Author Topic: "You have to take that shot"  (Read 12312 times)

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"You have to take that shot"
« on: April 19, 2011, 08:22:30 PM »

Offline ballin

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Ah, the venerable old cliche, "If the defense gives you that shot, you have to take it."

Oft repeated, and accepted as part of basketball coaching canon. But is it true?

Well, let's start with the obvious fact that not every player is adept at every shot. For example, Kevin Garnett is an amazing player who can shoot from all over the floor. Except from 3 point range. Yet his lack of 3 point range should not take away from his HOF-bound career; in fact, it's largely irrelevant. Why? Because he very rarely shoots from 3. Instead, Garnett focuses on his strengths like banging in the post and stepping in for long 2 pointers. KG hides his weaknesses and plays to his strengths, and that's part of why he's so great.


Bottom line: great players don't take shots they can't make. Doing otherwise hurts the team.


So it begs the question: why does Rondo take so many shots that he can't make? Moreover, why do so many people WANT him to take shots that he has a proven inability to make? Off in the distance I hear the rumblings, "You have to take that shot."

Let's take the first half of tonight as a microcosm. Rondo is something like 7/7 at the rim, and 0/4 when he takes those uncontested jumpshots everyone thinks he has to take. But why does he have to take those shots when he's PROVEN he can get to the rim or the foul line at will? Further, I've noted that there was at least 5 seconds of shotclock time when each of those shots was taken, and often much more. One of those shots was taken at the very beginning of the shotclock.

The bottom line is, like Garnett, Rondo does not have to take that shot to be at his best. In fact, taking that shot makes him worse. Will he someday have to master that shot when the Big 3 retires? Yes, probably. But today is not that day, and Rondo has yet to master it. So he shouldn't take it. He CAN and he MUST continue to find better shots for himself or his teammates unless it's a desperation shot with 1 second left on the shotclock.

And, as I like to do, I'll address the argument most likely to come up: that the more Rondo takes that shot, the more confident he'll become and the better at it he'll be. Yes, that sounds nice, but unfortunately evidence doesn't bear that out. Rondo has been taking that shot all season now and he's obviously as "comfortable" taking it as he'll ever be. His shooting from that range, if anything, has gotten worse as the season goes on.

Which is no surprise... improvements to shooting is accomplished by putting up tens of thousands of shots in practice and the off-season. It's a matter of repetition, and the extra 5 jumpshots that Rondo might take a game are NOT going to help him improve. It's literally a drop in the improvement bucket, and people who are hoping that he'll improve by taking that shot in games are deluding themselves.

So please, stop saying that Rondo "has to take that shot."

Re: "You have to take that shot"
« Reply #1 on: April 19, 2011, 08:42:27 PM »

Offline Neurotic Guy

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When Rondo plays confident and not cocky, he is phenomenal. I think that missing open j's hurts his confidence. I agree with you.  Play to strength.

Re: "You have to take that shot"
« Reply #2 on: April 19, 2011, 08:44:23 PM »

Offline dtrader

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I dont have any issue with him passing up jump shots to look for better options, but he should stop passing up layups (regardless of the reason)

Re: "You have to take that shot"
« Reply #3 on: April 19, 2011, 09:06:47 PM »

Offline jambr380

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I know what you are saying, but game situation shots are much much different than practice shots. You are right, he does need to take tens of thousands of shots in practice to learn, but he also needs to do it in a game to really improve his confidence.

Now, should he be doing it in the playoffs? No, not really, but a couple here and there won't hurt. I agree that he should go to his strength as much as possible. He was amazing going to the hoop in the first half.

Re: "You have to take that shot"
« Reply #4 on: April 19, 2011, 09:59:40 PM »

Offline rtifishul

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This was a well-thought out argument, and yet I disagree. Those are free points that the defense is giving him, and if there are no options, he should take that shot, as opposed to being forced to make something happen that isn't there.

Re: "You have to take that shot"
« Reply #5 on: April 19, 2011, 11:35:46 PM »

Offline Celtics18

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http://www.hoopdata.com/shotstats.aspx?team=%&type=pg&posi=PG&yr=2011&gp=0&mins=30

He shot above the league average from 16-23 ft. for the regular season among point guards playing over 30 minutes per game, better than notables such as Rose, Westbrook, Parker, Wall, and Jennings. 

He took more than 3 mid range jumpers a game.

He's hit his share in the first two games of the Knicks series.  It's definitely not my favorite shot for the Celtics, but if guys are backing off him, he can and will pull up and make a respectable amount of those jumpers. 
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Re: "You have to take that shot"
« Reply #6 on: April 19, 2011, 11:37:48 PM »

Offline Senninsage

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i take no issue with Rondo taking those shots anymore because he hit a very big one for us late in this game, and there are also games where he hits more than 2 or 3 of those for us.

