Big Baby Must Stay!

[kozlodoev]

I think Baby will be looking for MLE type money and higher, probably around 6-8 million per year (for 4+ years). That's way to much to pay for a big man with BBD's limitations, especially in a rebuilding situation.

It is absurd to think that a Glen Davis is worth less than the MLE. Absurd.

For a rebuilding team? Why would you think that?

I evaluate this based on talent. Based on the position he plays, and his contribution (not only the 15/7, but also the great defensive work), Glen Davis should command a MLE contract from someone -- and if the Celtics are not that team, it will certainly not be because he's worth less.

[LB3533]

Yeah it's true....a lot of players get paid the big bucks according to numbers posted.

But Baby brings more than just numbers.

1.) hustle (fake or not, he does it)
2.) offensive rebounds
3.) takes defensive charges
4.) clutch player in crunch time

[Jon]

It certainly isn't the case that Baby "must" stay.  Even if he lives up to to highest expectations, he'll be no more than a good NBA player.  And that's certainly something that can be replaced.  

I also worry about people's perceptions of him.  Sure he looks good on offense.  But couldn't a lot of players look good playing with Rondo and the Big Three.  Think about how successful Posey was.  Or how much better Shaq looks now than he did last year.  

I'm not sure Baby looks this good if it's him, Rondo, Perk, and two no-names.  

The problem is, no team with Rondo on it is ever going to be bad enough to win the draft lottery.  Thus, in all likelihood we're going to have to rebuild by signing at least 1 (if not 2) big time free agents.  Signing Baby to a sizable extension could prohibit that.  And if that's the case, he's not worth retaining.  He'll never be good enough to be the #2 or even #3 guy on a title team.  

The only exception may be if Ainge thinks signing Davis could enable us to use him as a trade chip later.  

[Who]

Glen Davis continues to be unimpressive in big minutes.

He is an end of bench player and I would be very reluctant to give him a large/long contract.

[LarBrd33]

I have to give Glen props.  He seems like a legitimate backup and has been playing solid minutes.  I guess it's time for me to stop trashing him.

[Chris]

Glen Davis continues to be unimpressive in big minutes.

He is an end of bench player and I would be very reluctant to give him a large/long contract.

I'm confused by this.  Are you saying you don't think he is a rotation quality player? 

I tend to agree that he is not worth giving a large/long contract, but I think the evidence of him being a very productive rotation player on a championship caliber team is pretty irrefutable. 

[LB3533]

Glen Davis continues to be unimpressive in big minutes.

He is an end of bench player and I would be very reluctant to give him a large/long contract.

Unimpressive?

What more do you want from the guy?

[thirstyboots18]

I am not a stats person.  What are Glen Davis' stats against the starters and what are they against bench players?  Are they the same?  Is he better against one or the other?

[Chris]

I am not a stats person.  What are Glen Davis' stats against the starters and what are they against bench players?  Are they the same?  Is he better against one or the other?

No idea what the stats are, but I am not sure those stats would tell us a whole lot about how he would do in a different situation.

The problem is, it is impossible to separate his performance from the situation he is in, playing with such great players, and in this particular role. 

We can always try to project, but until we see him play for an extended time without great players around him, we will not know how he will react to it.

[Fafnir]

His +/- numbers aren't very good when he's not playing with starters.

But we're dealing with a pretty small sample size.

[LB3533]

I am not a stats person.  What are Glen Davis' stats against the starters and what are they against bench players?  Are they the same?  Is he better against one or the other?

I am pretty sure Davis would perform better against second stringers as opposed to getting his stuff rejected by the Elton Brands of the world.

[thirstyboots18]

I read somewhere that Davis does not see himself as a bench player, but rather as a bridge player between the starters and the bench, and more of a leader when on  the bench.  I know two years ago, we lost when he was a starter filling in for KG.  He is two years better and two years more mature, but still no taller (although he is strong and has learned how to clear out room for himself inside, instead of getting blocked all the time). He leads the league in taking charges.  Some players play better starting, and some play better coming off the bench.  It seems to me that those stats would figure in to how much he could demand.   That was the reason for my question.

[Who]

Glen Davis continues to be unimpressive in big minutes.

He is an end of bench player and I would be very reluctant to give him a large/long contract.

I'm confused by this.  Are you saying you don't think he is a rotation quality player? 

I tend to agree that he is not worth giving a large/long contract, but I think the evidence of him being a very productive rotation player on a championship caliber team is pretty irrefutable. 

Quality rotation player.

Sorry, the end of bench player was badly worded, I meant as a regular rotation guy. Davis is a quality rotation player.

I like him as a 16-22 minute a night player and dislike the idea of giving him 30+ minutes.

Glen Davis continues to be a liability when playing big minutes (30+mpg).

[Who]

Glen Davis continues to be unimpressive in big minutes.

He is an end of bench player and I would be very reluctant to give him a large/long contract.

Unimpressive?

What more do you want from the guy?

More rebounding + better defense

To a lesser degree, more efficient scoring.

[More Banners]

I am not a stats person.  What are Glen Davis' stats against the starters and what are they against bench players?  Are they the same?  Is he better against one or the other?

No idea what the stats are, but I am not sure those stats would tell us a whole lot about how he would do in a different situation.

The problem is, it is impossible to separate his performance from the situation he is in, playing with such great players, and in this particular role. 

We can always try to project, but until we see him play for an extended time without great players around him, we will not know how he will react to it.

This pretty much nails it (TP!).

I would be very reluctant to give any big money or make any significant commitment to a player who has always been a supporting-cast player, even one that has been successful in that role.

He has scored, but he's benefitted from a PG getting him the ball in position, and better scorers drawing attention on the pick/pop so he gets uncontested jumpers in his comfort zone.

And though he takes charges (good footwork), he gets very few blocks for a big guy.  They're both ways to protect the rim.  Any stats on combined blocks/charges taken so we can compare him to other PF's like McRoberts, who gets more blocks?  I'd add in steals, too.  In short (no pun intended), I think combining charges taken with blocks for comparison purposes would make him look pretty average on the defensive end.