Celtics should rebuild now

[RyNye]

No. We are contenders this year, like it or not. There's a reason Vegas considers us a top tier team on the odds (either 5 or 6, depending on where you look). And the Lakers/Knicks are severely overvalued.

[Chris]

I'm on board with this. Rondo and Ray are the most easily moveable pieces, and Danny should start there.

If that Indy deal of Collison, Hibbert, and George is a legitimate one, start there. Do it meow.

Can I just say that if Indy had any interest in trading Collison, George, and Hibbert for Rondo, Chris Paul would be a Celtic right now.

Just had to point that out.  Carry on.

I don't know what to make of this. It was never really pointed out whether or not Indy had interest here. It was floated, and the problem (in the press) was always on the NO side, not the Indy side.

My point is, that deal gets the trade done for NOH.  Unfortunately, the reported deal offered by Indy was Collison and Hansbrough for Rondo, a far cry from this godfather deal that is being dreamed about. 

I really don't see any way Indy would be giving up their starting PG (who some would argue is not too far off from Rondo), their young starting center, and George, who they absolutely love, and who has been rumored to be edging Granger out of town.

[BballTim]

I'm on board with this. Rondo and Ray are the most easily moveable pieces, and Danny should start there.

If that Indy deal of Collison, Hibbert, and George is a legitimate one, start there. Do it meow.

Can I just say that if Indy had any interest in trading Collison, George, and Hibbert for Rondo, Chris Paul would be a Celtic right now.

Just had to point that out.  Carry on.

I don't know what to make of this. It was never really pointed out whether or not Indy had interest here. It was floated, and the problem (in the press) was always on the NO side, not the Indy side.

My point is, that deal gets the trade done for NOH.  Unfortunately, the reported deal offered by Indy was Collison and Hansbrough for Rondo, a far cry from this godfather deal that is being dreamed about. 

I really don't see any way Indy would be giving up their starting PG (who some would argue is not too far off from Rondo), their young starting center, and George, who they absolutely love, and who has been rumored to be edging Granger out of town.

  You think Collison's close to the player Rondo is?

[Q_FBE]

I think that no matter how many times DA says that no one is untouchable, Pierce isn't going anywhere. Other than that I could see him doing almost nothing to a total flip of the roster before this season is all done.

First off 33-00-32, I always TP for your avatar....   
Can I have a copy so I can use it for my backdrop on my desktop?

I think Danny needs to stand pat and see how the first 30 games play out and then decide on a course for this team at the trading deadline.... So I am in a wait and see mode before advocating rebuilding or continuing the campaign for number eighteen. I am eager to get this season started and see what Keyon Dooling, Brandon Bass, Chris Wilcox, The Perdue Rookies, and Marquis Daniels can give us off the bench. So the Celtics have reloaded for one last campaign for number eighteen. 

Let's Git-R-Done.

[BballTim]

I think that no matter how many times DA says that no one is untouchable, Pierce isn't going anywhere. Other than that I could see him doing almost nothing to a total flip of the roster before this season is all done.

  I think, in PP's case, the fact that Wyc frequently says that Pierce will retire a Celtic may come into play.

[Chris]

I'm on board with this. Rondo and Ray are the most easily moveable pieces, and Danny should start there.

If that Indy deal of Collison, Hibbert, and George is a legitimate one, start there. Do it meow.

Can I just say that if Indy had any interest in trading Collison, George, and Hibbert for Rondo, Chris Paul would be a Celtic right now.

Just had to point that out.  Carry on.

I don't know what to make of this. It was never really pointed out whether or not Indy had interest here. It was floated, and the problem (in the press) was always on the NO side, not the Indy side.

My point is, that deal gets the trade done for NOH.  Unfortunately, the reported deal offered by Indy was Collison and Hansbrough for Rondo, a far cry from this godfather deal that is being dreamed about. 

I really don't see any way Indy would be giving up their starting PG (who some would argue is not too far off from Rondo), their young starting center, and George, who they absolutely love, and who has been rumored to be edging Granger out of town.

  You think Collison's close to the player Rondo is?

Ummm, close is a relative term.  But I don't think he is so far away that you would offer a center, still on his rookie contract, who averaged 12.7 points and 7.5 rebounds and 1.8 blocks, PLUS a blue chip wing prospect for him.

I would say Rondo is a second tier PG, and Collison is third tier right now (although I think Collison will have a breakout year now that he has a PF who can run the pick and roll).

But the point is, Indy was never giving up that much value for Rondo, regardless of what you think of Collison.  Hibbert and George were both dealbreakers for them.

