Rumor or excuse: Lebron's elbow is worse than first reported (merged)

[footey]

John Hollinger is spending all of his resources trying to prove that Lebron is hurt because heaven forbid if he had to admit he underestimated the Celtics and over-estimated the Cavs in picking the Cavs in 5.  He is too smart and insightful to be so wrong in his predictions. Right, Johnny?

[indeedproceed]

IF allegedly he got his shot the day of game 4, he's gotta wait til the 19th to get another

But in the same way, if he got it on the 9th, then he should've been 'good' (as in numb, not as in healthy) for game 5.

Actually, the way I interpretted the comment on the shot is that it only worked for a hort time but could only be used after 10 days. Which if he got it on the 7th (Game 5) means he could get it before a Game 7, if there is one

The quote says he got it before game 4..you think he meant game 4 of the bulls series? I assumed he meant game 4 of the C's series, which would put it at Sunday at the latest, but more likely the day before.

[Fafnir]

What people forget is that Lebron has sucked in the playoffs whenever a good defensive team gets determined to stop him.

In 08, he was atrocious in 6 out of 7 games. Was it the elbow back then, too? Lebron played great against the magic last year, so people forget that he has sucked in the playoffs for most of his career (that series against the pistons being the exception).

And the final thing that makes me sure this is BS is: I don't know, and no doctor I know knows of, any shot that can only be taken once every 10 days, but which have an effect that wears off before those 10 days.

Cortisone shots, anesthetics, etc. can all be given in shorter spans of time.

You honestly think LeBron has sucked in the playoffs his entire career?

 

[MMacOH]

IF allegedly he got his shot the day of game 4, he's gotta wait til the 19th to get another

But in the same way, if he got it on the 9th, then he should've been 'good' (as in numb, not as in healthy) for game 5.

Actually, the way I interpretted the comment on the shot is that it only worked for a hort time but could only be used after 10 days. Which if he got it on the 7th (Game 5) means he could get it before a Game 7, if there is one

The quote says he got it before game 4..you think he meant game 4 of the bulls series? I assumed he meant game 4 of the C's series, which would put it at Sunday at the latest, but more likely the day before.

Oops...type on my part.  I meant game 4. 

[nickagneta]

I like many of us, have seen LeBron play A LOT. He is playing timid. He is extremely reluctant to put up long distance shots. And he is going to his left towards the basket an awful lot more than usual.

These are not circumstances being brought about or forced upon LeBron by the defense the Celtics are playing. These are conscience decisions being made by LeBron to do these things.

I have been saying this through most of this series. This is not some half baked excuse. There is definitely something wrong with his elbow and LeBron is changing his game to accommodate the right elbow. I said it earlier in the week and still believe it, LeBron will be undergoing surgery on that elbow this off season. I would bet my house on it.

What I don't understand about some here at Celticsblog is the vehemence of denial that there could be anything wrong with LeBron. We had no problem putting the inconsistencies of this years regular season performance of the Celtics on rehabilitation of injuries and playing through injuries.

We are for the most part a very astute group of basketball fans. If we can see what happened to the C's when they played through rehabbing knees and hurting wrists and thumbs and shoulders and backs and other problems, why is it so hard for us to believe, given the very un-LeBron like performances and tendencies we are seeing, that there is actually something wrong with the man?

[crownsy]

I like many of us, have seen LeBron play A LOT. He is playing timid. He is extremely reluctant to put up long distance shots. And he is going to his left towards the basket an awful lot more than usual.

These are not circumstances being brought about or forced upon LeBron by the defense the Celtics are playing. These are conscience decisions being made by LeBron to do these things.

I have been saying this through most of this series. This is not some half baked excuse. There is definitely something wrong with his elbow and LeBron is changing his game to accommodate the right elbow. I said it earlier in the week and still believe it, LeBron will be undergoing surgery on that elbow this off season. I would bet my house on it.

