Author Topic: Best single-game performances  (Read 2985 times)

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Best single-game performances
« on: June 11, 2010, 07:17:13 PM »

Offline misha

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Hollinger's list:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/playoffs/2010/columns/story?columnist=hollinger_john&page=BestFinalsGame-Individual-1

Do you agree with his list? Want to make some adjustments?

BTW Kobe is rightfully not in top 10 (you need to be insider to look further), and I really cannot remember even one memorable playoff performance from him that will be talked about long after he retires. I can remember plenty of MJ's.
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Re: Best single-game performances
« Reply #1 on: June 11, 2010, 07:37:17 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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Hollinger's way of calculating the Game Score mystifies me. He considers a steal to be the equal of a point scored a little less than 50% more important than a block, an offensive rebound and assist, 2 and 1/2 times more important than a field goal and over three times more important than a defensive rebound.

This skews the formula towards guards scoring higher in my opinion. Just another in a long line of examples that make me question his mathematics.

Re: Best single-game performances
« Reply #2 on: June 11, 2010, 08:19:18 PM »

Offline Crushmaster

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I don't have Insider.  Did anyone from the 08 team make the list? 

Re: Best single-game performances
« Reply #3 on: June 11, 2010, 10:28:57 PM »

Offline mattmc33

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Hollinger's way of calculating the Game Score mystifies me. He considers a steal to be the equal of a point scored a little less than 50% more important than a block, an offensive rebound and assist, 2 and 1/2 times more important than a field goal and over three times more important than a defensive rebound.

This skews the formula towards guards scoring higher in my opinion. Just another in a long line of examples that make me question his mathematics.

Hollinger is a guy that to me shows little knowledge of the actual game of basketball. There's an old saying - lies, [dang] lies and statistics, and that's what this guy is all about.

It's disgusting and completely wrong that the Legend doesn't feature in his so-called top ten. I mean, KARL MALONE is in the top ten. Give me a break. Even Tim Duncan's game in the ten came against one of the weakest Eastern Conference champions in NBA history. And D Wade? Yeah it was good, but please.

I could reel Larry's great Finals games off - any of these could easily be in the top ten. There was the 29/11/12 trip dub he reeled off against the Rockets in Game 6 of 86, the 31 in Game 2 of that same series, the 29 and 21 boards in Game 4 of the 84 series  against the Lakers, and of course who could ever forget the 34 points and 17 rebounds of the 'heat game' in Game 5 at the Garden?

It's typical Hollinger crap - using statistical analysis to try and prove the greatness or otherwise of a player's performances, especially when it's so heavily skewed towards guards (especially his passionate MJ love) is fundamentally flawed.
"There will never, ever, be...another Larry Bird" - Earvin 'Magic' Johnson, Larry Bird Retirement Ceremony, Boston Garden

Re: Best single-game performances
« Reply #4 on: June 11, 2010, 10:40:18 PM »

Offline Roy Hobbs

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I think the "flu" game is one of the more overrated games in NBA history.  There's no way that it should be #1.  I find it odd that Hollinger, who values numbers above all, would elevate this performance to #1, when much more deserving candidates had more dominating games (like Magic, at #2.)

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Re: Best single-game performances
« Reply #5 on: June 12, 2010, 06:52:47 AM »

Offline Who

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Hollinger's way of calculating the Game Score mystifies me. He considers a steal to be the equal of a point scored a little less than 50% more important than a block, an offensive rebound and assist, 2 and 1/2 times more important than a field goal and over three times more important than a defensive rebound.

This skews the formula towards guards scoring higher in my opinion. Just another in a long line of examples that make me question his mathematics.
A steal guarantees your team possession of the ball. A block does not, only 50-55% of blocks result in a change of possession.

A defensive rebound is about 70-75% but that number is largely a constant irrelevant of who is on the court. So even though "player X" grabbed the ball there is still a strong a chance that another player on that team could have snared it if he didn't. Also, subject to diminishing returns. Which is not true of a steal.

They had some study on offensive rebounding and they showed great rebounders improve their team's rebounding more through this avenue than defensive rebounding. I don't think I really explained the rebounding part good ... but there is a good article somewhere online that I'll try to find. I think it's on basketball-statistics.com.

Assists are low because the NBA hands them out too freely and they do not have great analytic value as a result. With a field goal, if the player doesn't take the shot, another guy can take the shot.

It guarantees your team possession and it's an individual action that cannot be done or partially/largely replaced (field goal/points/defensive rebounds) by another player.

Anyway ... that's the idea behind a steal having so much value. Whether it's correct or not is highly debatable but that is the idea beyond it.

Re: Best single-game performances
« Reply #6 on: June 12, 2010, 06:58:55 AM »

Offline Who

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A defensive rebound is about 70-75% but that number is largely a constant irrelevant of who is on the court. So even though "player X" grabbed the ball there is still a strong a chance that another player on that team could have snared it if he didn't. Subject to diminishing returns. Which is not true of a steal.

They had some study on offensive rebounding and they showed great rebounders improve their team's rebounding more through this avenue than defensive rebounding. I don't think I really explained the rebounding part good ... but there is a good article somewhere online that I'll try to find. I think it's on basketball-statistics.com.
Diminishing returns on rebounds and other statistics -- link

This was the article I was thinking of.

Re: Best single-game performances
« Reply #7 on: June 12, 2010, 08:30:04 AM »

Offline xmuscularghandix

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Magic should be number 1. The flu game is probably the worst of all those Jordan games in the top 10. IMO

Re: Best single-game performances
« Reply #8 on: June 13, 2010, 05:28:00 AM »

Offline PosImpos

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Hollinger continues to prove that while it is interesting to attempt to do so, trying to qualify something or someone in sports as "best" or "greatest" with quantitative analysis is questionable at best.
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Re: Best single-game performances
« Reply #9 on: June 13, 2010, 05:44:29 AM »

Offline Bahku

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Is this list the best of all time? How can he exclude Wilt's 100-point game against the Sixers in 1962?!? Crazy.
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Re: Best single-game performances
« Reply #10 on: June 13, 2010, 06:15:03 AM »

Offline rayallen1934

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  R. Allen  G  58:44 18-32 9-18 6-7 +1  2 5 3 3 3 0 0 1 51

is up their?

SCRATCH THAT....FINALS! LOL sorry

Re: Best single-game performances
« Reply #11 on: June 13, 2010, 08:12:09 AM »

Offline Andy Jick

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Hollinger is an ESPN blowhard...  I'd never pay for their "insider" services, and I think most (if not all) of their analysts are tools. 

The only group I love is the College Football Gameday crew...
"It was easier to know it than to explain why I know it."

Re: Best single-game performances
« Reply #12 on: June 13, 2010, 06:34:12 PM »

Offline christuffa

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 R. Allen  G  58:44 18-32 9-18 6-7 +1  2 5 3 3 3 0 0 1 51

is up their?

SCRATCH THAT....FINALS! LOL sorry
I was thinking that too, and at least one or two of Rondo's triple doubles, but then realised it was finals and not just playoffs