Chad Ford "C's like Luke Babbit (Nevada) a lot"

[Chris]

I have no interest in any of these project big men with the #19 pick.  If the C's can get a second pick late in the first round, or in the early second, fine, but they can't afford to miss on that one pick, and guys like that are notoriously risky.

My board at #19 would consist of Henry, George, Babbitt, Haywood (although I am skeptical about him), and then keeping an eye open for guys who might slide.  The only big men I am intrigued with at all at 19 are:

Ed Davis (has been sliding a bit lower than I ever expected)
Udoh
Monroe (incredibly unlikely, but he may not do great in individual workouts, which could lead to a slide)
Montiejunas (OK, he is a risk, but he is highly skilled and has a ton of talent.  I much prefer him than just a human pogo stick without much basketball skill)
Patrick Patterson He is an NBA player.  The only question is whether he is Carl Landry/Paul Millsap or Big Baby.

If none of those slide, then I go with a wing who can knock down a shot, and knows how to play basketball.

I would add Orton to the bigs that I'm interested in...Not sure what to think of Sanders at this point, but his reported skill set is very intriguing.

I have little to no interest in Orton at 19.  Again, if they get a second pick, then fine, take a flyer on a raw big man, but not with the 1 pick. 

Orton couldn't get on the floor in Kentucky, is not remarkably big for a center, and is not especially skilled.  Way too big a risk.

[winsomme]

does anybody know why the vertical and agility and benchpress, etc...info hasn't been made available from the combine.

[Chris]

does anybody know why the vertical and agility and benchpress, etc...info hasn't been made available from the combine.

It usually comes out later.  Chad Ford said it would be released later this week. 

[Who]

I have little to no interest in Orton at 19.  Again, if they get a second pick, then fine, take a flyer on a raw big man, but not with the 1 pick. 

Orton couldn't get on the floor in Kentucky, is not remarkably big for a center, and is not especially skilled.  Way too big a risk.

Agreed

[winsomme]

I have no interest in any of these project big men with the #19 pick.  If the C's can get a second pick late in the first round, or in the early second, fine, but they can't afford to miss on that one pick, and guys like that are notoriously risky.

My board at #19 would consist of Henry, George, Babbitt, Haywood (although I am skeptical about him), and then keeping an eye open for guys who might slide.  The only big men I am intrigued with at all at 19 are:

Ed Davis (has been sliding a bit lower than I ever expected)
Udoh
Monroe (incredibly unlikely, but he may not do great in individual workouts, which could lead to a slide)
Montiejunas (OK, he is a risk, but he is highly skilled and has a ton of talent.  I much prefer him than just a human pogo stick without much basketball skill)
Patrick Patterson He is an NBA player.  The only question is whether he is Carl Landry/Paul Millsap or Big Baby.

If none of those slide, then I go with a wing who can knock down a shot, and knows how to play basketball.

I would add Orton to the bigs that I'm interested in...Not sure what to think of Sanders at this point, but his reported skill set is very intriguing.

I have little to no interest in Orton at 19.  Again, if they get a second pick, then fine, take a flyer on a raw big man, but not with the 1 pick. 

Orton couldn't get on the floor in Kentucky, is not remarkably big for a center, and is not especially skilled.  Way too big a risk.

I don't know Chris that you can say that he is not skilled at this point. I mean he is a freshman playing behind top lottery picks.

Sure he is a project big, but that has become a bit of a specialty for our staff....Perk, Big Al, Baby, Powe. That's a pretty good track record.

[Chris]

I have no interest in any of these project big men with the #19 pick.  If the C's can get a second pick late in the first round, or in the early second, fine, but they can't afford to miss on that one pick, and guys like that are notoriously risky.

My board at #19 would consist of Henry, George, Babbitt, Haywood (although I am skeptical about him), and then keeping an eye open for guys who might slide.  The only big men I am intrigued with at all at 19 are:

Ed Davis (has been sliding a bit lower than I ever expected)
Udoh
Monroe (incredibly unlikely, but he may not do great in individual workouts, which could lead to a slide)
Montiejunas (OK, he is a risk, but he is highly skilled and has a ton of talent.  I much prefer him than just a human pogo stick without much basketball skill)
Patrick Patterson He is an NBA player.  The only question is whether he is Carl Landry/Paul Millsap or Big Baby.

If none of those slide, then I go with a wing who can knock down a shot, and knows how to play basketball.

I would add Orton to the bigs that I'm interested in...Not sure what to think of Sanders at this point, but his reported skill set is very intriguing.

