Rondo is Overrated

[BudweiserCeltic]

 But he could get a few pointers on what Carlos Arroyo did when on the floor. Each time he had his hands on the ball, he was looking to make something happen. At times I think there's too much time wasted while Rondo is controlling the ball, I want to see more improvement in that aspect of his game.

You do remember that Arroyo was just waived and that wasn't the 1st time he has been cut--but you really think Rondo could learn from him??  And you saw that in Arroyo's few minutes in a Celtic uniform?


Arroyo is a 3rd string insurance policy--his decision making was only fair the other night and he was trying very hard to please and make a good impression.   

Ignoring all the irrelevant "facts" you threw out there, it doesn't take away from the fact on what he did on the court on that particular night.

And Arroyo isn't a fruit player, he knows the game, he's a vet who's played in quite a few big games in his life. So yeah, he has things to offer.

  I can't imagine he's played in anywhere near as many big games as Rondo. However, I'd rather Rondo "pick up a few pointer" from Arroyo than some of our other late season vet pg pickups.

Well, you can't forget that Arroyo was the best player in Puerto Rico's international team, and to them International Basketball is more important than NBA players who until recently haven't taken those games seriously.

Anyways, main problem with Arroyo has rarely been a skill/ability standpoint, it's mainly been from an immaturity standpoint. He's a fairly good playmaker, but honestly, he's been an arrogant jackass for the good part of his adult career.

Really?  How so?  I hadn't heard anything like that about him.

His clashes with Sloan for example, his complaints when he wasn't being put to play even when he was actually playing good, from when he was with the PR international team, teammates etc.

He seems to have matured quite a bit since he went to play in Europe, and haven't heard much from his shenanigans as of late (or any for that matter), but honestly I wasn't keeping up much with him.

[Moranis]

Rondo is definately overrated on this board.  I mean there have been a number of threads in which people on this board wouldn't trade him straight up for people like Deron Williams.  I mean come on, seriously.

Rondo is a good PG, but he isn't an elite PG and never will be.  I can say that definitively because Rondo hasn't improved his shooting since he has been in the league.  He is an awful shooter (worst foul shooting of his career by far this year).  His FG% is pretty good because he is excellent at taking the ball to the hole and finishing around the rim, but he is a liability in many respects offensively because he can be left open (including the and 1 situations on the drives).  He is a good defender, but even that is greatly exaggerated on this board.

He isn't a top five PG, and is a borderline top 10 PG right now (I mean if you are building a team for the future you would take Rondo over Nash, but Nash is still better then him, just as an example).  Good but not great, and he greatly benefits from his teammates.  Put him an awful team and his deficiencies would be magnified and would play a much larger role in how he is viewed.  

Simple question, if Rondo and Conley switched teams, who is better?

  Rondo's better than Conley in any and all situations. Just because your main criteria for judging point guards is shooting doesn't mean that people who disagree with you overrate Rondo. I'm sure that if you've ever seen Rondo dominate playoff games your first response was either "Conley could easily do the same thing" or "clearly he's not playing that well because he's not a good outside shooter". But the fact is that he does dominate games in the regular season and (more frequently) in the playoffs in spite of his shooting woes.

  Could a player as poor as you think Rondo is average close to a triple double for consecutive playoff series, or average 21/6/12 in a series against a top 5 defense? Or is your point that practically any point guard can do the same thing? If he's borderline top ten then you should easily be able to name 7-8 other pgs that have shown themselves to be capable of better, right?

These 7 PG's are all clearly better then Rondo right now, in no particular order:

C. Paul
D. Williams
D. Rose
S. Nash
T. Parker
R. Westbrook
J. Kidd

I mentioned Conley because whether people on here want to admit it or not, could be a very similar player to Rondo if their teams were reversed.  Conley isn't the rebounder Rondo is, but he is an excellent defender, a very good passer, and a much better shooter.  Switch teams for them and who is to say who appears better.  Rondo has taken great advantage of his teammates to boost his own stock, I don't think he would look nearly as well on a bad team.  He has too many flaws that are hidden on the Celtics.

