Can Rondo punish teams for playing him for the pass?

[LilRip]

in an article by Zach Lowe, http://nba-point-forward.si.com/2011/02/11/lakers-masterfully-disrupt-bostons-offense/ , he talks about how the Lakers guarded the Celtics the other day. And y'know, it's essentially pretty simple: play off Rondo, make the big 3 work for their looks.

and i think the reason this works is because well, i'm not convinced Rondo can make you pay for not guarding him. at least, if the team has a pretty good big man/men. i mean, i like Rondo. he can destroy opposing offensive rhythm with his deflections and defense, and he can cut up opposing defenses by delivering terrific passes, and he can get his teammates ridiculously easy looks with these same passes. but despite this, i sometimes still have those thoughts where i wonder if this team's championship chances would've been better served if we had a guy like D-Rose instead. or Billups (rebuilding/future aside). or Westbrook. i don't think the disparity in court vision/defense is as large as the disparity in offensive capability.

shooting has always been a weakness of Rondo, and though he has shown good improvement, that's not my issue with him. I think Rondo needs to start being more aggressive in scoring, period. I'm talking driving it to the hoop and looking for the contact, and looking to score. especially when it's obvious that teams are cheating off of him. i don't care if he does shoot 60% (?) from the FT line. i don't care if it's not an and-1. Just get to the line and make the other team play you.

it's important to not hesitate taking that 18ft jumper and yeah, Rondo usually doesn't anymore. i don't mind that. But i think when he does that, the other team gets a boost because they were able to "force us into doing something we didn't want to do". so they think that their defensive gameplan is at least working. i'm reminded of that game against the Bulls which we lost. When we were shutting them down, and everything they wanted to run, and boozer was getting owned, etc etc., D-Rose seemed to say eff it, and just started driving. Rose, in the interview after the game, pretty much said that he was looking more for the contact in those drives (i'm assuming, as opposed to being able to actually score off the drive). i think Rondo needs to do more of the same. When we sometimes hit those... major offensive slumps, usually caused by teams cheating off of Rondo, he needs to be able to make the other team pay for it.

[JohnBagleyValueMeal]

Well, if Rondo would make FT's he could add that "looking for contact" to his game. I almost think that's a bigger hole right now. He could be putting the opponent in foul trouble and getting more FT's for his teammates even when the jumper isn't falling.

[BballTim]

in an article by Zach Lowe, http://nba-point-forward.si.com/2011/02/11/lakers-masterfully-disrupt-bostons-offense/ , he talks about how the Lakers guarded the Celtics the other day. And y'know, it's essentially pretty simple: play off Rondo, make the big 3 work for their looks.

and i think the reason this works is because well, i'm not convinced Rondo can make you pay for not guarding him. at least, if the team has a pretty good big man/men. i mean, i like Rondo. he can destroy opposing offensive rhythm with his deflections and defense, and he can cut up opposing defenses by delivering terrific passes, and he can get his teammates ridiculously easy looks with these same passes. but despite this, i sometimes still have those thoughts where i wonder if this team's championship chances would've been better served if we had a guy like D-Rose instead. or Billups (rebuilding/future aside). or Westbrook. i don't think the disparity in court vision/defense is as large as the disparity in offensive capability.

shooting has always been a weakness of Rondo, and though he has shown good improvement, that's not my issue with him. I think Rondo needs to start being more aggressive in scoring, period. I'm talking driving it to the hoop and looking for the contact, and looking to score. especially when it's obvious that teams are cheating off of him. i don't care if he does shoot 60% (?) from the FT line. i don't care if it's not an and-1. Just get to the line and make the other team play you.

it's important to not hesitate taking that 18ft jumper and yeah, Rondo usually doesn't anymore. i don't mind that. But i think when he does that, the other team gets a boost because they were able to "force us into doing something we didn't want to do". so they think that their defensive gameplan is at least working. i'm reminded of that game against the Bulls which we lost. When we were shutting them down, and everything they wanted to run, and boozer was getting owned, etc etc., D-Rose seemed to say eff it, and just started driving. Rose, in the interview after the game, pretty much said that he was looking more for the contact in those drives (i'm assuming, as opposed to being able to actually score off the drive). i think Rondo needs to do more of the same. When we sometimes hit those... major offensive slumps, usually caused by teams cheating off of Rondo, he needs to be able to make the other team pay for it.

