Author Topic: Intimidation and the refs  (Read 3964 times)

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Intimidation and the refs
« on: May 02, 2010, 09:31:12 AM »

Offline Meadowlark_Scal

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What I saw as the turning point last night was a combo of both. Shaq hacked Rondo for the 2nd or 3rd time as he came in for a layup. Shsaq wasn't even in the paint when Rondo drove in initially, he ran over specifically to send Rondo a message....Don't come in here anymore with that. Now if the game was evenly ref'd that would have been a flagarent, no not "playoff" basketball as our friend Reggie Miller said, it is a flagarent, because the NBA set those up to keep people from physicallly whacking someone instead of playing the game....and to avoid retaliation, which is my next point.

 You see, that was the turning point on us, the refs put us into a situation where everyone had 3 fouls in the third, not a good place to be. That is when players play catiously, to avoid getting #4 and sitting out for a while, that is how the refs control who is running the game. The only way around that is to always hit your outside shots. Almost impossible, also because the refs will call a screen foul, or 3 seconds, or something to further slow your momentum.....

  The last point here is that PP should have layed out MO Williams, the way Shaq hit Rondo on that dunk. That was Cleve's turning point. Mo started hitting everything...and that was that. PP shouldn't have been the only one to get near Mo, he just ran the floor with the ball unempeded, and went in for a dunk,......but whoever was back there should have made sure it NEVER HAPPENED that way.....no Mo W dunk..and if he hit the floor hard, well that is "PLAYOFF" basketball, like Reggie boy said....Then we show, that the C's are in it for real also, and that you don't whack our guy without a price...!   That is just my opinion along with some experience there...! Personally, I would have sent mo into the celler.

Re: Intimidation and the refs
« Reply #1 on: May 02, 2010, 10:04:05 AM »

Offline OhioGreen

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Kevin McHale totally agrees with you! Kurt Rambis, not so much! ;)

Re: Intimidation and the refs
« Reply #2 on: May 02, 2010, 10:05:12 AM »

Offline Brendan

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What I saw as the turning point last night was a combo of both. Shaq hacked Rondo for the 2nd or 3rd time as he came in for a layup. Shsaq wasn't even in the paint when Rondo drove in initially, he ran over specifically to send Rondo a message....Don't come in here anymore with that. Now if the game was evenly ref'd that would have been a flagarent, no not "playoff" basketball as our friend Reggie Miller said, it is a flagarent, because the NBA set those up to keep people from physicallly whacking someone instead of playing the game....and to avoid retaliation, which is my next point.

 You see, that was the turning point on us, the refs put us into a situation where everyone had 3 fouls in the third, not a good place to be. That is when players play catiously, to avoid getting #4 and sitting out for a while, that is how the refs control who is running the game. The only way around that is to always hit your outside shots. Almost impossible, also because the refs will call a screen foul, or 3 seconds, or something to further slow your momentum.....

  The last point here is that PP should have layed out MO Williams, the way Shaq hit Rondo on that dunk. That was Cleve's turning point. Mo started hitting everything...and that was that. PP shouldn't have been the only one to get near Mo, he just ran the floor with the ball unempeded, and went in for a dunk,......but whoever was back there should have made sure it NEVER HAPPENED that way.....no Mo W dunk..and if he hit the floor hard, well that is "PLAYOFF" basketball, like Reggie boy said....Then we show, that the C's are in it for real also, and that you don't whack our guy without a price...!   That is just my opinion along with some experience there...! Personally, I would have sent mo into the celler.
I thought the refs called the game unevenly and the Celts didn't take advantage. In the third quarter they called a lot of ticky tack fouls and the C's got away from going into the paint - in the fourth quarter they started letting them play. I'm not saying it was bias, but the net result was bad for the C's.

Re: Intimidation and the refs
« Reply #3 on: May 02, 2010, 10:09:01 AM »

Offline vinnie

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Sorry, but that was not a flagrant foul on Shaq.

Re: Intimidation and the refs
« Reply #4 on: May 02, 2010, 10:26:53 AM »

Offline fairweatherfan

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What I saw as the turning point last night was a combo of both. Shaq hacked Rondo for the 2nd or 3rd time as he came in for a layup. Shsaq wasn't even in the paint when Rondo drove in initially, he ran over specifically to send Rondo a message....Don't come in here anymore with that. Now if the game was evenly ref'd that would have been a flagarent, no not "playoff" basketball as our friend Reggie Miller said, it is a flagarent, because the NBA set those up to keep people from physicallly whacking someone instead of playing the game....and to avoid retaliation, which is my next point.

 You see, that was the turning point on us, the refs put us into a situation where everyone had 3 fouls in the third, not a good place to be. That is when players play catiously, to avoid getting #4 and sitting out for a while, that is how the refs control who is running the game. The only way around that is to always hit your outside shots. Almost impossible, also because the refs will call a screen foul, or 3 seconds, or something to further slow your momentum.....

  The last point here is that PP should have layed out MO Williams, the way Shaq hit Rondo on that dunk. That was Cleve's turning point. Mo started hitting everything...and that was that. PP shouldn't have been the only one to get near Mo, he just ran the floor with the ball unempeded, and went in for a dunk,......but whoever was back there should have made sure it NEVER HAPPENED that way.....no Mo W dunk..and if he hit the floor hard, well that is "PLAYOFF" basketball, like Reggie boy said....Then we show, that the C's are in it for real also, and that you don't whack our guy without a price...!   That is just my opinion along with some experience there...! Personally, I would have sent mo into the celler.
I thought the refs called the game unevenly and the Celts didn't take advantage. In the third quarter they called a lot of ticky tack fouls and the C's got away from going into the paint - in the fourth quarter they started letting them play. I'm not saying it was bias, but the net result was bad for the C's.

