Suprise: Durant the next Michael Jordan

[moiso]

I agree with Fafnir's posts.  Durant is one of my favorite players.  So far he has done everything right, from his behavior to his on the court improvement.  But he is just entering the superstar level.  Jordan and Kobe maintained that level for over 10 years.  Wade has been healthy and played at that level for how many years?  Maybe 3.  MacGrady played at that level for 3 or 4 years too.

So far Durant has played one year at borderline superstar level.  In his favor, his arc of improvement has gone nothing but up.  It's possible that he could eventually be as good as Kobe and Wade.  He's really not even as good/complete as McGrady was in his prime. 

So while there is no reason that Durant can't achieve that level of greatness, he is not there yet.  He seems like a great guy, he's super talented and his game is on the upswing.  But there is no reason to compare him to Jordan at this point in time.

[screwedupmaniac]

1. Transcendent talent, combined with
2. Class
3. Character
4. Ferocity in spirit & ice water in the veins -whether inwardly or outwardly apparent

5. An Old school, no nonsense true warrior's mentality to the game. A character that doesn't permitt preening and prancing and all manner of narcisistic self adolation 24/7, 365.

6. All the above then neatly wrapped into a package of humility and humbleness - not necessarliy on the court where they roar, but inside

7. Which allows them the ability to always stand on their own two feet, to honestly admitt defeat with out excuse and not brag about victory, after the fact.

I'm sorry to say this, but we've been watching the closest thing we're ever gonna get to watch to Michael Jordan for the past several years, and we are too blinded by our own biases and green goggles to realize it. I hate the Lakers, and I can't stand Kobe Bryant, but I respect his game enough to recognize that he is the closest thing we will ever get to Michael Jordan.

Kobe has all of the qualities you've listed above. I know that at least one person will try to attack his character and bring up the rape case from a few years back...however, America runs by the rule of "innocent until proven guilty". And it's not like Michael Jordan hasn't had his own off-the-court issues; let's not forget that the man has had big time struggles with gambling...didn't he have problems with alcohol as well? I don't remember, but the fact is that MJ is remembered for his accomplishments on the court, and KB24 will be remembered for the same thing.

Yes, Kobe Bryant comes across as selfish, but Michael Jordan always came across as selfish to me. I seem to recall instances with Jordan and Pippen getting into it with each other. However, they respected each other, and everyone on that team knew that as good as Pippen was, Jordan was the best, and if he wanted the ball, you gave him the ball. Kobe has every right to demand the ball when he is capable of single-handedly keeping a sub-par Lakers team in the 2010 finals until they decide that they want to play to win too. Hunger is contagious, and Kobe has the hunger of a champion that will seldom be denied.

And let's not forget that Michael Jordan was a premiere defender for his entire career, not just a scorer. Kevin Durant's size will never properly be utilized on the defensive end unless he drastically adjusts his game. Kobe gives his all on both ends of the court.

And then there are the basic dimensions of body size, position played, and accomplishments made. The only person who even comes close in all of these categories is Kobe Bryant.

So, let's hate on the guy all we want to when the season starts up, and let's most certainly despise the Fakers in our hearts and souls. However, let's also use some sports intelligence and give credit where credit is due: Kobe Bryant is the closest thing we have had to MJ, and will probably be the closest thing we will have to MJ for the foreseeable future.

[Fafnir]

However, let's also use some sports intelligence and give credit where credit is due: Kobe Bryant is the closest thing we have had to MJ, and will probably be the closest thing we will have to MJ for the foreseeable future.

That's the image Kobe has tried very hard to cultivate. But in the end he's not, Michael was much better and elevated his teammates more.

Kobe's just the best SG since Jordan. That's not nothing, but he's not even the best player since Jordan in the era right after. So to say he's the "closest thing to Jordan" just tells me the position he plays.

[screwedupmaniac]

However, let's also use some sports intelligence and give credit where credit is due: Kobe Bryant is the closest thing we have had to MJ, and will probably be the closest thing we will have to MJ for the foreseeable future.

That's the image Kobe has tried very hard to cultivate. But in the end he's not, Michael was much better and elevated his teammates more.

Kobe's just the best SG since Jordan. That's not nothing, but he's not even the best player since Jordan in the era right after. So to say he's the "closest thing to Jordan" just tells me the position he plays.

Well if that's the case, I think we need to just give up entirely on throwing around the term "the next MJ" because there will never be another MJ, just like there will never be Another Russell or Bird. It's not fair to throw such a high title on anyone if they have to be exactly identical to him in every way. That is why I say "the closest thing to Michael Jordan", not "the next Michael Jordan".

[LilRip]

So far Durant has played one year at borderline superstar level.

borderline?? last year, he became the league's youngest scoring champion. he also finished 2nd in MVP voting and he was an All-NBA first teamer. He led the Thunder, a team not even projected to be in the playoffs, to a huge 27-win improvement. those are pretty hefty credentials and would qualify as a superstar season in my book.