[ejk3489]

Rondo is definately overrated on this board.  I mean there have been a number of threads in which people on this board wouldn't trade him straight up for people like Deron Williams.  I mean come on, seriously.

Rondo is a good PG, but he isn't an elite PG and never will be.  I can say that definitively because Rondo hasn't improved his shooting since he has been in the league.  He is an awful shooter (worst foul shooting of his career by far this year).  His FG% is pretty good because he is excellent at taking the ball to the hole and finishing around the rim, but he is a liability in many respects offensively because he can be left open (including the and 1 situations on the drives).  He is a good defender, but even that is greatly exaggerated on this board.

He isn't a top five PG, and is a borderline top 10 PG right now (I mean if you are building a team for the future you would take Rondo over Nash, but Nash is still better then him, just as an example).  Good but not great, and he greatly benefits from his teammates.  Put him an awful team and his deficiencies would be magnified and would play a much larger role in how he is viewed.  

Simple question, if Rondo and Conley switched teams, who is better?

  Rondo's better than Conley in any and all situations. Just because your main criteria for judging point guards is shooting doesn't mean that people who disagree with you overrate Rondo. I'm sure that if you've ever seen Rondo dominate playoff games your first response was either "Conley could easily do the same thing" or "clearly he's not playing that well because he's not a good outside shooter". But the fact is that he does dominate games in the regular season and (more frequently) in the playoffs in spite of his shooting woes.

  Could a player as poor as you think Rondo is average close to a triple double for consecutive playoff series, or average 21/6/12 in a series against a top 5 defense? Or is your point that practically any point guard can do the same thing? If he's borderline top ten then you should easily be able to name 7-8 other pgs that have shown themselves to be capable of better, right?

These PG's are all better then Rondo right now, in no particular order:

C. Paul
D. Williams
D. Rose
S. Nash
T. Parker
R. Westbrook
J. Kidd

So when you say, "Rondo is a good PG, but he isn't an elite PG and never will be.  I can say that definitively because Rondo hasn't improved his shooting since he has been in the league.", did you forget how awful a shooter Jason Kidd was?

Rondo just turned 25...how can you, or anyone else, say that he won't improve?

[BudweiserCeltic]

What stops Rondo from being a "elite" PG is not his shooting. Never understood that notion.

[feckless]

Rondo is definately overrated on this board.  I mean there have been a number of threads in which people on this board wouldn't trade him straight up for people like Deron Williams.  I mean come on, seriously.

Rondo is a good PG, but he isn't an elite PG and never will be.  I can say that definitively because Rondo hasn't improved his shooting since he has been in the league.  He is an awful shooter (worst foul shooting of his career by far this year).  His FG% is pretty good because he is excellent at taking the ball to the hole and finishing around the rim, but he is a liability in many respects offensively because he can be left open (including the and 1 situations on the drives).  He is a good defender, but even that is greatly exaggerated on this board.

He isn't a top five PG, and is a borderline top 10 PG right now (I mean if you are building a team for the future you would take Rondo over Nash, but Nash is still better then him, just as an example).  Good but not great, and he greatly benefits from his teammates.  Put him an awful team and his deficiencies would be magnified and would play a much larger role in how he is viewed.  

Simple question, if Rondo and Conley switched teams, who is better?

  Rondo's better than Conley in any and all situations. Just because your main criteria for judging point guards is shooting doesn't mean that people who disagree with you overrate Rondo. I'm sure that if you've ever seen Rondo dominate playoff games your first response was either "Conley could easily do the same thing" or "clearly he's not playing that well because he's not a good outside shooter". But the fact is that he does dominate games in the regular season and (more frequently) in the playoffs in spite of his shooting woes.