I have little to no interest in Orton at 19.  Again, if they get a second pick, then fine, take a flyer on a raw big man, but not with the 1 pick. 

Orton couldn't get on the floor in Kentucky, is not remarkably big for a center, and is not especially skilled.  Way too big a risk.

I don't know Chris that you can say that he is not skilled at this point. I mean he is a freshman playing behind top lottery picks.

Sure he is a project big, but that has become a bit of a specialty for our staff....Perk, Big Al, Baby, Powe. That's a pretty good track record.

He is not a super skilled player.  I am not saying he is not skilled at all, just that he does not have exceptional skills for a center.  I think we can say that.  For one thing, if he was, he would have been playing more, and producing more when he did play.  And more importantly, scouts who have seen plenty of him have said the same thing.  My point was that we are not looking at a 280lb Spencer Hawes.

To compare him to Big Al and Baby, and to a lesser extent, Powe, all of whom showed much more skill in highschool and College than Orton, is not reasonable.

Now, the Perk comparison I can see.  In fact, if I were to compare him to any player in the pros, Perk would be right at the top of the list.  Perk came into the league overweight, raw offensively, but with a very strong frame, and with long arms to make up with his less than ideal height for a Center. 

The problem is, Perk is the exception rather than the rule.  He has other worldly work ethic, and has gotten every drop out of his talent (although it took about 3 years before he was even able to get anywhere near the rotation).  To expect that from Orton (who has had some character questions) is a lot to ask, even if Clifford Ray was working with him. 

So yes, Orton could end up being a good NBA center.  He has the body for it, and has some skills.  However, he has a LONG way to go to get to that point, and players like that generally have an incredibly low success rate...and even lower with the teams that draft them, since they will often wash out with that team, and then catch on when they have had more time to develop.

[jr_3421]

Sure he is a project big, but that has become a bit of a specialty for our staff....Perk, Big Al, Baby, Powe. That's a pretty good track record.

But if we want to get a project big, I think there are players with more upside than Orton.

[Chris]

Sure he is a project big, but that has become a bit of a specialty for our staff....Perk, Big Al, Baby, Powe. That's a pretty good track record.

But if we want to get a project big, I think there are players with more upside than Orton.

I agree.  If the C's did go after a project big (which I don't think they should), guys like Whiteside, Alabi, Jordan and Sanders all have more going for them than Orton IMO.

[winsomme]

does anybody know why the vertical and agility and benchpress, etc...info hasn't been made available from the combine.

It usually comes out later.  Chad Ford said it would be released later this week. 

thanks. definitely waiting on that info for a lot of these guys. especially the wings because with Rondo if you can pick up a guy who can really move and get up there, you can get a lot of easy baskets in transition.

I'll be interested to see what George's vertical is. very interested in him.

also interested in Hayward and Babbitt, but feel like they are going to be off the board by #19.

[Jon Niednagel]

I'm interested in George as well. I'm less interested in Hayward or Babbitt. I hope both are gone by the time the Celtics pick because that means somebody better will have slipped.

[winsomme]

I have little to no interest in Orton at 19.  Again, if they get a second pick, then fine, take a flyer on a raw big man, but not with the 1 pick. 

Orton couldn't get on the floor in Kentucky, is not remarkably big for a center, and is not especially skilled.  Way too big a risk.

I don't know Chris that you can say that he is not skilled at this point. I mean he is a freshman playing behind top lottery picks.

Sure he is a project big, but that has become a bit of a specialty for our staff....Perk, Big Al, Baby, Powe. That's a pretty good track record.

He is not a super skilled player.  I am not saying he is not skilled at all, just that he does not have exceptional skills for a center.  I think we can say that.  For one thing, if he was, he would have been playing more, and producing more when he did play.  And more importantly, scouts who have seen plenty of him have said the same thing.  My point was that we are not looking at a 280lb Spencer Hawes.

To compare him to Big Al and Baby, and to a lesser extent, Powe, all of whom showed much more skill in highschool and College than Orton, is not reasonable.

Now, the Perk comparison I can see.  In fact, if I were to compare him to any player in the pros, Perk would be right at the top of the list.  Perk came into the league overweight, raw offensively, but with a very strong frame, and with long arms to make up with his less than ideal height for a Center. 

The problem is, Perk is the exception rather than the rule.  He has other worldly work ethic, and has gotten every drop out of his talent (although it took about 3 years before he was even able to get anywhere near the rotation).  To expect that from Orton (who has had some character questions) is a lot to ask, even if Clifford Ray was working with him. 

