I know this conversation was a day or two ago but I came across this video today and at least one ref agrees with you that a defender landing on top of a guy while shooting is a charge.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vVv4ldVgCeQ&feature=related[/quote]
Did anybody read what I said? As a rule, when Paul upfakes and a defender goes
straight up, Paul barrels into him. Paul is initiating the contact and gets to the line virtually 100% of the time when he does it. Only Paul gets that call. Obviously Paul doesn't have to initiate the contact all the time. But he does most of the time. It's a move that's well scouted so most of his opponents go straight up. It should either be a no call...Or an offensive foul when Paul barrels into the defender.
It's ironic that that video showed one of the legendary floppers, Jefferson. That play is the poster child example of what Donaghy is talking about in his book.
I've always considered a flop as phony. Acting hurt when you are not. But you're right that he has to fall down to get the call, if you want to call that a flop.
Baby is big and strong enough that there are times he probably wouldn't fall down after being charged, but does anyway to get the call.
I just have to hand it to Baby for taking the hits. But I worry about him too because he could get hurt. I can see that he has practiced and learned to fall, most times, while keeping his head elevated so it won't bang the hard floor.
mmbaby. I didn't think you overracted in your first post. But I appreciate what you said anyway.
I think when you have players like Davis, Powe, Noah, and Varajao, Fisher, Jefferson, etc obviously practicing and perfecting the "art" of selling the flop and getting positive results from what is essentially a professional wrestling gesture, it degrades the game. Particularly when the league has been so neutered that the players can no longer patrol themselves...Ala the Bird days and back....Even the Malone days and back. When players cheapshotted or in other ways degraded the game they got taken care of by an enforcer on the other team. The game was cleaner, purer then. Stuff like this discredits the game. It also makes it easy for rogue officials to fly under the radar.
From an earlier post:
What is your definition of a bad call?
If the messiah takes three steps without a dribble in front of an official on his way to an uncontested layup, a no-call is the proper call.
If Marquis Daniels takes two steps on his way to an uncontested layup, a travel is the proper call.
If Paul Pierce upfakes and barrels into his defender going straight up, a foul on the defender is the proper call.
If anybody else in the NBA does exactly the same thing, an offensive foul is the proper call.
We have players who specialize in flopping because they are rewarded for it.
How the hell does anyone know what is an obvious bad or no call?How do
you know when a game is fixed?