  Maybe, in his next article, the guy could break down the first game they played, when Rondo had 15 assists in the second half, the Celts outscored the Lakers 59-42 in the second half and the Celts shot over 60% from the field. Maybe no Shaq, no Nate, no Marquis (and no Delonte) and PP getting over the flu helped the Lakers a little.

[greenpride32]

  Maybe, in his next article, the guy could break down the first game they played, when Rondo had 15 assists in the second half, the Celts outscored the Lakers 59-42 in the second half and the Celts shot over 60% from the field. Maybe no Shaq, no Nate, no Marquis (and no Delonte) and PP getting over the flu helped the Lakers a little.

I think it can be implied that it was an adjust the Lakers made from the first game and the first half of the second game. 

[BballTim]

  Maybe, in his next article, the guy could break down the first game they played, when Rondo had 15 assists in the second half, the Celts outscored the Lakers 59-42 in the second half and the Celts shot over 60% from the field. Maybe no Shaq, no Nate, no Marquis (and no Delonte) and PP getting over the flu helped the Lakers a little.

I think it can be implied that it was an adjust the Lakers made from the first game and the first half of the second game. 

  Made adjustments why? Because they'd never played against  the Celts with Rondo before? Did they just somehow come up with a new strategy of how to defend the Celts between the two games that they hadn't thought of before? Maybe they threw the home game against the Celts to lure Doc into a false sense of security?

[celtics2]

Rondo has shown he can score outside and inside. Just that he defers to the Big 3 every trip down. When the day comes when we need his offense he'll support that request. Until then he should be the 5th option. I admire him for his patience playing in League of gunners.

[billysan]

One of things this artcle conveniently fails to adress is the pace of the game. When we push the ball as Doc preaches, he doesnt have to worry as much about the shot and no one on any team has time to sag off of him.

When we are not healthy or not running the floor like we should then the other team gets back and forces us into a halfcourt game. This is the only time Rondo has to face a sagging defense.

I love it when Rondo shoots a jumper or three, I love it even more when he makes a couple. His best offensive game is still penetration and attacking the rim. That is what helps create for others and runs up his assist total.

[soap07]

in an article by Zach Lowe, http://nba-point-forward.si.com/2011/02/11/lakers-masterfully-disrupt-bostons-offense/ , he talks about how the Lakers guarded the Celtics the other day. And y'know, it's essentially pretty simple: play off Rondo, make the big 3 work for their looks.

and i think the reason this works is because well, i'm not convinced Rondo can make you pay for not guarding him. at least, if the team has a pretty good big man/men. i mean, i like Rondo. he can destroy opposing offensive rhythm with his deflections and defense, and he can cut up opposing defenses by delivering terrific passes, and he can get his teammates ridiculously easy looks with these same passes. but despite this, i sometimes still have those thoughts where i wonder if this team's championship chances would've been better served if we had a guy like D-Rose instead. or Billups (rebuilding/future aside). or Westbrook. i don't think the disparity in court vision/defense is as large as the disparity in offensive capability.

shooting has always been a weakness of Rondo, and though he has shown good improvement, that's not my issue with him. I think Rondo needs to start being more aggressive in scoring, period. I'm talking driving it to the hoop and looking for the contact, and looking to score. especially when it's obvious that teams are cheating off of him. i don't care if he does shoot 60% (?) from the FT line. i don't care if it's not an and-1. Just get to the line and make the other team play you.

it's important to not hesitate taking that 18ft jumper and yeah, Rondo usually doesn't anymore. i don't mind that. But i think when he does that, the other team gets a boost because they were able to "force us into doing something we didn't want to do". so they think that their defensive gameplan is at least working. i'm reminded of that game against the Bulls which we lost. When we were shutting them down, and everything they wanted to run, and boozer was getting owned, etc etc., D-Rose seemed to say eff it, and just started driving. Rose, in the interview after the game, pretty much said that he was looking more for the contact in those drives (i'm assuming, as opposed to being able to actually score off the drive). i think Rondo needs to do more of the same. When we sometimes hit those... major offensive slumps, usually caused by teams cheating off of Rondo, he needs to be able to make the other team pay for it.