What I don't understand about some here at Celticsblog is the vehemence of denial that there could be anything wrong with LeBron. We had no problem putting the inconsistencies of this years regular season performance of the Celtics on rehabilitation of injuries and playing through injuries.

We are for the most part a very astute group of basketball fans. If we can see what happened to the C's when they played through rehabbing knees and hurting wrists and thumbs and shoulders and backs and other problems, why is it so hard for us to believe, given the very un-LeBron like performances and tendencies we are seeing, that there is actually something wrong with the man?

I think the inconsistency of results, combined with the fact that it was initially (and still) labeled a bone bruise is the reason.

While i agree with you, and would not be shocked either, The fact that he can go from a bad game to a murderous one like game 3 and in some respects game 1 play into the people who believe he is hurt, but not severely injured.

It also hurts him that ESPN/TNT's commentators compared his game 3 preformance to guys like willis and MJ's flu game and won't shut up about how courageous he is during broadcasts.

IT's not his fault, but when people see him doing chasedown blocks with his right hand and destroying the universe in one game, and then a former shell of himself the next while the broadcast crew plays up the fact that he's playing as some sort of ultra courageous endeavor, people get tired of it.

In this case he's the victim of his own hype machine. He probably is banged up, but the media has taken and run with that storyline, and it irks people that an elbow bruise, which seems to affect him some days, and other days be fine, is talked about 24/7 on the WWL.

[Birdbrain]

What people forget is that Lebron has sucked in the playoffs whenever a good defensive team gets determined to stop him.

In 08, he was atrocious in 6 out of 7 games. Was it the elbow back then, too? Lebron played great against the magic last year, so people forget that he has sucked in the playoffs for most of his career (that series against the pistons being the exception).

And the final thing that makes me sure this is BS is: I don't know, and no doctor I know knows of, any shot that can only be taken once every 10 days, but which have an effect that wears off before those 10 days.

Cortisone shots, anesthetics, etc. can all be given in shorter spans of time.

You honestly think LeBron has sucked in the playoffs his entire career?

 

No but, he's had a few 2-18's on his resume.  His teammates are his problem but, they weren't in the regular season as per Cavs fans.

[nickagneta]

I like many of us, have seen LeBron play A LOT. He is playing timid. He is extremely reluctant to put up long distance shots. And he is going to his left towards the basket an awful lot more than usual.

These are not circumstances being brought about or forced upon LeBron by the defense the Celtics are playing. These are conscience decisions being made by LeBron to do these things.

I have been saying this through most of this series. This is not some half baked excuse. There is definitely something wrong with his elbow and LeBron is changing his game to accommodate the right elbow. I said it earlier in the week and still believe it, LeBron will be undergoing surgery on that elbow this off season. I would bet my house on it.

What I don't understand about some here at Celticsblog is the vehemence of denial that there could be anything wrong with LeBron. We had no problem putting the inconsistencies of this years regular season performance of the Celtics on rehabilitation of injuries and playing through injuries.

We are for the most part a very astute group of basketball fans. If we can see what happened to the C's when they played through rehabbing knees and hurting wrists and thumbs and shoulders and backs and other problems, why is it so hard for us to believe, given the very un-LeBron like performances and tendencies we are seeing, that there is actually something wrong with the man?

I think the inconsistency of results, combined with the fact that it was initially (and still) labeled a bone bruise is the reason.

While i agree with you, and would not be shocked either, The fact that he can go from a bad game to a murderous one like game 3 and in some respects game 1 play into the people who believe he is hurt, but not severely injured.

It also hurts him that ESPN/TNT's commentators compared his game 3 preformance to guys like willis and MJ's flu game and won't shut up about how courageous he is during broadcasts.

IT's not his fault, but when people see him doing chasedown blocks with his right hand and destroying the universe in one game, and then a former shell of himself the next while the broadcast crew plays up the fact that he's playing as some sort of ultra courageous endeavor, people get tired of it.