- LilRip

[moiso]

So far Durant has played one year at borderline superstar level.

borderline?? last year, he became the league's youngest scoring champion. he also finished 2nd in MVP voting and he was an All-NBA first teamer. He led the Thunder, a team not even projected to be in the playoffs, to a huge 27-win improvement. those are pretty hefty credentials and would qualify as a superstar season in my book.



- LilRip

Fair enough.  I suppose he's a superstar, I'm just always hesitant to use that word.

[guava_wrench]

However, let's also use some sports intelligence and give credit where credit is due: Kobe Bryant is the closest thing we have had to MJ, and will probably be the closest thing we will have to MJ for the foreseeable future.

That's the image Kobe has tried very hard to cultivate. But in the end he's not, Michael was much better and elevated his teammates more.

Kobe's just the best SG since Jordan. That's not nothing, but he's not even the best player since Jordan in the era right after. So to say he's the "closest thing to Jordan" just tells me the position he plays.

There will always be a reason someone can give for saying player x is not the next Jordan. Even if someone is better than Jordan, people will be able to come up with reasons. But after Kobe, the whole 'next Jordan' thing should be put to rest.

I was a bit surprised to see someone list class as a trait of either Jordan or Kobe. The guys were both jerks. And appearance of class was mostly PR savvy.

[Fafnir]

So far Durant has played one year at borderline superstar level.

borderline?? last year, he became the league's youngest scoring champion. he also finished 2nd in MVP voting and he was an All-NBA first teamer. He led the Thunder, a team not even projected to be in the playoffs, to a huge 27-win improvement. those are pretty hefty credentials and would qualify as a superstar season in my book.



- LilRip

Fair enough.  I suppose he's a superstar, I'm just always hesitant to use that word.

He's one of what 4 or 5 players who could win the MVP this coming year. (Wade, LeBron, Durant, Howard, maybe CP3 if his knee is right)

That's a superstar in my book.

[guava_wrench]

So far Durant has played one year at borderline superstar level.

borderline?? last year, he became the league's youngest scoring champion. he also finished 2nd in MVP voting and he was an All-NBA first teamer. He led the Thunder, a team not even projected to be in the playoffs, to a huge 27-win improvement. those are pretty hefty credentials and would qualify as a superstar season in my book.



- LilRip

Fair enough.  I suppose he's a superstar, I'm just always hesitant to use that word.

He's one of what 4 or 5 players who could win the MVP this coming year. (Wade, LeBron, Durant, Howard, maybe CP3 if his knee is right)

That's a superstar in my book.

He is one of the best scorers in the world, but not yet on the radar for all-time great due to too small a body of work.

Does that sound fair?

[Fafnir]

So far Durant has played one year at borderline superstar level.

borderline?? last year, he became the league's youngest scoring champion. he also finished 2nd in MVP voting and he was an All-NBA first teamer. He led the Thunder, a team not even projected to be in the playoffs, to a huge 27-win improvement. those are pretty hefty credentials and would qualify as a superstar season in my book.



- LilRip

Fair enough.  I suppose he's a superstar, I'm just always hesitant to use that word.

He's one of what 4 or 5 players who could win the MVP this coming year. (Wade, LeBron, Durant, Howard, maybe CP3 if his knee is right)

That's a superstar in my book.

He is one of the best scorers in the world, but not yet on the radar for all-time great due to too small a body of work.

Does that sound fair?

Yeah, I kinda view superstar as a year to year designation, not a career acheivement thing.

KG was a superstar 2002-2009 (till he went down) he's no longer one now.

[Donoghus]

Durant's certainly a superstar already.  He's one of the top 5 players in the league.  That's a superstar in my book.

Way too early to be talking all-time great.  His body of work is too incomplete. 

[ScoobyDoo]

That's a good point guava wrench re class. Like all of us, all these guys have warts in their character off the court.

When I mention class, I'm talking more about class on the court. Jordan, Bird, Magic, Garnett, Duncan, etc...these guys were incredibly tough on the court and didn't take any crap but they weren't dirty.

You never saw them throwing elbows into guys faces after their jump shot or walking off the court while their team is still playing - things Kobe has done that are completely classless.

You never saw them preening to take pre-game photo opps or flexing their biceps after a play like Wade or LeBron.

The truly great ones come out, go through warm ups, and play basketball. It's about the game, not them.

That's why I like Durant so much. He just comes out, plays the game, kills it and then goes home. And you have that feeling he will never give up and he doesn't have to say much to let you know that. He's old school and he's tough as nails.  

LeBron, Kobe, Wade...they're preening and prancing, screaming at the refs, whining and Edited.  Profanity and masked profanity are against forum rules and may result in discipline.ing and moaning, flexing their muscles, taking phot opps, walking off the court on their teammates, playing to the crowd half the time.