  Maybe, in his next article, the guy could break down the first game they played, when Rondo had 15 assists in the second half, the Celts outscored the Lakers 59-42 in the second half and the Celts shot over 60% from the field. Maybe no Shaq, no Nate, no Marquis (and no Delonte) and PP getting over the flu helped the Lakers a little.

Yeah, there are games when Rondo can overcome the fact that the Lakers don't take him seriously enough to guard. However, I don't see how anyone can argue that in the last two Finals matchups, the Lakers used this strategy to great advantage at times - especially last year.

[BballTim]

in an article by Zach Lowe, http://nba-point-forward.si.com/2011/02/11/lakers-masterfully-disrupt-bostons-offense/ , he talks about how the Lakers guarded the Celtics the other day. And y'know, it's essentially pretty simple: play off Rondo, make the big 3 work for their looks.

and i think the reason this works is because well, i'm not convinced Rondo can make you pay for not guarding him. at least, if the team has a pretty good big man/men. i mean, i like Rondo. he can destroy opposing offensive rhythm with his deflections and defense, and he can cut up opposing defenses by delivering terrific passes, and he can get his teammates ridiculously easy looks with these same passes. but despite this, i sometimes still have those thoughts where i wonder if this team's championship chances would've been better served if we had a guy like D-Rose instead. or Billups (rebuilding/future aside). or Westbrook. i don't think the disparity in court vision/defense is as large as the disparity in offensive capability.

shooting has always been a weakness of Rondo, and though he has shown good improvement, that's not my issue with him. I think Rondo needs to start being more aggressive in scoring, period. I'm talking driving it to the hoop and looking for the contact, and looking to score. especially when it's obvious that teams are cheating off of him. i don't care if he does shoot 60% (?) from the FT line. i don't care if it's not an and-1. Just get to the line and make the other team play you.

it's important to not hesitate taking that 18ft jumper and yeah, Rondo usually doesn't anymore. i don't mind that. But i think when he does that, the other team gets a boost because they were able to "force us into doing something we didn't want to do". so they think that their defensive gameplan is at least working. i'm reminded of that game against the Bulls which we lost. When we were shutting them down, and everything they wanted to run, and boozer was getting owned, etc etc., D-Rose seemed to say eff it, and just started driving. Rose, in the interview after the game, pretty much said that he was looking more for the contact in those drives (i'm assuming, as opposed to being able to actually score off the drive). i think Rondo needs to do more of the same. When we sometimes hit those... major offensive slumps, usually caused by teams cheating off of Rondo, he needs to be able to make the other team pay for it.

  Maybe, in his next article, the guy could break down the first game they played, when Rondo had 15 assists in the second half, the Celts outscored the Lakers 59-42 in the second half and the Celts shot over 60% from the field. Maybe no Shaq, no Nate, no Marquis (and no Delonte) and PP getting over the flu helped the Lakers a little.

Yeah, there are games when Rondo can overcome the fact that the Lakers don't take him seriously enough to guard. However, I don't see how anyone can argue that in the last two Finals matchups, the Lakers used this strategy to great advantage at times - especially last year.

  I don't think the Lakers got much out of it in 07-08. And if Artest hadn't kneed Ray in the thigh they wouldn't have had much luck with it last year either.

[Jon]

Even if he can't hit his free throws, I still want him attacking.  If he made a concerted effort, he could get teams into the penalty early in the quarter and ultimately make the opposition have to tone their defensive energies down on everyone. 

