Author Topic: I'm done  (Read 34107 times)

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Re: I'm about done
« Reply #45 on: June 09, 2010, 08:36:58 AM »

Offline FallGuy

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And I'll say it again before someone brings him up: Tim Donaghy can stuff it and go live in a cave. I don't buy his crack, and neither should anyone else.

I don't want to believe him either but he's like 17-2 in his pregame analysis...you don't just do that by luck.

Did he pick the Lakers last night?

Re: I'm about done
« Reply #46 on: June 09, 2010, 08:38:39 AM »

Offline celticinorlando

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And I'll say it again before someone brings him up: Tim Donaghy can stuff it and go live in a cave. I don't buy his crack, and neither should anyone else.

I don't want to believe him either but he's like 17-2 in his pregame analysis...you don't just do that by luck.

Did he pick the Lakers last night?

everything he said happened. he said the refs would call ray allen on a lot of stuff..they did..he also said the Cs would be called for illegal screens...they were...

Re: I'm about done
« Reply #47 on: June 09, 2010, 08:43:03 AM »

Offline FallGuy

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And I'll say it again before someone brings him up: Tim Donaghy can stuff it and go live in a cave. I don't buy his crack, and neither should anyone else.

I don't want to believe him either but he's like 17-2 in his pregame analysis...you don't just do that by luck.

Did he pick the Lakers last night?

everything he said happened. he said the refs would call ray allen on a lot of stuff..they did..he also said the Cs would be called for illegal screens...they were...

My question was almost rhetorical. I heard the interview too. He didn't pick L.A.

And what he claimed would happen was hardly an impressive prognostication. The Celtics would get called for moving screens? They ALWAYS get called for moving screens.

The guy's hardly a reliable source. And I'm not impressed by anything I've heard from him.

It's just so sad the league's PR disaster and incompetence on this issue gives him credibility at all.

Re: I'm about done
« Reply #48 on: June 09, 2010, 08:46:40 AM »

Offline celticinorlando

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i think we all knew after kobe and jackson cried in the presser than the lakers would get the calls...but it seems the refs make it a point to get a starter for boston in foul trouble...game 1 it was ray..game 2 it was Kg..game 3 it was PP...and perk is always in foul trouble.

my biggest beef is the fact the laker bigs NEVER have a lot of fouls called on them. and they aggressively go after block shots...i also think kobe now has a free pass to do what he wants without getting in foul trouble.

doc called the officials out last night. and he had a right to. i hope game 4 things are better. boston has yet been able to use their correct roatations in this series because of fouls

Re: I'm about done
« Reply #49 on: June 09, 2010, 08:53:20 AM »

Offline Moranis

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Come on both teams shot 24 foul shots (and that counts the ones from the Lakers after we intentionally fouled them).  There wasn't a huge discrepency in the number of fouls either, 20 for Lakers, 27 for Celtics (which again counts the couple at the end that were intentional).  The refs weren't one sided at all in the game, they were just consistently bad.  Ticky tack fouls called on one possession, hard contact not called on the next, but they were consistent in their inconsistency.

The reality is the Lakers were 21-24 from the line, the Celtics were 16-24.  The Lakers had 3 more offensive rebounds, 5 more defensive rebounds, 2 less turnovers, and 5 more blocks.  Couple that with Ray Allen not being able to hit the broad side of a barn from five feet away and you have a Lakers victory.
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Re: I'm about done
« Reply #50 on: June 09, 2010, 08:53:47 AM »

Offline nickagneta

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After a Game 2 loss in which Kobe Bryant was given 5 fouls, a couple of them questionable and then was allowed to stay in the game because of more questionable non-calls, ESPN's John Hollinger wrote a scathing article about the NBA officiating showing just how much more officials were effecting the games with the quantity of fouls as compared to what they normally call in the regular season and what the normally call in the post season. Here it is:

ESPN Insider Link

I have always been of the opinion that ESPN salivates at the nipple of the NBA superstars and teams. For this reason, DO NOT EXPECT another article about the officials after they basically render Pierce useless in last nights game because they tagged him for 5 fouls.

Re: I'm about done
« Reply #51 on: June 09, 2010, 09:33:05 AM »

Offline Andy Jick

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Last night was the first time I've ever been so disgusted, believing the referees are controlling a series, that I actually changed the channel.  I just couldn't watch it.

Even Jim Joyce couldn't have made so many bad calls...  It's so blatant that the NBA ought to hide their faces in shame.  I'm so sick of what I see that I may not even watch the rest of this series, but just periodically check the score online.

It's so obvious it's shameful...
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Re: I'm about done
« Reply #52 on: June 09, 2010, 09:57:40 AM »

Offline Spilling Green Dye

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After the Miami championship I had lost a lot of interest in the league b/c of the atrocious officiating.  So far in this series I'm pretty much ready to walk away for good when it's all said and done. 