Let him do his thing, clearly it is helping us in our times of need.

Still, I would honestly love to see Ray take more shots. He's such a [dang] incredible player.

Re: "You have to take that shot"
« Reply #7 on: April 19, 2011, 11:40:15 PM »

Offline dark_lord

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in all honesty, i could careless about rondo's outside shot.  his focus, with regards to shooting, should be free throws!

Re: "You have to take that shot"
« Reply #8 on: April 19, 2011, 11:42:11 PM »

Offline BASS_THUMPER

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in all honesty, i could careless about rondo's outside shot.  his focus, with regards to shooting, should be free throws!


well when they leave him wide open he should be able to hit it

Re: "You have to take that shot"
« Reply #9 on: April 19, 2011, 11:44:12 PM »

Offline dark_lord

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in all honesty, i could careless about rondo's outside shot.  his focus, with regards to shooting, should be free throws!


well when they leave him wide open he should be able to hit it

in a perfect world yes....but all players have a flaw.  his is his shooting.  with his style of play, his focus should be on free throws.

Re: "You have to take that shot"
« Reply #10 on: April 19, 2011, 11:48:00 PM »

Offline GreenEnvy

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I don't think us fans realize how good the pro's are and how difficult it is to hit shots during an NBA game.

I am willing to bet KG can hit 3's better than any poster on here can hit FT's.

Heinsohn has repeatedly said Perkins has range on his jumper, just he couldn't knock it down consistently during a game.

Every NBA player, even the worst of them, is an amazing basketball player. If you saw Jarred Jeffries playing in your local Y, he would be jaw-dropping good.

I'm sure Rondo can hit 3's at a better clip than he has shown. I remember him hitting a flurry in a row during his H-O-R-S-E shoot-off against Durant during last year's all-star weekend.



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Re: "You have to take that shot"
« Reply #11 on: April 19, 2011, 11:55:56 PM »

Offline thirstyboots18

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I know what you are saying, but game situation shots are much much different than practice shots. You are right, he does need to take tens of thousands of shots in practice to learn, but he also needs to do it in a game to really improve his confidence.

Now, should he be doing it in the playoffs? No, not really, but a couple here and there won't hurt. I agree that he should go to his strength as much as possible. He was amazing going to the hoop in the first half.
I agree with you on this.  When he attacks the basket the defense has to make a decision...cover rondo or cover KG and Ray.   If they collapse on Rondo, he can pass out to KG or Ray...if not, he can get a sure two, possible and one.  He should not be shooting jumpers, IMO.   Neither should Davis unless he is in closer to the basket and is NOT covered.  Doc does not seem to agree with me or if he does, Davis is not listening...Jump shots should only be taken by those really good at them, i.e. KG and Ray, or in the flow of the game.  Again, my opinion.
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Re: "You have to take that shot"
« Reply #12 on: April 20, 2011, 12:15:27 AM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

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He has to shoot some wide open shots to keep the defense honest just a little. I cringe too, but he really has to. 

His BIG disappointment for me is he can't make a freakin free=throw to save his life.  He shoots as bad as DH .

Rondo and DH on the same team would be the worst foul shooting starters in NBA history....casue Shaq at least had guards that could make a free throw ;D

Re: "You have to take that shot"
« Reply #13 on: April 20, 2011, 12:22:48 AM »

Offline blink

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Call me immature, but the thing I REALLY want to see Rondo do is turn some of these open court layups into DUNKS.  I remember last year when Rondo would come up with the big throw down that it really pumped up the C's and the crowd.  I am glad he is being way more aggressive and getting to the cup, but just once lay the hammer down and use that vertical leap to leave a forceful dunk in the defender's face.  It just takes the steam out of the other team and that is what we seem to be lacking at times, the killer instinct. 

But all that said, Rondo was awesome tonight...I love watching that dude play.

Re: "You have to take that shot"
« Reply #14 on: April 20, 2011, 12:23:07 AM »

Offline jaser

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I don't think us fans realize how good the pro's are and how difficult it is to hit shots during an NBA game.

I am willing to bet KG can hit 3's better than any poster on here can hit FT's.

Heinsohn has repeatedly said Perkins has range on his jumper, just he couldn't knock it down consistently during a game.

Every NBA player, even the worst of them, is an amazing basketball player. If you saw Jarred Jeffries playing in your local Y, he would be jaw-dropping good.

I'm sure Rondo can hit 3's at a better clip than he has shown. I remember him hitting a flurry in a row during his H-O-R-S-E shoot-off against Durant during last year's all-star weekend.



I wouldn't be surprised if Shaq can break my ankles with a crossover, too.

my thoughts exactly! i was gonna point out that game of HORSE against Durant too! I think they went like 8/8 on the 3pt. line at one point! It got to point where it got boring! I think with Rondo, it is mostly mental.