Jeff Green Going Forward

[jr_3421]

I know this has been talked about before on other threads but I really want to know what people think of the Jeff Green situation going into the playoffs. After seeing him play big minutes in the starting line up the past two games (albeit against inferior competition), we got to see a glimpse of what this player could offer.

Obviously we have two options. Danny could see Green as Pierce's replacement at the SF position. I think he and Rondo have the potential to develop some great chemistry. I also think that while he would replace Pierce in terms of position, Green will never be first or second option on a championship team. Danny would somehow have to acquire a #1 option scoring wise at the SG position (most likely through free agency considering our trade assets).

The other option is to use Green as trade bait. Since his value has definitely gone down since he has been with us, I'm not sure how much we could get for him.

As of now I am on the side of developing him along side Rondo rather than using him in a trade package. Thoughts?

[slamtheking]

I know this has been talked about before on other threads but I really want to know what people think of the Jeff Green situation going into the playoffs. After seeing him play big minutes in the starting line up the past two games (albeit against inferior competition), we got to see a glimpse of what this player could offer.

Obviously we have two options. Danny could see Green as Pierce's replacement at the SF position. I think he and Rondo have the potential to develop some great chemistry. I also think that while he would replace Pierce in terms of position, Green will never be first or second option on a championship team. Danny would somehow have to acquire a #1 option scoring wise at the SG position (most likely through free agency considering our trade assets).

The other option is to use Green as trade bait. Since his value has definitely gone down since he has been with us, I'm not sure how much we could get for him.

As of now I am on the side of developing him along side Rondo rather than using him in a trade package. Thoughts?

he'll be stuck behind PP until PP retires.  it's a bad fit based on the roster.  it's like using a thoroughbred to give pony rides at a kid's party

[mc34]

I realize its a stretch and shouldn't be a factor on our decision to keep him or not, but if we manage to land Dwight in 2012, not only could Jeff play backup to Paul, Dwight would pretty much cover up all of Jeff's defensive problems at the 4.

Disregarding that though, I like his game a lot and there's still a lot of upside. He definately could learn a ton from Paul and KG. I'd like to think we didn't give up Perk for a rental.

[the_Bird]

Yeah, his experience in OKC shows that you don't want to give him more than spot minutes at PF, and I'm not convinced you want to play Pierce all that much at the SG.  Both guys should be playing the small forward.

The bigger challenge/issue is his contract status.  He's a restricted free agent and pretty likely to command a multi-year offer; based on his production as a starter, figure minimum of three years, probably something between the MLE and $10M/year.  If I were guessing, I'd say he's likely to sign an offer sheet for something around the deal that Perk got; four years, ~$8M per.

Celtics have ~$28M in salaries committed after 2012, just counting Pierce, Rondo, and Avery Bradley's $1.6M.  Add in $8M for Jeff Green, we're up to $36M.  You've got cap holds for players like KG and Ray that are expiring, and you've got small cap holds for the other roster spots.

Even if you renounced Bird rights to KG and Ray, that's not leaving much room to acquire Dwight Howard or any other max-level free agent that summer.  If you commit to Jeff Green as one of the team's building blocks, that severely limits what Danny may be able to do in a years' time.  

I haven't see enough from Green to make me want him to be one of the building blocks, especially not when Pierce is already signed through '13-'14.  And, it's hard to see Green wanting to commit to staying here, when he *is* good enough to start for a lot of teams.

Just not a great fit in Boston.  

[vinnie]

So what exactly did we see in those two games that were played at an NBA pre-season level or even worse, NBDL level? We saw Green take 20 shots to score 20 points against The Wizards and he took 13 shots to score 14 points against the Knicks. So, while the point numbers are okay, that is hardly what I call efficient. The 15 rebounds versus Washington is impressive, because it shows that if he is interested, he might be able to get more boards. However, against the Knicks, he fell back to 8 boards. He also showed an occasional nice touch on his 18-20-foot jumpshot, which might come in handy in the playoffs.
I don't hate Jeff Green as a player and he seems like a really nice guy. I thought it was cool that the Celts had him address the crowd last night, but who really cares about that stuff.