I really think against teams like LA and Miami who have subpar point guards, Rondo really needs to make an effort to destroy them.  I like his passing, but making an effort to make the likes of Carlos Arroyo and Derek Fisher liabilities will also dramatically impact how everyone else on the team has to play.  If these teams have to double him, Rondo can toss dimes all day. 

[footey]

Rondo really struggled v Lakers. If he goes cold like that, we are going to have a tough time beating them. He should work on 3/4 angle where he can use glass to take those mid range shots, it will give him better depth perception. Ask Tim Duncan.

[hpantazo]

what he needs to do is stop worrying about FT's and just take the ball strong to the hole. He can get by anybody. Just do it and punish the defense. Even if you miss the FT's, you still put the other team in foul trouble, just like Shaq does.

[LilRip]

what he needs to do is stop worrying about FT's and just take the ball strong to the hole. He can get by anybody. Just do it and punish the defense. Even if you miss the FT's, you still put the other team in foul trouble, just like Shaq does.

exactly. and it's not even so much as the "penalty" situation but i think aggression will force the defense to shift. fake aggression is driving to pass which Rondo is often guilty of. Driving to score will make them play you, or foul you. and i think that's all we need. we need them to play Rondo.

[LilRip]

in an article by Zach Lowe, http://nba-point-forward.si.com/2011/02/11/lakers-masterfully-disrupt-bostons-offense/ , he talks about how the Lakers guarded the Celtics the other day. And y'know, it's essentially pretty simple: play off Rondo, make the big 3 work for their looks.

and i think the reason this works is because well, i'm not convinced Rondo can make you pay for not guarding him. at least, if the team has a pretty good big man/men. i mean, i like Rondo. he can destroy opposing offensive rhythm with his deflections and defense, and he can cut up opposing defenses by delivering terrific passes, and he can get his teammates ridiculously easy looks with these same passes. but despite this, i sometimes still have those thoughts where i wonder if this team's championship chances would've been better served if we had a guy like D-Rose instead. or Billups (rebuilding/future aside). or Westbrook. i don't think the disparity in court vision/defense is as large as the disparity in offensive capability.

shooting has always been a weakness of Rondo, and though he has shown good improvement, that's not my issue with him. I think Rondo needs to start being more aggressive in scoring, period. I'm talking driving it to the hoop and looking for the contact, and looking to score. especially when it's obvious that teams are cheating off of him. i don't care if he does shoot 60% (?) from the FT line. i don't care if it's not an and-1. Just get to the line and make the other team play you.

it's important to not hesitate taking that 18ft jumper and yeah, Rondo usually doesn't anymore. i don't mind that. But i think when he does that, the other team gets a boost because they were able to "force us into doing something we didn't want to do". so they think that their defensive gameplan is at least working. i'm reminded of that game against the Bulls which we lost. When we were shutting them down, and everything they wanted to run, and boozer was getting owned, etc etc., D-Rose seemed to say eff it, and just started driving. Rose, in the interview after the game, pretty much said that he was looking more for the contact in those drives (i'm assuming, as opposed to being able to actually score off the drive). i think Rondo needs to do more of the same. When we sometimes hit those... major offensive slumps, usually caused by teams cheating off of Rondo, he needs to be able to make the other team pay for it.

  Maybe, in his next article, the guy could break down the first game they played, when Rondo had 15 assists in the second half, the Celts outscored the Lakers 59-42 in the second half and the Celts shot over 60% from the field. Maybe no Shaq, no Nate, no Marquis (and no Delonte) and PP getting over the flu helped the Lakers a little.

Yeah, there are games when Rondo can overcome the fact that the Lakers don't take him seriously enough to guard. However, I don't see how anyone can argue that in the last two Finals matchups, the Lakers used this strategy to great advantage at times - especially last year.