In this case he's the victim of his own hype machine. He probably is banged up, but the media has taken and run with that storyline, and it irks people that an elbow bruise, which seems to affect him some days, and other days be fine, is talked about 24/7 on the WWL.

Tp4U crownsy. You are absolutely right, In this case, besides being despised in Boston and getting no breaks here, he is definitely the victim of his own hype machine in this series and regarding this possible injury.

[Fafnir]

What people forget is that Lebron has sucked in the playoffs whenever a good defensive team gets determined to stop him.

In 08, he was atrocious in 6 out of 7 games. Was it the elbow back then, too? Lebron played great against the magic last year, so people forget that he has sucked in the playoffs for most of his career (that series against the pistons being the exception).

And the final thing that makes me sure this is BS is: I don't know, and no doctor I know knows of, any shot that can only be taken once every 10 days, but which have an effect that wears off before those 10 days.

Cortisone shots, anesthetics, etc. can all be given in shorter spans of time.

You honestly think LeBron has sucked in the playoffs his entire career?

 

No but, he's had a few 2-18's on his resume.  His teammates are his problem but, they weren't in the regular season as per Cavs fans.

Yes he has, but his playoff averages are:

29.3 PPG 8.3 RPG 7.3 APG at 46% FG% and a .561 TS%

That's still MVP level performance, if not as good as his regular season numbers.

[MMacOH]

Okay, here is my take on the elbow.  I think it is hurt, I really do, I haven't used it as an excuse and I still won't, the Celtics are playing great.

I honestly think it was hurting him pretty badly in the Chicago series when he shot the left handed free throw.  He asked Brown to take a timeout and Brown didn't.  He didn't want to hurt his elbow more so he shot left handed.

Now he will not use his elbow as an excuse, the media might, but Lebron won't.  But, not being able to use the elbow as an excuse has caused a lot of media to call him weak, accuse him of conspiring against his coach, accus him of quitting, etc.  Through all of this he has still not mentioned his elbow.  He could easily come out now and say his elbow is really messed up and all would be forgiven, but that's not how he plays.  He plays through injuries.  But, this one may actually be getting the best of him which is affecting hs demeanor.

I could be completely wrong, I could be right.  Who knows?  All of these answers will come in time.  

[Birdbrain]

What people forget is that Lebron has sucked in the playoffs whenever a good defensive team gets determined to stop him.

In 08, he was atrocious in 6 out of 7 games. Was it the elbow back then, too? Lebron played great against the magic last year, so people forget that he has sucked in the playoffs for most of his career (that series against the pistons being the exception).

And the final thing that makes me sure this is BS is: I don't know, and no doctor I know knows of, any shot that can only be taken once every 10 days, but which have an effect that wears off before those 10 days.

Cortisone shots, anesthetics, etc. can all be given in shorter spans of time.

You honestly think LeBron has sucked in the playoffs his entire career?

 

No but, he's had a few 2-18's on his resume.  His teammates are his problem but, they weren't in the regular season as per Cavs fans.

Yes he has, but his playoff averages are:

29.3 PPG 8.3 RPG 7.3 APG at 46% FG% and a .561 TS%

That's still MVP level performance, if not as good as his regular season numbers.

He's the best player by a wide margin and has been for a few years but, he's had bad games they are normally followed by great games.  He was being swarmed last night.

[dlpin]

You honestly think LeBron has sucked in the playoffs his entire career?

 

Re-read what I posted:
"Lebron has sucked in the playoffs whenever a good defensive team gets determined to stop him."

What were the good defensive teams he faced?
Pistons in 07, Spurs in 07, Celtics in 08, Magic in 09.
Against the Pistons in 07 he was great in 3 games, but sucked in another 3, including a 10 point, 33%fg game, a 19 point, 27%fg and 6 turnover game,  and a 20 point, 27%fg game.

Against the spurs, he shot over 40% once, and had at least 5 turnovers all 4 games.

Against the Celtics in 08, he was atrocious in 5 out of 7 games.

