Rondo/JO to Cavs for Baron Davis/Varejao

[KungPoweChicken]

The salaries, as I'm sure has been pointed out, don't work. Otherwise, sign me up for this deal. I think it makes the Celtics a better team, though it crushes their cap flexibility.

[Cman]

It's just amazing to me that we have a player in Rondo who is already an elite player, and who has good only knows how much potential, who has improved every year, and already we've traded him 500 times this offseason, in our imaginations. 

I'm more interested in imagining how good he could be next year.

I understand where you're coming from.

The way I view trade proposals is that it helps you to think about how the play will improve or not for various players in the future.  As you read through lots of pages with people dissecting a trade proposal this is a topic that comes up a lot (e.g.: there was a discussion above about whether this was a "bad year" for Rondo bc of injuries or whether this is a good as it gets for him -- that's basically a discussion about how he will improve, or not, next year).

In other words, trade proposals are not necessarily because you want to trade the players involved, it is more to get a sense of what the value is of a given player (not just in a financial sense, but to the immediate and long term success of the Celtics).

[Cman]

The salaries, as I'm sure has been pointed out, don't work. Otherwise, sign me up for this deal. I think it makes the Celtics a better team, though it crushes their cap flexibility.

Salaries would work if the trade included Avery Bradley.

[paulball2007]

Honestly I'm sick of all the Rondo trade ideas.  If you want him gone that bad root for the heat.  Rondo should be a C for life.

[BballTim]

I think it is an interesting idea that falls in the realm of "possible".  TP.

The potential downside is chemistry issues, especially given how important a PG is to a team.  But Baron Davis and PP are very good friends so maybe less of an issue.  Baron's offensive skills would force other teams to cover him, opening things up more for PP, RA and KG.  Clearly the Cs need a center, and like Varejao or not, he would be an upgrade over what we now have.  Fingers crossed that he recovers from his injury.

It would kill the Cs shot at signing a FA in 2012, but with cap holds in place because of KG and RA, there may not have been that much room anyway, and besides, no clear indication that the Cs would be able to sign a quality FA anyway...

If the Cs are able to get a draft pick as well, that's just icing on the cake.

EDIT: Without the draft pick, this would be an example of the Cs trying to extend the window.  With the draft pick, this would be Cs trying to extend the window, while also building for the future.

  Baron Davis hasn't been close to the player Rondo has been since 2008.

Right, which is why a draft pick would have to be included.

  I meant that you're "extending the window" with a big downgrade at the pg spot. You'd more likely be closing it.

I agree it is a downgrade, but I guess I disagree with you as to how much of a downgrade.  In any case, it is not a one-one trade. 

I think the trade would extend the window for a few reasons: (1) Varejao is better than any realistic FA target the Cs could get in the offseason.  (2) Varejao strikes me as hungry and motivated, and he has the type of energy that our vets could feed off, the type of energy that KG used to bring.  (3) Davis, while clearly on the downside of his career, would be re-energized playing on a legit title contender (for really the first time in his life); I bet his play would improve over where it's been the past couple years. (4) Because Davis is such an offensive threat, there would be fewer defenders on the Big Three, meaning they'd be less worn down comes playoffs.

  Maybe. DOn't mind AV, but it's something of a stretch to say Davis has been a big offensive threat over the last few years. Certainly not to the point that defenses will pay more attention to him than the big three or even as much. And I don't know that it's less likely that Rondo will make good strides with his jumper than Davis will suddenly become re-energized after at least 3 years or so of mediocre play.

[Cman]

And I don't know that it's less likely that Rondo will make good strides with his jumper than Davis will suddenly become re-energized after at least 3 years or so of mediocre play.

For me that call is easy.  It's the latter.

[BballTim]

And I don't know that it's less likely that Rondo will make good strides with his jumper than Davis will suddenly become re-energized after at least 3 years or so of mediocre play.

For me that call is easy.  It's the latter.

  Maybe. I still think there must be a better reason for mediocre play three years in a row than "he wasn't on a contending team".

[Cman]

And I don't know that it's less likely that Rondo will make good strides with his jumper than Davis will suddenly become re-energized after at least 3 years or so of mediocre play.

For me that call is easy.  It's the latter.

  Maybe. I still think there must be a better reason for mediocre play three years in a row than "he wasn't on a contending team".

Fair enough.
In my case I think we're fooling ourselves if we think that Rondo will suddenly develop a jumper.  Do we really think he hasn't "tried hard enough" to do this over the course of his career?
 

[rocknrollforyoursoul]

Varejao would be a good addition to any team, but Boston shouldn't touch Davis with a 10-foot pole. I live near L.A. and saw, when he was with the Clippers, how this guy operates: selfish, mailing it in all the time. Talented, yes, but also a headcase.

[dtrader]

Varejao would be a good addition to any team, but Boston shouldn't touch Davis with a 10-foot pole. I live near L.A. and saw, when he was with the Clippers, how this guy operates: selfish, mailing it in all the time. Talented, yes, but also a headcase.

Baron was never healthy, and was playing for an organization thats so disfunctional, that he was basically being harrassed DURING games by the owner.  Baron started this year horrible, but was playing like a top 5-7 PG the last few months before the clips traded him.  Healthy and in a good system, I think he'd excel.

[dtrader]

Varejao would be a good addition to any team, but Boston shouldn't touch Davis with a 10-foot pole. I live near L.A. and saw, when he was with the Clippers, how this guy operates: selfish, mailing it in all the time. Talented, yes, but also a headcase.