I'm not sure the truly great ones are aware for much of the game that the fans are even in the building because they're so dialed in to "the game", rather than themsleves.

It's just a pleasure to watch. That's why I love Garnett and why I love Durant. Rondo also has a bit of it in him. That kid is dialed into the game when he plays, not himself.

Garnett will occasionally gesture something to the crowd but it's more screaming at them than it is to say "look what I just did" like you see when LeBron or Kobe or Wade walk around with their arms up looking into the crowd...

Also, when I say the next Jordan, I don't mean the guy who is built most like Jordan or who plays most like Jordan - I mean the guy who transcends the game like Jordan, Bird and Magic did.

And it's also about how they go about playign the game. These guys do it for the game because it's the only way they can be, there's no other choice for them. It's not self indulgent like it seems to be with Kobe, LeBron and DWade. ( DWade is actually borderline for me on this, he's like an inch away to me, but LeBron and kobe are miles away ).

I say, Bird, Magic, Jordan > Durant (eventually)

And I think his defense is coming. He pretty much shut down Kobe for spurts last year and I think he'll improve.

Love the kid.

Like someone else said, for me it's Boston, then OKC. Because Durant is an old school baller and a transcenent talent.

All heart with no nonsense. Gotta love it.

Would have been a perfect Celtic.

[ScoobyDoo]

Yes, and to be clear I am not saying Durant should sit at the table with the all time greats by any means. If that table were in Boston, Durant would be in Vegas trudging through the desert.

I'm just saying, he's the guy I see as having the most complete package and having the best shot at it. And I see Kobe, LeBron, Wade and Durant all having transcendent talent.

But this kid's demeanor and the way he carries himself and goes about his business, devoid of the narcissistic absolute crap you see from these other guys, separates Durant for me.

That means, even though he grew up in the same rough era...he's from a mold you can't change or alter. Same for Bird, Magic, Jordan.

[guava_wrench]

That's a good point guava wrench re class. Like all of us, all these guys have warts in their character off the court.

When I mention class, I'm talking more about class on the court. Jordan, Bird, Magic, Garnett, Duncan, etc...these guys were incredibly tough on the court and didn't take any crap but they weren't dirty.

You never saw them throwing elbows into guys faces after their jump shot or walking off the court while their team is still playing - things Kobe has done that are completely classless.

You never saw them preening to take pre-game photo opps or flexing their biceps after a play like Wade or LeBron.

The truly great ones come out, go through warm ups, and play basketball. It's about the game, not them.

That's why I like Durant so much. He just comes out, plays the game, kills it and then goes home. And you have that feeling he will never give up and he doesn't have to say much to let you know that. He's old school and he's tough as nails.  

LeBron, Kobe, Wade...they're preening and prancing, screaming at the refs, whining and ****ing and moaning, flexing their muscles, taking phot opps, walking off the court on their teammates, playing to the crowd half the time.

I'm not sure the truly great ones are aware for much of the game that the fans are even in the building because they're so dialed in to "the game", rather than themsleves.

It's just a pleasure to watch. That's why I love Garnett and why I love Durant. Rondo also has a bit of it in him. That kid is dialed into the game when he plays, not himself.

Garnett will occasionally gesture something to the crowd but it's more screaming at them than it is to say "look what I just did" like you see when LeBron or Kobe or Wade walk around with their arms up looking into the crowd...

Also, when I say the next Jordan, I don't mean the guy who is built most like Jordan or who plays most like Jordan - I mean the guy who transcends the game like Jordan, Bird and Magic did.

And it's also about how they go about playign the game. These guys do it for the game because it's the only way they can be, there's no other choice for them. It's not self indulgent like it seems to be with Kobe, LeBron and DWade. ( DWade is actually borderline for me on this, he's like an inch away to me, but LeBron and kobe are miles away ).

I say, Bird, Magic, Jordan > Durant (eventually)

And I think his defense is coming. He pretty much shut down Kobe for spurts last year and I think he'll improve.

Love the kid.

Like someone else said, for me it's Boston, then OKC. Because Durant is an old school baller and a transcenent talent.

All heart with no nonsense. Gotta love it.

Would have been a perfect Celtic.

KG wasn't dirty? I can't agree with you on that.

Duncan complains about calls all the time. That isn't a character flaw. That is just what players do in 2010. It has become the standard to act shocked on every call. It is an NBA culture problem.

One of Jordan's most famous plays was an uncalled offensive foul on Russell. Jordan, like most greats, tried to get away with as much as he could.

I don't think Durant's humility is a trait of most of the past greats. Most of the past greats were arrogant. Bird and Jordan didn't seem to have a humble bone in their bodies. Sure, there are people like David Robinson, but I think you are romanticizing things way too much to have a connection to the way things really are.

[ToppersBsktball10]

He has to perform in the playoffs for me to buy it, but he is a favorite of mine. I model my game after his.