  Could a player as poor as you think Rondo is average close to a triple double for consecutive playoff series, or average 21/6/12 in a series against a top 5 defense? Or is your point that practically any point guard can do the same thing? If he's borderline top ten then you should easily be able to name 7-8 other pgs that have shown themselves to be capable of better, right?

These 7 PG's are all clearly better then Rondo right now, in no particular order:

C. Paul
D. Williams
D. Rose
S. Nash
T. Parker
R. Westbrook
J. Kidd

I mentioned Conley because whether people on here want to admit it or not, could be a very similar player to Rondo if their teams were reversed.  Conley isn't the rebounder Rondo is, but he is an excellent defender, a very good passer, and a much better shooter.  Switch teams for them and who is to say who appears better.  Rondo has taken great advantage of his teammates to boost his own stock, I don't think he would look nearly as well on a bad team.  He has too many flaws that are hidden on the Celtics.

[feckless]

Rondo is definately overrated on this board.  I mean there have been a number of threads in which people on this board wouldn't trade him straight up for people like Deron Williams.  I mean come on, seriously.

Rondo is a good PG, but he isn't an elite PG and never will be.  I can say that definitively because Rondo hasn't improved his shooting since he has been in the league.  He is an awful shooter (worst foul shooting of his career by far this year).  His FG% is pretty good because he is excellent at taking the ball to the hole and finishing around the rim, but he is a liability in many respects offensively because he can be left open (including the and 1 situations on the drives).  He is a good defender, but even that is greatly exaggerated on this board.

He isn't a top five PG, and is a borderline top 10 PG right now (I mean if you are building a team for the future you would take Rondo over Nash, but Nash is still better then him, just as an example).  Good but not great, and he greatly benefits from his teammates.  Put him an awful team and his deficiencies would be magnified and would play a much larger role in how he is viewed.  

Simple question, if Rondo and Conley switched teams, who is better?

  Rondo's better than Conley in any and all situations. Just because your main criteria for judging point guards is shooting doesn't mean that people who disagree with you overrate Rondo. I'm sure that if you've ever seen Rondo dominate playoff games your first response was either "Conley could easily do the same thing" or "clearly he's not playing that well because he's not a good outside shooter". But the fact is that he does dominate games in the regular season and (more frequently) in the playoffs in spite of his shooting woes.

  Could a player as poor as you think Rondo is average close to a triple double for consecutive playoff series, or average 21/6/12 in a series against a top 5 defense? Or is your point that practically any point guard can do the same thing? If he's borderline top ten then you should easily be able to name 7-8 other pgs that have shown themselves to be capable of better, right?

These 7 PG's are all clearly better then Rondo right now, in no particular order:

C. Paul
D. Williams
D. Rose
S. Nash
T. Parker
R. Westbrook
J. Kidd

I mentioned Conley because whether people on here want to admit it or not, could be a very similar player to Rondo if their teams were reversed.  Conley isn't the rebounder Rondo is, but he is an excellent defender, a very good passer, and a much better shooter.  Switch teams for them and who is to say who appears better.  Rondo has taken great advantage of his teammates to boost his own stock, I don't think he would look nearly as well on a bad team.  He has too many flaws that are hidden on the Celtics.

Of the 7 the  PG's Westbrook, Parker and Rose clearly do not run a team anywhere near as effectively as Rondo does--and as to pure point guard skills only Nash and Kidd for sure and maybe Paul have the same understanding of the game.  The only way the list works is if you mix pg skills for some and scoring skills for others.  This method of calculating just doesn't work for me.  Best PG's means best Point Guard not scorer.  I would also mention that Rondo dominates some of these guys regularly and usually plays the others even.  Comparison of head to head wins and loses I also believe would favor Rondo.

[barefacedmonk]

C. Paul
D. Williams
D. Rose
S. Nash
T. Parker
R. Westbrook
J. Kidd

What? No love for Mo Williams, B-diddy, Calderon or Jarret Jack?