Bottom line to me is he is not a Celtics' type player. He also is not a guy around whom you build a championship team.

It will be interesting to see if some team drops a huge contract on him in the offseason and the Celts refuse to match. My guess, however, is his time in Boston has not helped him in terms of what kind of offer he might be able to get.

Jeff Green appears to be a highly skilled basketball player who isn't tough, isn't aggresive, but is a really nice guy.

[blackberry33]

I know this has been talked about before on other threads but I really want to know what people think of the Jeff Green situation going into the playoffs. After seeing him play big minutes in the starting line up the past two games (albeit against inferior competition), we got to see a glimpse of what this player could offer.

Obviously we have two options. Danny could see Green as Pierce's replacement at the SF position. I think he and Rondo have the potential to develop some great chemistry. I also think that while he would replace Pierce in terms of position, Green will never be first or second option on a championship team. Danny would somehow have to acquire a #1 option scoring wise at the SG position (most likely through free agency considering our trade assets).

The other option is to use Green as trade bait. Since his value has definitely gone down since he has been with us, I'm not sure how much we could get for him.

As of now I am on the side of developing him along side Rondo rather than using him in a trade package. Thoughts?

He is the future

[JBcat]

I know this has been talked about before on other threads but I really want to know what people think of the Jeff Green situation going into the playoffs. After seeing him play big minutes in the starting line up the past two games (albeit against inferior competition), we got to see a glimpse of what this player could offer.

Obviously we have two options. Danny could see Green as Pierce's replacement at the SF position. I think he and Rondo have the potential to develop some great chemistry. I also think that while he would replace Pierce in terms of position, Green will never be first or second option on a championship team. Danny would somehow have to acquire a #1 option scoring wise at the SG position (most likely through free agency considering our trade assets).

The other option is to use Green as trade bait. Since his value has definitely gone down since he has been with us, I'm not sure how much we could get for him.

As of now I am on the side of developing him along side Rondo rather than using him in a trade package. Thoughts?

he'll be stuck behind PP until PP retires.  it's a bad fit based on the roster.  it's like using a thoroughbred to give pony rides at a kid's party

I mentioned this in another thread that from the small samples I've seen I've really liked the Green and Pierce combo at the small forward and shooting guards spots.   It didn't seem to hurt them and I think Green can guard 2 guards.   It also gives them 2 post up players if the big guys are drifting to the outside.  

As far as minutes for next year going forward if Green is brought back why not something like;
Green 36 MPG SF
Pierce 30 MPG SF/SG
Allen 30 MPG SG

Since we've had Green our hand has almost been forced to use him at PF because of our injuries but I don't want to really see him used there going forward.   I actually wouldn't mind Allen's minutes cut even a little more as he gets older so this could work out well.  I think if used in the right role he can help keep Pierce and Allen fresh while getting starter minutes again.  

Even with Green's inconsistent play since he has been here he is still averaging 10 PPG off the bench.   In an expended role next season I see no reason why he couldn't get back to at the very least 15 PPG.  

[Yogi]

I know this has been talked about before on other threads but I really want to know what people think of the Jeff Green situation going into the playoffs. After seeing him play big minutes in the starting line up the past two games (albeit against inferior competition), we got to see a glimpse of what this player could offer.

Obviously we have two options. Danny could see Green as Pierce's replacement at the SF position. I think he and Rondo have the potential to develop some great chemistry. I also think that while he would replace Pierce in terms of position, Green will never be first or second option on a championship team. Danny would somehow have to acquire a #1 option scoring wise at the SG position (most likely through free agency considering our trade assets).

The other option is to use Green as trade bait. Since his value has definitely gone down since he has been with us, I'm not sure how much we could get for him.

As of now I am on the side of developing him along side Rondo rather than using him in a trade package. Thoughts?

he'll be stuck behind PP until PP retires.  it's a bad fit based on the roster.  it's like using a thoroughbred to give pony rides at a kid's party

I mentioned this in another thread that from the small samples I've seen I've really liked the Green and Pierce combo at the small forward and shooting guards spots.   It didn't seem to hurt them and I think Green can guard 2 guards.   It also gives them 2 post up players if the big guys are drifting to the outside.  