[Boris Badenov]

I think even in the "rebuild now" strategy, we need to keep Rondo. For whatever reason, he just does not seem to have much market value right now.

My theory is that he's much more valuable to contending teams, particularly those who already have top-tier offensive players, than he is to lottery teams, most of whom value offense more than defense and table-setting. And all of the contenders now either don't need a PG, or don't have picks/prospects to offer in return (with the possible exception of OKC).

[Moranis]

The Celtics as presently comprised are doomed to a first or second round exit in the playoffs this season.  They have no real shot at a title without major injuries to other contending teams. 

  This is fairly nonsensical. If the Celts are healthy they're clearly contenders.


 

I don't see the Celtics beating the Bulls or Heat if they are fully healthy.  Which means a second round exit and a wasted season.

[33_Larry Legend_33]

Ray Allen has been a model citizen, has provided great leadership, quietly goes about being a model of consistency - yet people still want to trade him?

Do that at your own peril...and then try to find the "next Ray Allen" for a couple-three years. 

Ray's the last guy I'd trade as he's instant offense.  With Paul's current heel situation, who are we gonna depend on??  Sorry, I just don't understand this notion of trading Ray Allen.

[Celtics4ever]

Wasted season = Pitino years, I will still enjoy watching this team...

[PosImpos]

Ray Allen has been a model citizen, has provided great leadership, quietly goes about being a model of consistency - yet people still want to trade him?

Do that at your own peril...and then try to find the "next Ray Allen" for a couple-three years. 

Ray's the last guy I'd trade as he's instant offense.  With Paul's current heel situation, who are we gonna depend on??  Sorry, I just don't understand this notion of trading Ray Allen.

it makes sense if the idea isn't to get better now but to get some assets for the future . . . but i don't really see another team giving up much for him.  the only kind of team that can really use Ray Allen is a contender; but basically all such teams have no cap space to absorb Ray's contract so we'd have to take on some bad contracts in return.  also, most contenders don't have numerous young players available to give up for somebody like Ray.

as has been noted before, there aren't many trades involving the Big 3 you can come up with in which we'd get a reasonable return.  we might as well just play out the year and then plunge into rebuilding next season.

i think it's possible there could be some worthwhile trades involving rondo, though . . . .

[thenotoriousjts]

I'm really not on board with trading everyone but Avery Bradley. Pierce, Rondo, Bradley, Bass, and maybe Moore will all be around for a while I would guess. If any of the big 3 are trade bait, I think KG would be first to go. Still making the All-Defense teams, and you have to realize he's still one of the top PFs in the league, like it or not.

[snively]

Contenders/playoff teams with notable surplus young assets that might want Ray or KG: the Mavs (Beaubois), Bulls (Asik, Gibson, Butler and a future Charlotte 1st rounder), Spurs (Kawhi Leonard, Splitter), OKC (Aldrich, R. Jackson), Memphis (Mayo, X. Henry), Orlando (Anderson, Orton?), Knicks (Shumpert, Fields), Clippers (Bledsoe), Nuggets (Faried, Hamilton, maybe Lawson), Blazers (Batum, Oden's working body parts) and the Pacers (Collison, Hansbrough).

These are the types of assets that would be on the table should some combination of injuries/decline make it apparent that the window was firmly closed with the current core. 

Some of them (Spurs, Knicks, Mavs) would be immediately disqualified by a lack of expiring & expendable contracts or cap space to make the deals workable. 

Only one of them as the contracts to pull in KG (Portland).

I guess I could see Boston going for Camby, Oden and Batum or a pick for KG (again assuming contention hopes were thoroughly dashed). Two expirings and a decent prospect.  A chance to have the first crack at the Oden reclamation project.   

Korver, Asik and Scalabrine would be a decent haul for Ray.

[33_Larry Legend_33]

My guess is Ray will threaten retirement (with more meaning than just a threat behind it) if he's traded. 

Danny has said you can never have enough "shooters" - well, Ray is one of the few we have.  He's going nowhere, and nobody will give back to the Celtics the value that many here at Celticsblog would be happy with anyway.

[tenn_smoothie]

I think the reason why Rondo is being thrown out there in trade talks is because he is younger, he's not a long-term veteran

personally, i'd call Rondo a long term veteran of the Celtics. just because he is not old doesn't mean he lacks stature on this team. for me, Rajon is a Celtic and Ainge would do well to treat him as such. i want to make Rondo feel wanted and appreciated because he has given his heart to this team and shown that he will do anything to win.