A game is comprised of countless factors, some more prominent than others.  Shooting, rebounding, turnovers, fg%, flow, defensive rotations, and any number of things that can be controlled by the players and coaching.  Officiating has and always will be some degree of a factor.  My issue is that the officials in this series are one of the biggest factors.

Any one of the factors could be pointed to with the determination that it cost us the game, like Ray's shooting.  But don't tell me that the officiating, clearly in favor of the Lakers (especially in the 2nd half), wasn't a factor.  IMO it was as big of a factor as Ray's shooting, and that is where I have a major issue.  No one factor lost us the game.  It was the sum of the parts, as always, except in this case the officials played a major role in a detrimental way.

Re: I'm about done
« Reply #53 on: June 09, 2010, 09:59:02 AM »

Offline connerhenry43

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i think we all knew after kobe and jackson cried in the presser than the lakers would get the calls...but it seems the refs make it a point to get a starter for boston in foul trouble...game 1 it was ray..game 2 it was Kg..game 3 it was PP...and perk is always in foul trouble.

my biggest beef is the fact the laker bigs NEVER have a lot of fouls called on them. and they aggressively go after block shots...i also think kobe now has a free pass to do what he wants without getting in foul trouble.

doc called the officials out last night. and he had a right to. i hope game 4 things are better. boston has yet been able to use their correct roatations in this series because of fouls

BBD also hinted he was not happy with the refs.....could you provide what doc had to say?   i missed it.
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Re: I'm about done
« Reply #54 on: June 09, 2010, 10:11:55 AM »

Offline celticinorlando

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i think we all knew after kobe and jackson cried in the presser than the lakers would get the calls...but it seems the refs make it a point to get a starter for boston in foul trouble...game 1 it was ray..game 2 it was Kg..game 3 it was PP...and perk is always in foul trouble.

my biggest beef is the fact the laker bigs NEVER have a lot of fouls called on them. and they aggressively go after block shots...i also think kobe now has a free pass to do what he wants without getting in foul trouble.

doc called the officials out last night. and he had a right to. i hope game 4 things are better. boston has yet been able to use their correct roatations in this series because of fouls

BBD also hinted he was not happy with the refs.....could you provide what doc had to say?   i missed it.



from espn boston:

BOSTON -- OK, it's bad form to rip the referees. But all Doc Rivers wants to know is this: Can he get through one game of the NBA Finals without one of his key players getting into early foul trouble? Is that too much to ask?


In the hugely pivotal Game 3 Tuesday night, which the Lakers won, 91-84, the Celtics once again found themselves playing with only two of their Big Three. (Actually, only one, seeing as how Ray Allen went from Tucson in July to Vladivostok in December.) The final statistics will show that Paul Pierce had 15 points, three of them in the final minute. He picked up two quick fouls and was out of sorts for most of the night, battling Ron Artest and the officials. He had as many fouls (five) as field goals and, for the second straight game, was pretty much a nonfactor.

Pierce simply played poorly in Game 2. He had no chance in Game 3, according to his coach.


"Paul never got into a rhythm," Rivers said. "Every time he came on the floor, another whistle blows and he had to sit down. He was completely taken out of the game by the foul calls. I'll give Artest credit when he deserves it, but this was more that Paul Pierce had to sit on the bench. He'd play five minutes, have to go back down, four minutes, have to sit.


"I mean, he wasn't allowed to play. They didn't allow him to play."


Who knows whether those words will cost Rivers some of his next paycheck, but he has now seen three straight games where one of his stars has gotten into quick and irreversible foul trouble. On the other side, he heard Phil Jackson, the Lakers coach, moan about the officiating in Game 2 and then see a 27-20 disparity in fouls in Game 3.


"Every game so far, we've had one of our top players in foul trouble," Rivers said. "Maybe I should start complaining about fouls [like Jackson did]. Maybe I can get a turnaround like it was turned around [in Game 3]. That was amazing."


It was Ray Allen who never got going in Game 1, picking up two quick fouls and playing a playoff-low 27 minutes. It was Kevin Garnett in Game 2. The Big Ticket was limited to 24 minutes because of foul trouble, picking up two early fouls, duplicating Allen.


In Game 3, it was Pierce. He had two fouls in the first eight minutes and had to sit. He picked up his third in the second quarter. The fourth came off the ball with 3:20 gone in the third, which led to another trip to the bench. The fifth, also off the ball, came 39 seconds into the final period.


Pierce ended up playing 34 minutes, including the final 8:15 with the five fouls. He had averaged 43 minutes in the first two games of the series and never played fewer than 35 minutes against the Magic in the conference finals.


Pierce took the high road afterward, saying he had good looks while he was out there and simply couldn't convert. "I'll take those looks all night long," he said.


Overall, the officiating has been a subject of postgame discussion (and consternation to a certain extent) in all three games. The Lakers have been called for nine fewer fouls over the three games and have attempted 10 more free throws.


