Lets just trade the whole team for Chris Paul

[indeedproceed]

Rajon Rondo assists at the rim per contest last season: 3.93

CHris Paul assists at the rim per contest last season: 3.93

Rajon Rondo turnovers from bad passes per game last season: 2.35

Chris Paul turnovers from bad passes per game last season: 1.28

Rajon Rondo made 2.35 baskets per 36 minutes at the rim last year, at a 63% FGM, and the basket was assisted by another teammate on 30% of his makes.

Chris Paul 1.26 baskets per 36 minutes for a 61.6 FGM% at the rim last year, and the baskets were assisted by another teammate 12.5% of the time.

Pretty rational point: Rajon Rondo's smarter, more talented teammates allowed for better opportunities at the basket both in terms of assists completed by him, and in terms of his own opportunities to score. If given the same opportunities as Rajon Rondo, Chris Paul's makes per game, and his assists per game at the rim should increase, due to less personal attention being paid to him by the opposing team, and better quality teammates making plays without the ball.

[Marcus13]

That'd be dumb - he wouldn't sign an extension then

[Greenbean]

All I know is Rondo is a horrible shooter and Chris Paul is a better player. So, give me Chris Paul!

People keep saying that but it's not really true. Yes his ft shooting blows. His mid range game is greatly improved and not only was he taking more last year he was also making more. Just look at his percentage from mid range last year and compare it to others and it's really not bad.

Defenses give Rondo the outside shot.


Defenses do not give Paul the outside shot.

  Chris Paul doesn't get to the rim any more often than Ray Allen. Last year we were near the top of the league in inside scoring. Trade for Paul, and we may be close to the bottom. It's great that people won't sag off Paul that much, not so great that they won't have to worry too much about protecting the rim.

Thats just an inflammatory statement. What makes you think we would be near the bottom of the league?

  The fact that NO was near the bottom of the league? The fact that Rondo generates so many more points at the rim in a game than CP3? The fact that Rondo generates a higher percentage of the Celts points at the rim than Paul does for NO?

  What makes you think we wouldn't? Reading that CP3 will be the savior of our offense, and not realizing what the result is when you add a jump shooter to a team that's primarily comprised of jump shooters?

In NO, Paul ran a pick and roll offense with David West. You dont think Paul can get to the bucket?

  I don't know that whether he *can* is important, more whether he ever *does*.

What about when Rondo goes long stretches without attempting a shot at the rim because he just missed his last 15 free throws?

  That's just an inflammatory statement, and clearly not true. But in any case, you should be able to do the math, when our point guard, who everyone claims is reluctant to drive the ball, gets to the rim much more than Paul.

I have been reading your comments about this trade for weeks now. If you are concerned about Chris Paul's knee, then I get it.

If you are trying to sell everyone that Rajon Rondo is a better player and point guard than Chris Paul, your argument is going to fall on deaf ears for the most part.

  Well, it's mainly the knees, but his not attacking the basket is probably related to that. But any criticism of Paul, no matter how apparent, will fall on deaf ears for the most part.

No one is saying our offense would need to be saved. Insinuating it would be worse is just wrong in my opinion.



Will our offense be better by upgrading the offensive skills of our point guard without giving up any other offensive threat?





I dont see how you could argue differently. I dont care how many at the basket scoring stats you pull up. Chris Paul is a better offensive player than Rajon Rondo. That is a fact despite the fact that Rondo may go ot the basket more than him out of necessity.


If Rondo is so effective at getting to the rim, why does Chris Paul average 5.4 ft attempts per game vs. 2.7 for Rondo?

Looks like Paul makes his trips to the basket count for something.




Last year, Rondo only averaged 1.9 trips to the line while Paul averaged 4.8 while recovering from his knee injury.



It's funny you bring up scoring 6 points less a game because Paul gets to the basket less but you refuse to consider how many more points we would be scoring because Paul can shoot. Actually, he averages about 6 more ppg than Rondo last year.


You are talking like the only thing Paul can do is shoot. There is a reason he is considered the best pg in the game. People arent making this stuff up.