[jc3celticsphan]

o geez  another lets bash rondo thread  SMH! after all rondo does for this team and we bash him cuz he has 3 hall of famers next to him so hes not a great pg BLAH BLAH BLAH hes earned the respect of 3 hall of famers and yet ppl still bash him... kg also said in the past rondo would be great and yet YOU still bash him, one bad game get over it

[Moranis]

Rondo is definately overrated on this board.  I mean there have been a number of threads in which people on this board wouldn't trade him straight up for people like Deron Williams.  I mean come on, seriously.

Rondo is a good PG, but he isn't an elite PG and never will be.  I can say that definitively because Rondo hasn't improved his shooting since he has been in the league.  He is an awful shooter (worst foul shooting of his career by far this year).  His FG% is pretty good because he is excellent at taking the ball to the hole and finishing around the rim, but he is a liability in many respects offensively because he can be left open (including the and 1 situations on the drives).  He is a good defender, but even that is greatly exaggerated on this board.

He isn't a top five PG, and is a borderline top 10 PG right now (I mean if you are building a team for the future you would take Rondo over Nash, but Nash is still better then him, just as an example).  Good but not great, and he greatly benefits from his teammates.  Put him an awful team and his deficiencies would be magnified and would play a much larger role in how he is viewed.  

Simple question, if Rondo and Conley switched teams, who is better?

  Rondo's better than Conley in any and all situations. Just because your main criteria for judging point guards is shooting doesn't mean that people who disagree with you overrate Rondo. I'm sure that if you've ever seen Rondo dominate playoff games your first response was either "Conley could easily do the same thing" or "clearly he's not playing that well because he's not a good outside shooter". But the fact is that he does dominate games in the regular season and (more frequently) in the playoffs in spite of his shooting woes.

  Could a player as poor as you think Rondo is average close to a triple double for consecutive playoff series, or average 21/6/12 in a series against a top 5 defense? Or is your point that practically any point guard can do the same thing? If he's borderline top ten then you should easily be able to name 7-8 other pgs that have shown themselves to be capable of better, right?

These PG's are all better then Rondo right now, in no particular order:

C. Paul
D. Williams
D. Rose
S. Nash
T. Parker
R. Westbrook
J. Kidd

So when you say, "Rondo is a good PG, but he isn't an elite PG and never will be.  I can say that definitively because Rondo hasn't improved his shooting since he has been in the league.", did you forget how awful a shooter Jason Kidd was?

Rondo just turned 25...how can you, or anyone else, say that he won't improve?

As a rookie, Jason Kidd shot 69.8% from the line, by his fourth year he was essentially an 80% foul shooter and has been since.  Kidd's third year in the league he shot 37% from the 3PT line.  He was up and down after that, but he pretty much always showed potential to shoot well.  Rondo hasn't ever shown that potential and is actually shooting worse this year, his 5th year in the league.

[Moranis]

Rondo is definately overrated on this board.  I mean there have been a number of threads in which people on this board wouldn't trade him straight up for people like Deron Williams.  I mean come on, seriously.

Rondo is a good PG, but he isn't an elite PG and never will be.  I can say that definitively because Rondo hasn't improved his shooting since he has been in the league.  He is an awful shooter (worst foul shooting of his career by far this year).  His FG% is pretty good because he is excellent at taking the ball to the hole and finishing around the rim, but he is a liability in many respects offensively because he can be left open (including the and 1 situations on the drives).  He is a good defender, but even that is greatly exaggerated on this board.

He isn't a top five PG, and is a borderline top 10 PG right now (I mean if you are building a team for the future you would take Rondo over Nash, but Nash is still better then him, just as an example).  Good but not great, and he greatly benefits from his teammates.  Put him an awful team and his deficiencies would be magnified and would play a much larger role in how he is viewed.  

Simple question, if Rondo and Conley switched teams, who is better?