  • EnlargeAP Photo/Michael Dwyer

Coach Doc Rivers wasn't the only member of the Celtics who had issues with the officials in Game 3. Add Kevin Garnett to the list.

The Celtics did have an advantage late in the game when the officiating crew had to resort to replay on three occasions in the final 89 seconds. The first call went against the Celtics -- a biggie since they trailed 84-80 with 1:29 to play and originally had been given the ball. The other two reviewed plays went Boston's way, both involving Rajon Rondo and Lamar Odom. All three original calls were reversed.


Of the first critical review, Rivers said, "I thought that was a tough overrule because I watched it five times and I wasn't sure. And I thought that if it was inconclusive, that you couldn't overturn it. But clearly I was wrong. "Going by the percentages of the replays," Rivers continued, "we should replay a lot of them because every one of them turned the other way. Maybe we need to use the replay more in a lot of our calls."

But even with replay, the Celtics need their Big Three to not only be able to play, but be able to play like, well, the Big Three. Garnett finally joined the NBA Finals in Game 3 (25 points, 6 rebounds) after two essentially MIA games in Los Angeles. (We can't use the words he did to describe his play in the two games at the Staples Center.)


Pierce has now had two straight underwhelming games; he is shooting 13-of-36 from the field. And the estimable Allen somehow came off his 32-point scorcher in Game 2, with an NBA Finals-record eight 3-pointers, to deliver an unthinkable 0-of-13 from the field. Had he boinged one more, he'd have tied a Finals record for most misses without a basket.


So it's not all the fouls. The Celtics' rebounding woes resurfaced in Game 3 and Boston missed eight of 24 free throws. There also were two huge offensive fouls -- all right, back to them again -- in the fourth period, one on Ray Allen and the other on Garnett. Both were whistled by Laker-friendly zebra Bill Kennedy (L.A. is 4-0 in the playoffs with Kennedy on the floor).


The Lakers have had their own officiating beefs. Artest had two quickies in Game 3 and Derek Fisher had two quickies in Game 2. Lamar Odom had three in a short span in Game 2 and never recovered. Kobe Bryant battled foul trouble in Game 2 (he got five and should have gotten six) then vowed that wouldn't happen again. He was right. He picked up two in 44 minutes in Game 3.


With the Celtics down 2-1, no one needs to tell Rivers that his team needs more than just favorable whistles to make this a series again. All he wants is for his starters to stay on the floor. But as he has seen so far, and finally vocalized after Game 3, he frustratingly has no say whatsoever in that matter. We'll see if his latest words resonate for Game 4.


Re: I'm about done
« Reply #55 on: June 09, 2010, 10:17:28 AM »

Offline Bynum4MVP

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Celtic fans upset with some of the calls against Pierce.  Laker fans upset with the review overturning in Celtics favor and the obvious foul on Lamar by Rondo.

It's funny how BOTH sides are blaming the refs and Stern for some bias or conspiracy.  The refs aren't safe from any fanbase this series lol.

Just another exciting day in the life of an NBA fan, I guess.  
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Re: I'm about done
« Reply #56 on: June 09, 2010, 10:32:46 AM »

Offline scottwedman

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Ray Allen going 0-13 affected the game a lot more than the refs.

Re: I'm about done
« Reply #57 on: June 09, 2010, 10:34:41 AM »

Offline Andy Jick

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Celtic fans upset with some of the calls against Pierce.  Laker fans upset with the review overturning in Celtics favor and the obvious foul on Lamar by Rondo.

It's funny how BOTH sides are blaming the refs and Stern for some bias or conspiracy.  The refs aren't safe from any fanbase this series lol.

Just another exciting day in the life of an NBA fan, I guess.  

And THIS is the problem...  It's been bad for BOTH sides.  And it looks like there is an agenda from the NBA.  Game 2: Kobe is in foul trouble (subliminal Stern message: move this series to Boston tied).  Game 3: Celtics in early foul trouble (subliminal Stern message: give LA an edge).

Game 4: I guarantee you the Celtics will win and that the Lakers will deal with foul trouble.  Mark it down...
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Re: I'm about done
« Reply #58 on: June 09, 2010, 10:37:10 AM »

Offline vinnie

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The thing that is most amusing is that when the Celtics lose, the refs played a huge role and when the Lakers lose the refs played a huge role. To me the bad reffing happens almost equally to both team. The Celtics lost last night because Ray Allen could not shoot and because Paul Pierce, except for a couple of late baskets, was invisible on offense. And, let's not forget all of the missed free throws.

Re: I'm about done
« Reply #59 on: June 09, 2010, 10:40:12 AM »

Offline Bankshot

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Ray Allen going 0-13 affected the game a lot more than the refs.

I agree.  The Celtics had a chance at the end, but for some reason, Rondo kept trying to feed an ice cold Ray. ::)
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