Oh and your question regarding what happens when you add a jumpshooter to a team comprised of jump shooters... if you're talking about a guy that can only stand around and shoot i get your point, but otherwise, you become even better at shooting and scoring.

[indeedproceed]

Rajon Rondo per 36 minutes: 10.3 pts, 10.8 assists (2.1512 for 3pters), 3.3 TO's, 27.95 points (this does not include any points added by offensive rebounds, hockey passes, turnovers created, etc...)

Chris Paul per 36 minutes: 15.8 points, 9.8 assists (2.1375 from 3pters), 2.2 TO's, 33.4 poiints created (this does not include any points added by offensive rebounds, hockey passes, turnovers created, etc...)

Dunno if that helps.

[BballTim]

Rajon Rondo assists at the rim per contest last season: 3.93

CHris Paul assists at the rim per contest last season: 3.93

Rajon Rondo turnovers from bad passes per game last season: 2.35

Chris Paul turnovers from bad passes per game last season: 1.28

Rajon Rondo made 2.35 baskets per 36 minutes at the rim last year, at a 63% FGM, and the basket was assisted by another teammate on 30% of his makes.

Chris Paul 1.26 baskets per 36 minutes for a 61.6 FGM% at the rim last year, and the baskets were assisted by another teammate 12.5% of the time.

Pretty rational point: Rajon Rondo's smarter, more talented teammates allowed for better opportunities at the basket both in terms of assists completed by him, and in terms of his own opportunities to score. If given the same opportunities as Rajon Rondo, Chris Paul's makes per game, and his assists per game at the rim should increase, due to less personal attention being paid to him by the opposing team, and better quality teammates making plays without the ball.

  Where did you get the same number of assists at the rim for both players? I don't think it was from 82games or hoopdata.

  And your "Pretty rational point" is completely made up. If you look at Boston and NO, the difference between CP3 and Rondo make up almost the entire difference between the two teams. Why didn't those smarter, more talented teammates allowed for better opportunities at the basket both in terms of assists, and in terms of opportunities to score for anyone besides Rondo?

[indeedproceed]

 Where did you get the same number of assists at the rim for both players? I don't think it was from 82games or hoopdata.

No you're right its a typo. I do stuff at work, its time-consuming!

Rajon Rondo assists at the rim per contest last season: 3.93

CHris Paul assists at the rim per contest last season: 2.93

Rajon Rondo turnovers from bad passes per game last season: 2.35

Chris Paul turnovers from bad passes per game last season: 1.28

Rajon Rondo made 2.35 baskets per 36 minutes at the rim last year, at a 63% FGM, and the basket was assisted by another teammate on 30% of his makes.

Chris Paul 1.26 baskets per 36 minutes for a 61.6 FGM% at the rim last year, and the baskets were assisted by another teammate 12.5% of the time.

And your "Pretty rational point" is completely made up. If you look at Boston and NO, the difference between CP3 and Rondo make up almost the entire difference between the two teams. Why didn't those smarter, more talented teammates allowed for better opportunities at the basket both in terms of assists, and in terms of opportunities to score for anyone besides Rondo?

In what way? Who are you comparing these players against that would make 'a difference'?

What you said makes zero sense.

[kozlodoev]

Remember when half of this blog (including me) was up in arms against the Garnett trade, because Al Jefferson was the greatest thing since sliced bread?

Well, I've learned my lesson.

[indeedproceed]

And Tim, you understand at this point you're arguing that Paul Pierce, Ray Allen, and Kevin Garnett, 3 players who are perennial all-stars, HOFers in waiting, acknowledged as capable, competent leaders and among the headiest most intelligent players at their position, are somehow not a considerable boon to Rajon Rondo's baseline performance.

[dmny5000]

Remember when half of this blog (including me) was up in arms against the Garnett trade, because Al Jefferson was the greatest thing since sliced bread?

Well, I've learned my lesson.

Jefferson looked so good cause he played on a horrible team so he got a lot of minutes and touches. It's easier for a guy to put up great numbers on a bad team. Rondo has put up great numbers on a title contending team. Very big difference.