  Rondo's better than Conley in any and all situations. Just because your main criteria for judging point guards is shooting doesn't mean that people who disagree with you overrate Rondo. I'm sure that if you've ever seen Rondo dominate playoff games your first response was either "Conley could easily do the same thing" or "clearly he's not playing that well because he's not a good outside shooter". But the fact is that he does dominate games in the regular season and (more frequently) in the playoffs in spite of his shooting woes.

  Could a player as poor as you think Rondo is average close to a triple double for consecutive playoff series, or average 21/6/12 in a series against a top 5 defense? Or is your point that practically any point guard can do the same thing? If he's borderline top ten then you should easily be able to name 7-8 other pgs that have shown themselves to be capable of better, right?

These 7 PG's are all clearly better then Rondo right now, in no particular order:

C. Paul
D. Williams
D. Rose
S. Nash
T. Parker
R. Westbrook
J. Kidd

I mentioned Conley because whether people on here want to admit it or not, could be a very similar player to Rondo if their teams were reversed.  Conley isn't the rebounder Rondo is, but he is an excellent defender, a very good passer, and a much better shooter.  Switch teams for them and who is to say who appears better.  Rondo has taken great advantage of his teammates to boost his own stock, I don't think he would look nearly as well on a bad team.  He has too many flaws that are hidden on the Celtics.

Of the 7 the  PG's Westbrook, Parker and Rose clearly do not run a team anywhere near as effectively as Rondo does--and as to pure point guard skills only Nash and Kidd for sure and maybe Paul have the same understanding of the game.  The only way the list works is if you mix pg skills for some and scoring skills for others.  This method of calculating just doesn't work for me.  Best PG's means best Point Guard not scorer.  I would also mention that Rondo dominates some of these guys regularly and usually plays the others even.  Comparison of head to head wins and loses I also believe would favor Rondo.

Westbrook, Parker, and Rose are required to take on a larger scoring roll then Rondo is, that changes how they run their teams. 

As to the rest of your argument, that is pretty much my point.  Rondo's teammates give him a lot more freedom to do what he does on both ends of the floor.  On a lesser team, his flaws will be magnified not hidden. 

[BballTim]

Rondo is definately overrated on this board.  I mean there have been a number of threads in which people on this board wouldn't trade him straight up for people like Deron Williams.  I mean come on, seriously.

Rondo is a good PG, but he isn't an elite PG and never will be.  I can say that definitively because Rondo hasn't improved his shooting since he has been in the league.  He is an awful shooter (worst foul shooting of his career by far this year).  His FG% is pretty good because he is excellent at taking the ball to the hole and finishing around the rim, but he is a liability in many respects offensively because he can be left open (including the and 1 situations on the drives).  He is a good defender, but even that is greatly exaggerated on this board.

He isn't a top five PG, and is a borderline top 10 PG right now (I mean if you are building a team for the future you would take Rondo over Nash, but Nash is still better then him, just as an example).  Good but not great, and he greatly benefits from his teammates.  Put him an awful team and his deficiencies would be magnified and would play a much larger role in how he is viewed.  

Simple question, if Rondo and Conley switched teams, who is better?

  Rondo's better than Conley in any and all situations. Just because your main criteria for judging point guards is shooting doesn't mean that people who disagree with you overrate Rondo. I'm sure that if you've ever seen Rondo dominate playoff games your first response was either "Conley could easily do the same thing" or "clearly he's not playing that well because he's not a good outside shooter". But the fact is that he does dominate games in the regular season and (more frequently) in the playoffs in spite of his shooting woes.

  Could a player as poor as you think Rondo is average close to a triple double for consecutive playoff series, or average 21/6/12 in a series against a top 5 defense? Or is your point that practically any point guard can do the same thing? If he's borderline top ten then you should easily be able to name 7-8 other pgs that have shown themselves to be capable of better, right?