So yes, Orton could end up being a good NBA center.  He has the body for it, and has some skills.  However, he has a LONG way to go to get to that point, and players like that generally have an incredibly low success rate...and even lower with the teams that draft them, since they will often wash out with that team, and then catch on when they have had more time to develop.

.

I think you are being a bit premature on him. I like his size and the clips of him seem to show that he moves quite well with that size.

just to clarify, I wasn't trying to compare him to Big Al. I was just pointing out that our staff has a good track record in developing bigs.

DeAndre Jordon and Roy Hibbert had similar criticisms about their games and have developed into nice NBA players.

I'm not too turned off by his lack of PT in that he was playing behind Patterson and Cousins.

That said, there definitely are other bigs that interest me too at 19, but I just think we need to take a close look at Orton. He could go earlier than 19, but he also could slide to us.

Danny certainly has his work cut out for himself this year because there are almost certainly going to be quality players available when we pick.

I also wouldn't put it past Danny to move up if he really likes someone that may be off the board at 19.

[winsomme]

I'm interested in George as well. I'm less interested in Hayward or Babbitt. I hope both are gone by the time the Celtics pick because that means somebody better will have slipped.

yeah, it seems that both Hayward and Babbitt will be off the board, so someone should drop.

I'm also a bit fearful that George will be off the board too. and not sure who that will means will be slipping.

maybe guys like Avery Bradley, James Anderson, or Xavier Henry....

[wiley]

My problem is I like a lot of these guys.....I'm just not seeing busts right and left as one usually sees......for example:  two draft sites have Dominique Jones being picked in the second round.  I think he's a lock for a solid NBA career.  One site has Stanley Robinson 8th or something in the second round.....I mean....he's going to make it in the league, no doubt.

So why doesn't Danny rebuild the Celtics through this year's draft, trading our 2011 pick, buying a pick,  trade or sign and trade someone who's not in our 8 man playoff rotation....

I'd like two more picks after 19 and one in the 2cnd round......I know it's unrealstic....but:

1.  The players taken will have no pressure on them
2.  They will get to learn from some of the best of all time
3.  They will experience going deep through the playoffs.
4.  They will be more ready to step in when the big 3 step out of the picture.....


So, goodbye to nearly everyone 9-15,  Hello

1.  Damion James
2.  Larry Sanders
3.  Avery Johnson/Dominque Jones
4.  Dominque Jones/Terrico White
5.  Dexter PIttman/Tiny Gallon/Pablo Aquilar/or whomever.....

Damion James becomes our 5th big in place of Sheldon Williams.  Larry Sander is project big in year 1.

Resing Ray and Tony, and sign Mike Miller as many would like.....That's 14 guys....

okay, just noticed some pretty large changes on nbadraft.net.....off to check it out.....

[winsomme]

I'm interested in George as well. I'm less interested in Hayward or Babbitt. I hope both are gone by the time the Celtics pick because that means somebody better will have slipped.

you know one thing Danny could do is make a promise to Donatas Motiejunas if for no other reason than to keep him in the draft. Someone really should draft him earlier based on the scouting reports, but some boards show him slipping which could mean he takes his name out of the draft.

players leaving the draft is bad for us, plus in the case that he did drop I certainly wouldn't mind coming away from this draft with potentially the next Dirk...

[Chris]

I'm interested in George as well. I'm less interested in Hayward or Babbitt. I hope both are gone by the time the Celtics pick because that means somebody better will have slipped.

yeah, it seems that both Hayward and Babbitt will be off the board, so someone should drop.

I'm also a bit fearful that George will be off the board too. and not sure who that will means will be slipping.

maybe guys like Avery Bradley, James Anderson, or Xavier Henry....

Bradley is one of the more interesting guys for the C's, along with Bledsoe.  PG is certainly the last position the C's need in the long term with Rondo locked up, but they do need a backup to him, and talent is talent.

Bledsoe seems like an elite talent, who might be slipping because he was forced to play out of position last season.  He is certainly a risk, because he was not great at Kentucky, but the talent is absolutely there for him to be a high lottery value.

Bradley is even more interesting though.  With his lockdown defensive ability, I think there is little doubt that he has a place in the NBA.  The question is whether he will be valuable enough to the C's as a backup, and whether he can make the leap on the offensive side.  

Honestly, I would not have a problem with either of those guys, although they would not be at the top of my list.  If Danny did pick them, I think it would be a sign that he thinks they have a chance to be really special though.