[SHAQATTACK]

The intangables, when considered (leadership, recruiting, esteem, ect , ect ) that CP3 brings to the table frankly blows Rondo out of the water .

[Greenbean]

Rajon Rondo assists at the rim per contest last season: 3.93

CHris Paul assists at the rim per contest last season: 3.93

Rajon Rondo turnovers from bad passes per game last season: 2.35

Chris Paul turnovers from bad passes per game last season: 1.28

Rajon Rondo made 2.35 baskets per 36 minutes at the rim last year, at a 63% FGM, and the basket was assisted by another teammate on 30% of his makes.

Chris Paul 1.26 baskets per 36 minutes for a 61.6 FGM% at the rim last year, and the baskets were assisted by another teammate 12.5% of the time.

Pretty rational point: Rajon Rondo's smarter, more talented teammates allowed for better opportunities at the basket both in terms of assists completed by him, and in terms of his own opportunities to score. If given the same opportunities as Rajon Rondo, Chris Paul's makes per game, and his assists per game at the rim should increase, due to less personal attention being paid to him by the opposing team, and better quality teammates making plays without the ball.

  Where did you get the same number of assists at the rim for both players? I don't think it was from 82games or hoopdata.

  And your "Pretty rational point" is completely made up. If you look at Boston and NO, the difference between CP3 and Rondo make up almost the entire difference between the two teams. Why didn't those smarter, more talented teammates allowed for better opportunities at the basket both in terms of assists, and in terms of opportunities to score for anyone besides Rondo?

The rationalle is that Chris Paul's teammates were inferior offensively to Rondo's at every position besides PF (and KG isnt much worse than DWest offensively). Give Chris Paul the keys to the Celtics and he could put up the same at the rim numbers Rondo does. It isnt a stretch. You are taking stats from Chris Paul playing with the Hornets in a different offense than the Celtics.

[GreenFaith1819]

You can't compare this to 07. Garnett is a big man and a defensive force that anchors the whole team. Chris paul is a point guard. Good big men win championships... The same can't be said about point guards.

Admittedly I'm a vid man. I watch clips and get a good impression of a player's worth. I saw two IMO rather extraordinary plays from Chris Paul that showed me that he is special:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fL5tCyIYwzM

Chris Paul defeated the 7'0" shot blocker Bynum in a space of only 3-4 feet. That footwork of his reminds me of Hakeem and McHale.

Here is one where he breaks Parker:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YP8_j-eGu84

I can't speak for anyone else here, but I have not seen plays like this in a few years.

I'm at peace if Rondo stays here, but if we get Paul I'll be happy, too.

If breaking someones ankles makes a player special then hot sauce is next years mvp.

A dribble move doesn't mean anything, he has some great clips just don't know why you chose those.

Also, what pg wouldn't be able to cross up a C?

With those clips, I'm imagining the threat of what Chris Paul brings in a potential trade to Boston....imagine Chris, Ray, Paul, KG and JO - all capable shooters.

Imagine a contest vs LA, where absolutely NO ONE on LA's squad can sag off of a player on our team. Bynum will be drawn out of the lane by JO's mid-range game.

Ron Ron would be drawn out by Paul. Same with Kobe and Ray's three-pt threat.

Pau would be drawn out by KG, just like in the clip below.

That leaves D Fish on Chris Paul.

Oh Boy.

Look at what Ray's threat here does to Sasha. With James Posey and Eddie House in the game here on this famous possession, again - we have multiple offensive threats:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i19lSd7pAiE

Not to mention that Chris will be like a kid in a candy store, with options to dish it to JO, KG, Ray or Paul.

With that kind of lineup, neither MIA nor LA can sag or cheat off of Boston.

Ever.

Yes - Rondo could drive on D Fish. BUT - Chris Paul in this situation could pop off with a three or a mid-range shot - something that Rondo can't do with reliability - yet.

Chris Paul in Green just paralyzes opposing defenses. Way too many options here.

Danny - do it. I'm sold.