These 7 PG's are all clearly better then Rondo right now, in no particular order:

C. Paul
D. Williams
D. Rose
S. Nash
T. Parker
R. Westbrook
J. Kidd

I mentioned Conley because whether people on here want to admit it or not, could be a very similar player to Rondo if their teams were reversed.  Conley isn't the rebounder Rondo is, but he is an excellent defender, a very good passer, and a much better shooter.  Switch teams for them and who is to say who appears better.  Rondo has taken great advantage of his teammates to boost his own stock, I don't think he would look nearly as well on a bad team.  He has too many flaws that are hidden on the Celtics.

  Not too many people would consider putting Parker or Westbrook that high up, and nobody would with Conley. Kidd's no better than Rondo. Nash arguably is this year but that's been far from the case the last few years. You could argue the other three, but again it's debatable. Rondo generally plays even up with Rose and Williams head to head.

[BballTim]

Rondo is definately overrated on this board.  I mean there have been a number of threads in which people on this board wouldn't trade him straight up for people like Deron Williams.  I mean come on, seriously.

Rondo is a good PG, but he isn't an elite PG and never will be.  I can say that definitively because Rondo hasn't improved his shooting since he has been in the league.  He is an awful shooter (worst foul shooting of his career by far this year).  His FG% is pretty good because he is excellent at taking the ball to the hole and finishing around the rim, but he is a liability in many respects offensively because he can be left open (including the and 1 situations on the drives).  He is a good defender, but even that is greatly exaggerated on this board.

He isn't a top five PG, and is a borderline top 10 PG right now (I mean if you are building a team for the future you would take Rondo over Nash, but Nash is still better then him, just as an example).  Good but not great, and he greatly benefits from his teammates.  Put him an awful team and his deficiencies would be magnified and would play a much larger role in how he is viewed.  

Simple question, if Rondo and Conley switched teams, who is better?

  Rondo's better than Conley in any and all situations. Just because your main criteria for judging point guards is shooting doesn't mean that people who disagree with you overrate Rondo. I'm sure that if you've ever seen Rondo dominate playoff games your first response was either "Conley could easily do the same thing" or "clearly he's not playing that well because he's not a good outside shooter". But the fact is that he does dominate games in the regular season and (more frequently) in the playoffs in spite of his shooting woes.

  Could a player as poor as you think Rondo is average close to a triple double for consecutive playoff series, or average 21/6/12 in a series against a top 5 defense? Or is your point that practically any point guard can do the same thing? If he's borderline top ten then you should easily be able to name 7-8 other pgs that have shown themselves to be capable of better, right?

These PG's are all better then Rondo right now, in no particular order:

C. Paul
D. Williams
D. Rose
S. Nash
T. Parker
R. Westbrook
J. Kidd

So when you say, "Rondo is a good PG, but he isn't an elite PG and never will be.  I can say that definitively because Rondo hasn't improved his shooting since he has been in the league.", did you forget how awful a shooter Jason Kidd was?

Rondo just turned 25...how can you, or anyone else, say that he won't improve?

  Yes, being a poor shooter stops a pg from being elite. Just ask Kidd or Magic or Payton.

[Chris]

Rondo is definately overrated on this board.  I mean there have been a number of threads in which people on this board wouldn't trade him straight up for people like Deron Williams.  I mean come on, seriously.

Rondo is a good PG, but he isn't an elite PG and never will be.  I can say that definitively because Rondo hasn't improved his shooting since he has been in the league.  He is an awful shooter (worst foul shooting of his career by far this year).  His FG% is pretty good because he is excellent at taking the ball to the hole and finishing around the rim, but he is a liability in many respects offensively because he can be left open (including the and 1 situations on the drives).  He is a good defender, but even that is greatly exaggerated on this board.

He isn't a top five PG, and is a borderline top 10 PG right now (I mean if you are building a team for the future you would take Rondo over Nash, but Nash is still better then him, just as an example).  Good but not great, and he greatly benefits from his teammates.  Put him an awful team and his deficiencies would be magnified and would play a much larger role in how he is viewed.  

Simple question, if Rondo and Conley switched teams, who is better?