  I don't think the Lakers got much out of it in 07-08. And if Artest hadn't kneed Ray in the thigh they wouldn't have had much luck with it last year either.

in 07-08, 3 years ago? when Pierce was the team's Finals MVP and best offensive threat? when our best offensive lineup usually featured Eddie House because he could hit that 3 with deadly accuracy and because they were playing off of Rondo? or in game 7 last year when Kobe gathered all those rebounds, and when our offense stalled late in the game?

yes, we blew out the Lakers pretty well the other game at their home floor, when we outworked them. But i think you'd have to be a pretty big homer to not recognize that the Lakers also defend us pretty well in the half-court setting.

[BballTim]

in an article by Zach Lowe, http://nba-point-forward.si.com/2011/02/11/lakers-masterfully-disrupt-bostons-offense/ , he talks about how the Lakers guarded the Celtics the other day. And y'know, it's essentially pretty simple: play off Rondo, make the big 3 work for their looks.

and i think the reason this works is because well, i'm not convinced Rondo can make you pay for not guarding him. at least, if the team has a pretty good big man/men. i mean, i like Rondo. he can destroy opposing offensive rhythm with his deflections and defense, and he can cut up opposing defenses by delivering terrific passes, and he can get his teammates ridiculously easy looks with these same passes. but despite this, i sometimes still have those thoughts where i wonder if this team's championship chances would've been better served if we had a guy like D-Rose instead. or Billups (rebuilding/future aside). or Westbrook. i don't think the disparity in court vision/defense is as large as the disparity in offensive capability.

shooting has always been a weakness of Rondo, and though he has shown good improvement, that's not my issue with him. I think Rondo needs to start being more aggressive in scoring, period. I'm talking driving it to the hoop and looking for the contact, and looking to score. especially when it's obvious that teams are cheating off of him. i don't care if he does shoot 60% (?) from the FT line. i don't care if it's not an and-1. Just get to the line and make the other team play you.

it's important to not hesitate taking that 18ft jumper and yeah, Rondo usually doesn't anymore. i don't mind that. But i think when he does that, the other team gets a boost because they were able to "force us into doing something we didn't want to do". so they think that their defensive gameplan is at least working. i'm reminded of that game against the Bulls which we lost. When we were shutting them down, and everything they wanted to run, and boozer was getting owned, etc etc., D-Rose seemed to say eff it, and just started driving. Rose, in the interview after the game, pretty much said that he was looking more for the contact in those drives (i'm assuming, as opposed to being able to actually score off the drive). i think Rondo needs to do more of the same. When we sometimes hit those... major offensive slumps, usually caused by teams cheating off of Rondo, he needs to be able to make the other team pay for it.

  Maybe, in his next article, the guy could break down the first game they played, when Rondo had 15 assists in the second half, the Celts outscored the Lakers 59-42 in the second half and the Celts shot over 60% from the field. Maybe no Shaq, no Nate, no Marquis (and no Delonte) and PP getting over the flu helped the Lakers a little.

Yeah, there are games when Rondo can overcome the fact that the Lakers don't take him seriously enough to guard. However, I don't see how anyone can argue that in the last two Finals matchups, the Lakers used this strategy to great advantage at times - especially last year.

  I don't think the Lakers got much out of it in 07-08. And if Artest hadn't kneed Ray in the thigh they wouldn't have had much luck with it last year either.

in 07-08, 3 years ago? when Pierce was the team's Finals MVP and best offensive threat? when our best offensive lineup usually featured Eddie House because he could hit that 3 with deadly accuracy and because they were playing off of Rondo? or in game 7 last year when Kobe gathered all those rebounds, and when our offense stalled late in the game?

yes, we blew out the Lakers pretty well the other game at their home floor, when we outworked them. But i think you'd have to be a pretty big homer to not recognize that the Lakers also defend us pretty well in the half-court setting.

  Yes, I remember 07-08. Game 1 (Rondo had 15/5/7, Celts scored 98), game 2 (16 assists, 1 turnover, Celts score 108), game 6 (21/7/8, Celts crush Lakers). Where was that great "Kobe defense" then?