waddya say we stop blaming Sheed for last years lack of effort now.

[vinnie]

amazing. We lose a game or two by a few points and suddenly the team is coasting and the starters don't care. They care, I saw it today, but they played without there floor leader, Rondo, and we have 1 healthy center who is too old to play big minutes. Semih is playing injured, and Perk and Jermain are out. I'd say they have done an excellent job so far this season. Ray, Paul, and KG look great, Nate is improving, Baby looks better than last year, and Delonte is just working his way into the system. What more do people expect? We already beat the heat twice and went 3-1 on a rough west coast trip.

They may care, but they certainly have not made the effort on defense in six of the last 8 quarters. That is the only reason they lost these two games. And if they play the same way tomorrow night, they will get destroyed in Atlanta. Again, really bad matchups for Shaw and Semih tomorrow.

[mmbaby]

What worries me is the early injuries. Being older means you are just not as tough as you used to be and more easily injured. What is the solution? I sure don't know. I think Doc wants to win a championship again and this is what he thinks about. They may very well cruise a lot for the regular season to save the old people from injuries. They were pretty beat up on last game.

[mmbaby]

And personally, I never did blame Sheed. I was glad we had him and wish we still did. That guy is tough.

[More Banners]

What worries me is the early injuries. Being older means you are just not as tough as you used to be and more easily injured. What is the solution? I sure don't know. I think Doc wants to win a championship again and this is what he thinks about. They may very well cruise a lot for the regular season to save the old people from injuries. They were pretty beat up on last game.

Hey, come on now.  These are still professional athletes.  I don't think avoiding injury is the issue.  Playing any amount of time can lead to an injury...come down one time on someone's foot, and it's hello, ankle sprain.

I think the issue is that people in their mid-30's generally don't have the stamina or intensity of people in their 20's, even late 20's.  Hormone levels drop, and that affects quite a few things that are important to a pro athlete, including the drive to win.  Older players can supposedly see the "long view," put things in perspective, and also [very, very commonly] fool themselves into thinking they still have "it" while [due to taking the long view] not feeling they have to prove "it" every night on the court.  It's not like one wakes up one morning and can't go any more; it's more like coming up just short, and then a little shorter...slowly, as youth fades away.

That's what's happening to these human beings:  they think they have it, can't be bothered to prove it every day, and will increasingly fall shorter and shorter as they go along.  Nature is undefeated.

To whatever extent each of these guys has gas left in the tank, and I think they do, let me assure each of them that it isn't worth saving.  If they don't burn it, it'll just leak out anyway.

[wahz]

And personally, I never did blame Sheed. I was glad we had him and wish we still did. That guy is tough.

Thats why I started this. Folks have spent months saying bad stuff about Sheed's effort when the team admitted they were saving thmselves. Id happily have Sheed instead of JO and go from there. Sheed at least stayed on the court and played great post d. That ship has sailed and yes the team has shown a lack of effort at times...already.

Some of the posters here are frustrated. Vinnie is a long time ticketholder and lives and dies with the team. HE WATCHES the actual games, he is not looking at some disconnected stats on google an hour after the game is over. For me, I travelled from Seattle to three home(Boston) playoff games last year. I am going to the Orlando game in early Feb.

I don't care how they do it but I want this team to win a title again. They can do it if they can cherish these games.
A poster above has solved the puzzle though: they are too cocky and maybe we can't count on them until spring.

I have to say that as tough as this is to take as a fan, even the 50-60's Celtics we were really good at blowing huge leads and sleepwalking through PLAYOFF games against inferior opponents. But they were superhumanly clutch in 7th games. Maybe these guys will be too the next 2 years.

[mmbaby]

I think most of us here do watch all the games, though not lucky enough to go to every one as a season ticket holder.
I still think they are older and tend to get hurt more. Or maybe I should say beat on and sore and tired. And maybe when one or two starter aren't feeling it or are feeling beat up, it hurts the chemistry for the others.
I'm not pinning my hopes on JO in any way, nor Perk for this season. People doing that here just seem to be avoiding reality.
KG is not scoring well, and I know I will get some flak for saying this, but last game, he got bumped and this game he seemed slow.
I'm just rambling here and trying to figure out what the heck went wrong. Preseason and beginning of season looked a lot different than now.

[PosImpos]

The Celts played when they wanted to play last year. The Celts will do the same thing this year. It is frustrating, but it is what it is.

This.  I don't know why people thought the small amount of turnover on the roster during the off-season would result in a sweeping change of mentality for the entire team.

They're still going to be inconsistent, they're still going to get bogged down by injuries, and they're still going to get outworked at times by teams much less talented than they are. 

They don't have an abundance of youthful energy or absolutely overwhelming talent to overcome lack of focus, lack of health, or lack of effort.

~50 wins.  Just like last year. 

Embrace it and make the most of the times when the team is playing to their full potential.

[vinnie]

The Celts played when they wanted to play last year. The Celts will do the same thing this year. It is frustrating, but it is what it is.

This.  I don't know why people thought the small amount of turnover on the roster during the off-season would result in a sweeping change of mentality for the entire team.

They're still going to be inconsistent, they're still going to get bogged down by injuries, and they're still going to get outworked at times by teams much less talented than they are. 

They don't have an abundance of youthful energy or absolutely overwhelming talent to overcome lack of focus, lack of health, or lack of effort.

~50 wins.  Just like last year. 

Embrace it and make the most of the times when the team is playing to their full potential.

TP, Pos. This is the truth and nothing but the truth. Hopefully we will have a fairly similar end to the season, only this time with the Celts on top. Main thing that concern me, however, is the defensive trend -- downward. For those of us lucky enough to have season tickets, it can be quite frustrating spending all of this money and getting many lackadaisical performances. But, it's my choice to continue to renew. This might be the last year, however, because of how expensive the tickets have become.

[Toine43]

In sports, teams win and lose games. We need to stop being so spoiled and overreacting to every loss. This team isn't going to win 65 games, nor do most. You win some, you lose some. Didn't we realize last year the what matters is the playoffs anyway?

We're not going to play our best every night, that's just the reality of sports. If there weren't such a thing as an upset, how did the 06-07 Celtics win any games at all? Maybe when we lose it's not always an indication of lack of effort or some inherent flaw in the team. Maybe we just happened to come up short on that night.

If you want to talk about real problems with a team, take a look at some of the stuff being said by LeBron and Bosh after Heat losses.

[Q_FBE]

Celtics got bit by poor, sloppy play in all three phases of the game. The whole team seemed slow and flat. I hope they can come back and play better tomorrow.

[Eja117]

I would say the exact opposite. I think it's more like his total disregard for the regular season inserted a virus into these players that can only be treated, not cured. The cancer went into remission, but remained.

[GranTur]

It's not that they aren't trying...the average age of the big three is 34. 34!

In the playoffs they can have the adrenaline and desire to run at 110%...people shouldn't expect them to be able to do that in the regular season.

Add in Shaq/Rasheed's age and that will help explain the record. Celtics will probably finish with 56 wins.

[Drucci]

Wow, I leave for two days and a half and when I come back the C's have lost two straight games that they definitely should never have lost and the forums have turned into turmoil like last year. Karma breaker?

Seriously though, I think it's too early to tell if the team has reversed back to its terrible habit of cruising during the regular season, I certainly hope it's not the case but we should learn more about it this week.

[Jeff]

I think it is fair to point out that we can't simply lay last year at the feet of Rasheed

it is a team-wide bad habit we need to break out of - preferably before the playoffs this time

[housecall]

One player can't control the habits(good/bad)of a 12-15 man roster for 82 games.