  Rondo's better than Conley in any and all situations. Just because your main criteria for judging point guards is shooting doesn't mean that people who disagree with you overrate Rondo. I'm sure that if you've ever seen Rondo dominate playoff games your first response was either "Conley could easily do the same thing" or "clearly he's not playing that well because he's not a good outside shooter". But the fact is that he does dominate games in the regular season and (more frequently) in the playoffs in spite of his shooting woes.

  Could a player as poor as you think Rondo is average close to a triple double for consecutive playoff series, or average 21/6/12 in a series against a top 5 defense? Or is your point that practically any point guard can do the same thing? If he's borderline top ten then you should easily be able to name 7-8 other pgs that have shown themselves to be capable of better, right?

These PG's are all better then Rondo right now, in no particular order:

C. Paul
D. Williams
D. Rose
S. Nash
T. Parker
R. Westbrook
J. Kidd

So when you say, "Rondo is a good PG, but he isn't an elite PG and never will be.  I can say that definitively because Rondo hasn't improved his shooting since he has been in the league.", did you forget how awful a shooter Jason Kidd was?

Rondo just turned 25...how can you, or anyone else, say that he won't improve?

  Yes, being a poor shooter stops a pg from being elite. Just ask Kidd or Magic or Payton.

True, but all of them were better shooters than he is at this point when they were at their best, and more importantly, they would not hesitate to take the shot when left open.

That is the biggest issue with Rondo's shooting.  Not that he can't hit the shot, but that he will go through stretches when he will refuse to shoot, despite the fact it would be the best decision based on what the defense is giving them.

If Rondo wants to get to the next level, he needs to get over that, and become comfortable enough with that midrange jumper to take it when he needs to, in order to keep defenses honest.

[BballTim]

Rondo is definately overrated on this board.  I mean there have been a number of threads in which people on this board wouldn't trade him straight up for people like Deron Williams.  I mean come on, seriously.

Rondo is a good PG, but he isn't an elite PG and never will be.  I can say that definitively because Rondo hasn't improved his shooting since he has been in the league.  He is an awful shooter (worst foul shooting of his career by far this year).  His FG% is pretty good because he is excellent at taking the ball to the hole and finishing around the rim, but he is a liability in many respects offensively because he can be left open (including the and 1 situations on the drives).  He is a good defender, but even that is greatly exaggerated on this board.

He isn't a top five PG, and is a borderline top 10 PG right now (I mean if you are building a team for the future you would take Rondo over Nash, but Nash is still better then him, just as an example).  Good but not great, and he greatly benefits from his teammates.  Put him an awful team and his deficiencies would be magnified and would play a much larger role in how he is viewed.  

Simple question, if Rondo and Conley switched teams, who is better?

  Rondo's better than Conley in any and all situations. Just because your main criteria for judging point guards is shooting doesn't mean that people who disagree with you overrate Rondo. I'm sure that if you've ever seen Rondo dominate playoff games your first response was either "Conley could easily do the same thing" or "clearly he's not playing that well because he's not a good outside shooter". But the fact is that he does dominate games in the regular season and (more frequently) in the playoffs in spite of his shooting woes.

  Could a player as poor as you think Rondo is average close to a triple double for consecutive playoff series, or average 21/6/12 in a series against a top 5 defense? Or is your point that practically any point guard can do the same thing? If he's borderline top ten then you should easily be able to name 7-8 other pgs that have shown themselves to be capable of better, right?

These PG's are all better then Rondo right now, in no particular order:

C. Paul
D. Williams
D. Rose
S. Nash
T. Parker
R. Westbrook
J. Kidd

So when you say, "Rondo is a good PG, but he isn't an elite PG and never will be.  I can say that definitively because Rondo hasn't improved his shooting since he has been in the league.", did you forget how awful a shooter Jason Kidd was?

Rondo just turned 25...how can you, or anyone else, say that he won't improve?