Last year against the Magic was the exception.

If you don't believe me, compare his numbers this series with his numbers in the series above.

[nickagneta]

Okay, here is my take on the elbow.  I think it is hurt, I really do, I haven't used it as an excuse and I still won't, the Celtics are playing great.

I honestly think it was hurting him pretty badly in the Chicago series when he shot the left handed free throw.  He asked Brown to take a timeout and Brown didn't.  He didn't want to hurt his elbow more so he shot left handed.

Now he will not use his elbow as an excuse, the media might, but Lebron won't.  But, not being able to use the elbow as an excuse has caused a lot of media to call him weak, accuse him of conspiring against his coach, accus him of quitting, etc.  Through all of this he has still not mentioned his elbow.  He could easily come out now and say his elbow is really messed up and all would be forgiven, but that's not how he plays.  He plays through injuries.  But, this one may actually be getting the best of him which is affecting hs demeanor.

I could be completely wrong, I could be right.  Who knows?  All of these answers will come in time.  

I think you are right.

[Birdbrain]

I like many of us, have seen LeBron play A LOT. He is playing timid. He is extremely reluctant to put up long distance shots. And he is going to his left towards the basket an awful lot more than usual.

These are not circumstances being brought about or forced upon LeBron by the defense the Celtics are playing. These are conscience decisions being made by LeBron to do these things.

I have been saying this through most of this series. This is not some half baked excuse. There is definitely something wrong with his elbow and LeBron is changing his game to accommodate the right elbow. I said it earlier in the week and still believe it, LeBron will be undergoing surgery on that elbow this off season. I would bet my house on it.

What I don't understand about some here at Celticsblog is the vehemence of denial that there could be anything wrong with LeBron. We had no problem putting the inconsistencies of this years regular season performance of the Celtics on rehabilitation of injuries and playing through injuries.

We are for the most part a very astute group of basketball fans. If we can see what happened to the C's when they played through rehabbing knees and hurting wrists and thumbs and shoulders and backs and other problems, why is it so hard for us to believe, given the very un-LeBron like performances and tendencies we are seeing, that there is actually something wrong with the man?

Some of us don't agree.  And I don't really care about other peoples injuries knowing we should be working on a 3 peat.

Cry me a river basically.

You can believe whatever you choose just don't give me crap because I don't care.

[nickagneta]

I like many of us, have seen LeBron play A LOT. He is playing timid. He is extremely reluctant to put up long distance shots. And he is going to his left towards the basket an awful lot more than usual.

These are not circumstances being brought about or forced upon LeBron by the defense the Celtics are playing. These are conscience decisions being made by LeBron to do these things.

I have been saying this through most of this series. This is not some half baked excuse. There is definitely something wrong with his elbow and LeBron is changing his game to accommodate the right elbow. I said it earlier in the week and still believe it, LeBron will be undergoing surgery on that elbow this off season. I would bet my house on it.

What I don't understand about some here at Celticsblog is the vehemence of denial that there could be anything wrong with LeBron. We had no problem putting the inconsistencies of this years regular season performance of the Celtics on rehabilitation of injuries and playing through injuries.

We are for the most part a very astute group of basketball fans. If we can see what happened to the C's when they played through rehabbing knees and hurting wrists and thumbs and shoulders and backs and other problems, why is it so hard for us to believe, given the very un-LeBron like performances and tendencies we are seeing, that there is actually something wrong with the man?

Some of us don't agree.  And I don't really care about other peoples injuries knowing we should be working on a 3 peat.

Cry me a river basically.

You can believe whatever you choose just don't give me crap because I don't care.

As a Celtic fan I feel the same way you do. Screw him and the Cavs. Too bad. If KG doesn't get hurt we are looking at Banner 19 this spring instead of Banner 18.

Play through and shut up. What I got to give LeBron props for though is he is doing just that. Playing through and keeping his mouth shut.

I still think he's hurt.