season, I think he'd still be a Celtic.  

I think Baby was gone regardless. He was in the 6th man race for the majority of last season.

I don't think he was necessarily gone. In fact, I think the Perk trade was as much a gamble on Davis as it was anything else. For the first part of the year, Boston's D with Davis was as good as it's ever been in the Garnett era and Davis was hitting those mid-range jumpers. Those two facts made Perk expendable. But then Davis just lost everything: the defense was still okay, though it slipped, but the offense was terrible.

So the gamble failed, which makes it even more incredible that Ainge turned Baby into Bass.

Yeah, the bad taste of the playoffs makes you forget that Baby really was a 6th man of the year candidate for the first half of the season.  When he's at that level, he's a better player than Bass.  But you could see his play had already slipped a bit by the 2nd half and then the complete playoff disaster.

Mike

[jambr380]

Did any body see How Jacked davis is now SMH He really worked out over the summer i wounder how he plays and if he stays in shape from now on. I love the trade for bass


http://www.redsarmy.com/home/2011/12/where-the-hell-did-super-jacked-glen-davis-come-from.html

He's flexing in one picture and relaxed in another. He's not noticable more muscular in my opinion.

He may not be more muscular, but he certainly is more cut. Dare I say he was 'uncut' before. 

As for the report, I basically agree with Hollinger, but I don't think he was that horrible offensively. Unfortunately, we all will remember the post all-star break Baby.

[Fan from VT]

There's a big difference between the Davis of last year, the BBD of his previous years in a Celtics uniform.  If the earlier version of Davis had been around the 2nd half of last season, I think he'd still be a Celtic.  

I think Baby was gone regardless. He was in the 6th man race for the majority of last season.

I don't think he was necessarily gone. In fact, I think the Perk trade was as much a gamble on Davis as it was anything else. For the first part of the year, Boston's D with Davis was as good as it's ever been in the Garnett era and Davis was hitting those mid-range jumpers. Those two facts made Perk expendable. But then Davis just lost everything: the defense was still okay, though it slipped, but the offense was terrible.

So the gamble failed, which makes it even more incredible that Ainge turned Baby into Bass.

Yeah, the bad taste of the playoffs makes you forget that Baby really was a 6th man of the year candidate for the first half of the season.  When he's at that level, he's a better player than Bass.  But you could see his play had already slipped a bit by the 2nd half and then the complete playoff disaster.

Mike

His 6th man candidacy was never more than hyperbole based on these "intangibles;" it's a nebulous term anyway, and throughout the year there were always several better statistical 6th man than him, but none quite a unique or fun to write about, which goes a looooong way in such awards. Bass has  just been better for the last several years. He just doesn't have a cute nickname or stand out looks wise in a crowd. People love wondering how baby gets it done without looking at how he really doesn't get that much done.

[Fafnir]

There's a big difference between the Davis of last year, the BBD of his previous years in a Celtics uniform.  If the earlier version of Davis had been around the 2nd half of last season, I think he'd still be a Celtic.  

I think Baby was gone regardless. He was in the 6th man race for the majority of last season.

I don't think he was necessarily gone. In fact, I think the Perk trade was as much a gamble on Davis as it was anything else. For the first part of the year, Boston's D with Davis was as good as it's ever been in the Garnett era and Davis was hitting those mid-range jumpers. Those two facts made Perk expendable. But then Davis just lost everything: the defense was still okay, though it slipped, but the offense was terrible.

So the gamble failed, which makes it even more incredible that Ainge turned Baby into Bass.

Yeah, the bad taste of the playoffs makes you forget that Baby really was a 6th man of the year candidate for the first half of the season.  When he's at that level, he's a better player than Bass.  But you could see his play had already slipped a bit by the 2nd half and then the complete playoff disaster.

Mike

His 6th man candidacy was never more than hyperbole based on these "intangibles;" it's a nebulous term anyway, and throughout the year there were always several better statistical 6th man than him, but none quite a unique or fun to write about, which goes a looooong way in such awards. Bass has  just been better for the last several years. He just doesn't have a cute nickname or stand out looks wise in a crowd. People love wondering how baby gets it done without looking at how he really doesn't get that much done.

The C's had the best record in the east, that's why he was a "6th man of the year candidate" more than anything.

His splits aren't that impressive, especially considering how many minutes he played.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/d/davisgl01/splits/2011/

[33-00-32]

For me Baby was just what his name says he is and I'm impressed that we got anything for him. I love all Celtics but was pretty happy when the BBD era ended. I can't wait to see how bad KG makes him look in a game.

[Brendan]

Baby had three pluses:

1. Positional and usage flexibility (PF or C, starter or bench)
2. Team defender
3. Dirty work defender

He has a lot of flaws - playing next to Dwight should actually help him, since Dwight is a human eraser on defensive mistakes I expect he'll maintain his defensive value, and have less usage on offense, plus get the weaker defenders.

But Bass is a much better player - a perfect backup for KG, and can shoot better and finish at the rim. He has all the banger skills that KG needs in the front court, and he's a natural PF who could shoot mid range or post up, when KG is on the bench. Plus the deal size and contract length.