  Yes, being a poor shooter stops a pg from being elite. Just ask Kidd or Magic or Payton.

True, but all of them were better shooters than he is at this point when they were at their best, and more importantly, they would not hesitate to take the shot when left open.

That is the biggest issue with Rondo's shooting.  Not that he can't hit the shot, but that he will go through stretches when he will refuse to shoot, despite the fact it would be the best decision based on what the defense is giving them.

If Rondo wants to get to the next level, he needs to get over that, and become comfortable enough with that midrange jumper to take it when he needs to, in order to keep defenses honest.

  All of them were better shooters than Rondo when they were at their best (when they were older than Rondo). He's probably not at his peak either. But they were considered elite players before they became great shooters, just like Rondo is. If you compare what Rondo's done to what a lot of the "elites" did by the same point in their careers he's not that far off. And as for his mid-range game, he really doesn't take that many fewer shots from that range than the average pg. If he took that shot based on what the defense gives him he'd take roughly 30 outside shots a game, as defenses will always give Rondo that shot rather than have Ray/Paul/KG taking shots.

[ejk3489]

Rondo is definately overrated on this board.  I mean there have been a number of threads in which people on this board wouldn't trade him straight up for people like Deron Williams.  I mean come on, seriously.

Rondo is a good PG, but he isn't an elite PG and never will be.  I can say that definitively because Rondo hasn't improved his shooting since he has been in the league.  He is an awful shooter (worst foul shooting of his career by far this year).  His FG% is pretty good because he is excellent at taking the ball to the hole and finishing around the rim, but he is a liability in many respects offensively because he can be left open (including the and 1 situations on the drives).  He is a good defender, but even that is greatly exaggerated on this board.

He isn't a top five PG, and is a borderline top 10 PG right now (I mean if you are building a team for the future you would take Rondo over Nash, but Nash is still better then him, just as an example).  Good but not great, and he greatly benefits from his teammates.  Put him an awful team and his deficiencies would be magnified and would play a much larger role in how he is viewed.  

Simple question, if Rondo and Conley switched teams, who is better?

  Rondo's better than Conley in any and all situations. Just because your main criteria for judging point guards is shooting doesn't mean that people who disagree with you overrate Rondo. I'm sure that if you've ever seen Rondo dominate playoff games your first response was either "Conley could easily do the same thing" or "clearly he's not playing that well because he's not a good outside shooter". But the fact is that he does dominate games in the regular season and (more frequently) in the playoffs in spite of his shooting woes.

  Could a player as poor as you think Rondo is average close to a triple double for consecutive playoff series, or average 21/6/12 in a series against a top 5 defense? Or is your point that practically any point guard can do the same thing? If he's borderline top ten then you should easily be able to name 7-8 other pgs that have shown themselves to be capable of better, right?

These PG's are all better then Rondo right now, in no particular order:

C. Paul
D. Williams
D. Rose
S. Nash
T. Parker
R. Westbrook
J. Kidd

So when you say, "Rondo is a good PG, but he isn't an elite PG and never will be.  I can say that definitively because Rondo hasn't improved his shooting since he has been in the league.", did you forget how awful a shooter Jason Kidd was?

Rondo just turned 25...how can you, or anyone else, say that he won't improve?

As a rookie, Jason Kidd shot 69.8% from the line, by his fourth year he was essentially an 80% foul shooter and has been since.  Kidd's third year in the league he shot 37% from the 3PT line.  He was up and down after that, but he pretty much always showed potential to shoot well.  Rondo hasn't ever shown that potential and is actually shooting worse this year, his 5th year in the league.

How do you figure? He's shooting close to 40% on shots from  16-23 FT (62-158) and he shot 33% last year (60-183). He's shooting 10-31 on 3pt attempts and shot 17-80 last year. His FG% at the rim has gone up from 64% last year to 68%.

His FG% on shots from 3-9 feet are below what he normally makes, but that's the only area where he has downgraded.