[BballTim]

And Tim, you understand at this point you're arguing that Paul Pierce, Ray Allen, and Kevin Garnett, 3 players who are perennial all-stars, HOFers in waiting, acknowledged as capable, competent leaders and among the headiest most intelligent players at their position, are somehow not a considerable boon to Rajon Rondo's baseline performance.

  I know perfectly well who Rondo plays with. But, just for perspective, did you happen to see how the "3 players who are perennial all-stars, HOFers in waiting, acknowledged as capable, competent leaders and among the headiest most intelligent players at their position" fared against the Heat when Rondo wasn't playing? If those three players are creating so many great scoring opportunities around the rim, why do the bulk of those opportunities revolve around Rondo? Why weren't there a largish amount of points scored where Paul passed to Kevin, Ray passed to Paul or KG passed to Shaq?

  The scores at the rim that the Celts got that didn't involve Rondo were about the same as the amount of scores at the rim the Hornets got that didn't involve CP3. If your claims about greatly increased numbers are true, there should be a significant difference between the two. Why isn't there?

[indeedproceed]

And Tim, you understand at this point you're arguing that Paul Pierce, Ray Allen, and Kevin Garnett, 3 players who are perennial all-stars, HOFers in waiting, acknowledged as capable, competent leaders and among the headiest most intelligent players at their position, are somehow not a considerable boon to Rajon Rondo's baseline performance.

  I know perfectly well who Rondo plays with. But, just for perspective, did you happen to see how the "3 players who are perennial all-stars, HOFers in waiting, acknowledged as capable, competent leaders and among the headiest most intelligent players at their position" fared against the Heat when Rondo wasn't playing? If those three players are creating so many great scoring opportunities around the rim, why do the bulk of those opportunities revolve around Rondo? Why weren't there a largish amount of points scored where Paul passed to Kevin, Ray passed to Paul or KG passed to Shaq?

  The scores at the rim that the Celts got that didn't involve Rondo were about the same as the amount of scores at the rim the Hornets got that didn't involve CP3. If your claims about greatly increased numbers are true, there should be a significant difference between the two. Why isn't there?

I'm not claiming greatly increased numbers. I'm claiming that Chris Paul would get 1 more basket at the rim, and would assist one more basket at the rim.

That's not greatly increased numbers, that's 1 assist and 1 more layup a game. You're the one who is claiming that Rondo's mythical ability to get to the rim and create at the rim are somehow beyond Chris Paul's abilities.

EDIT: Look at Rondo's numbers at HoopData. 30% of his baskets at the rim were assisted. 12.5 of Paul's baskets at the rim were assisted. Its certainly within the realm of reason that the disparity there would remedy its self if Paul had more capable teammates.

[Greenbean]

And Tim, you understand at this point you're arguing that Paul Pierce, Ray Allen, and Kevin Garnett, 3 players who are perennial all-stars, HOFers in waiting, acknowledged as capable, competent leaders and among the headiest most intelligent players at their position, are somehow not a considerable boon to Rajon Rondo's baseline performance.

  I know perfectly well who Rondo plays with. But, just for perspective, did you happen to see how the "3 players who are perennial all-stars, HOFers in waiting, acknowledged as capable, competent leaders and among the headiest most intelligent players at their position" fared against the Heat when Rondo wasn't playing? If those three players are creating so many great scoring opportunities around the rim, why do the bulk of those opportunities revolve around Rondo? Why weren't there a largish amount of points scored where Paul passed to Kevin, Ray passed to Paul or KG passed to Shaq?

  The scores at the rim that the Celts got that didn't involve Rondo were about the same as the amount of scores at the rim the Hornets got that didn't involve CP3. If your claims about greatly increased numbers are true, there should be a significant difference between the two. Why isn't there?

Do you really think that if Chris Paul were on the Celtics, that they would turn into a stagnant offense that sits aroung waiting to shoot jumpshots?

Forget about those "at the rim" stats for a second. Do you think replacing Rondo with a more efficient scorer and just as good a passer (who turns the ball over less), will make us a less efficient offense?