As far as minutes for next year going forward if Green is brought back why not something like;
Green 36 MPG SF
Pierce 30 MPG SF/SG
Allen 30 MPG SG

Since we've had Green our hand has almost been forced to use him at PF because of our injuries but I don't want to really see him used there going forward.   I actually wouldn't mind Allen's minutes cut even a little more as he gets older so this could work out well.  I think if used in the right role he can help keep Pierce and Allen fresh while getting starter minutes again.  

Even with Green's inconsistent play since he has been here he is still averaging 10 PPG off the bench.   In an expended role next season I see no reason why he couldn't get back to at the very least 15 PPG.  

Delonte West is also good for 15 min at SG... per season.

[Steve Weinman]

A year on the qualifying offer or simply letting him walk both seem like reasonable options.

-sw

[Bankshot]

A year on the qualifying offer or simply letting him walk both seem like reasonable options.

-sw

Considering what you gave up to get him, letting him walk is not reasonable at all.

And I don't agree with those saying you can't build around Green.  You can build around anyone you want to.  You just have to make sure you build around him with talent that is better than he is.

Danny built around Pierce (which people previously said you can't build around a SF, and that you can only build around a Center or PG - simply not true). 

[the_Bird]

And I don't agree with those saying you can't build around Green.  You can build around anyone you want to.  You just have to make sure you build around him with talent that is better than he is.

Well, the point is that if you're going to commit to Green (by signing him to the kind of long-term contract he's going to be looking for), you're inherently limiting your ability to bring in those better players.  

If I'm building a team, I'd really want those players I built around to at least be reasonable candidates for the All Star game.  You built around Piece because he was a perennial All-Star.  You can build around Rondo because when he's on, he's one of the most dominant players in the game (he's just not always "on").

I look at the wings who made last year's squad; Ray and Pierce, Lebron and Wade, Joe Johnson, Ginobili, Kobe, Carmelo, Durant...  and I don't really see how it's realistic to expect Jeff Green to develop to that level.  There's maybe a 20% chance he develops to be a Joe Johnson-type player, but I don't see Green ever getting to the level of those other guys.  I just don't see him as being the building block for a championship-caliber team.

And yeah, Green is young.  24 isn't THAT young in the NBA, not when you've already logged as many minutes as he has over four full seasons, not after playing three seasons in a strong conference (without ever really dominating, FWIW).  

[Marcus13]

I certainly hope that he's not part of the long-term plans.  But if he's not...it makes the trade even worse.  Definitely a lose-lose situation

[Steve Weinman]

A year on the qualifying offer or simply letting him walk both seem like reasonable options.

-sw

Considering what you gave up to get him, letting him walk is not reasonable at all.

And I don't agree with those saying you can't build around Green.  You can build around anyone you want to.  You just have to make sure you build around him with talent that is better than he is.

Danny built around Pierce (which people previously said you can't build around a SF, and that you can only build around a Center or PG - simply not true). 

The issue of what the Celtics gave up to get Green is a sunk cost, and I don't think it's in the best interest of team-building to allow that to influence the appraisal of Green's value going forward.

For my part, I stand similarly to the_Bird in front-office philosophy - considering the way the NBA trends, I believe that the identities of role players are of minimal concern until the team has its star cornerstones in place.  Making any sort of significant commitment to any one of the former - that may later hamper the ability to acquire the latter - strikes me as a disconcerting idea.

You may have inferred this already from my comments above, but just to be clear: Inefficient scoring forwards who don't rebound and defend or and don't really fit at either the three or the four don't interest me as long-term building blocks.

I understand that there has been some disappointment on the board with what Green has brought to the table as a Celtic.  Personally, I've been pleasantly surprised as he has actually outstripped all previous shooting efficiency and shown a post game that was better than I anticipated.  That makes me fairly okay with him in a reserve role - at reserve money.  As a long-term starter who by all accounts will command something in the range of 50/5 as a free agent? No thanks.

-sw

[Who]

It would be painful to lose Green for nothing or some insignificant sign and trade package in free agency this summer.

[Potapenko Boxout]

jeff green simply isnt as good as i thought he was. this is my fault, i didnt watch the thunder enough.