I agree - by the time the refs eased up on the calls, our guys were still used to playing tentatively because of how the refs had been calling it, and their own foul trouble.  We didn't adjust nearly fast enough to the increased standards of contact. 

I'd've liked to see someone knock down Mo the way they were taking down Rondo, but almost everyone on the floor was in foul trouble by that point.  Pierce in particular couldn't afford a foul on that dunk, and he was the only one in position to give one.

Re: Intimidation and the refs
« Reply #5 on: May 02, 2010, 10:59:25 AM »

Offline pearljammer10

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Definitely agree that Pierce should have fouled Williams on that dunk. But to have a need to "lay him out" I mean come on thats just dirty. Pierce should have given him a foul but with no intent to send him to the ground.

And how can you say that was a flagrant foul on Shaq? Rondo is what 170 pounds? At most? Running full speed and jumping in the air, what do you think is going to happen when he hits a 350 pound 7 footer? There was no malicious intent to Shaqs foul and if it was a player like Pierce driving to the lane he might not have even gotten a foul call cause honestly, Shaq didnt really bump Rondo all that hard. No flagrant foul. I cant believe the whining around here. The blame solely lies on the celtics shoulders.

Re: Intimidation and the refs
« Reply #6 on: May 02, 2010, 11:24:28 AM »

Offline Meadowlark_Scal

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SHAQ didn't hit the ball, he hit rondo ON THE HEAD...knocked him to the ground....what do you think would have happened if PP knocked mo down......HE did it on purpose it was sending a message to stay out of the lane....! And for mo.....you just block it aggressively, and send the same message..."don't bring that in here!".....reggie even said "that is playoff basketball" which means....in some sense you can hit the other guy harder than during the regular season...what game were you watching...? don't you see rondo getting thrown to the floor so often...you think that is just normal....what about jamison continually holding KG's arm...have you ever played bball....they grab your limbs like a UFC fighter, then twist and fall so it looks like you threw them down...it is okay if you don't know...but that is what was happening.....and don't give me "that is the way it is"...because it wasn't called even that way......relaying the facts isn't whining.....this is also what miami did, same arm grabbing twisting holding, except wade was the only one getting away with it......did you see wade run rondo down from behind.....rondo is our star.....if YOU were on the team, would you let them continually beat your guy like that.....if so..i am glad you aren't on MY team...you get what you give, you start it..i will finish it, you play clean i will play clean...that is team ball, the C's need to give it to 'em the same, send the same message..I know PP had 3 on him then...but mo sparked the game after that, hit 4-5 shots after the dunk...that is momentum, game changer, coupled with the ref handcuffs, perk getting called after he got that rebound for pushing off.......

Re: Intimidation and the refs
« Reply #7 on: May 02, 2010, 11:26:53 AM »

Offline Meadowlark_Scal

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that is the problem with shaq and the refs, they let him back people down all day when they are in position, even barkley says that is a foul.....what does it matter if he is 350 lbs..he didn't even hit the ball, wasn't in the play, ran over and swiped the guy out in the air, during a layup....hit him right in the forehead......

Re: Intimidation and the refs
« Reply #8 on: May 02, 2010, 11:37:14 AM »

Offline jdpapa3

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Didn't think it was a flagrant. Looked like Shaq was going for the ball to swat it and is a big and strong player. Rondo might weigh 1/3 of what he weighs so the result was not surprising.

Re: Intimidation and the refs
« Reply #9 on: May 02, 2010, 11:40:05 AM »

Offline wdleehi

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Not flagrant. 


It was a hard playoff foul.


The type the Celtics should have been giving to Lebron instead of those little touch fouls he can power through. 

Re: Intimidation and the refs
« Reply #10 on: May 02, 2010, 11:43:08 AM »

Offline Meadowlark_Scal

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Well, it is just diff opinions and i don't want to argue with anyone over it...that is my opinion,,,flag or a sort of added value foul.....what i point to is how it changed the way rondo went to the hole after that....he did hit him on the head, he never touched the ball, it looked like a deliberate, aggresive swipe, that says to me....something is going to get hit...but maybe that is just me....again, i am not here to argue it...it won't change anything..will it.   i just hate how the C's let rondo get beat continually un avenged..that sends a message that it is okay, keep doing it...we don't want a foul..we'll stay out of the paint from now on MR Cleve.......

Re: Intimidation and the refs
« Reply #11 on: May 02, 2010, 11:45:41 AM »

Offline looseball

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Sorry, but that was not a flagrant foul on Shaq.

I agree.  I think you want your big guys to guard the paint, go for the block every time, and not try to take charges against much smaller guys.  It sends a message (without being flagrant).

Re: Intimidation and the refs
« Reply #12 on: May 02, 2010, 11:56:17 AM »

Offline anotherbanner

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Not flagrant. 


It was a hard playoff foul.


The type the Celtics should have been giving to Lebron instead of those little touch fouls he can power through. 

If anyone gives LeBron a hard "playoff" foul THEN the refs will call a flagrant foul. This does not work for anybody else. Well, maybe Kobe.

Re: Intimidation and the refs
« Reply #13 on: May 02, 2010, 11:57:42 AM »

Offline Tai

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I definitely agree that that foul more or less scared Rondo away from the paint. As far as a flagrant foul, I wouldn't want flagrants called over how badly someone falls. That's the only argument I could see for calling a flagrant on Shaq.

None the less, though, we need ROndo to go in the paint more.

Re: Intimidation and the refs
« Reply #14 on: May 02, 2010, 12:00:26 PM »

Offline wdleehi

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Not flagrant. 


It was a hard playoff foul.


The type the Celtics should have been giving to Lebron instead of those little touch fouls he can power through. 

If anyone gives LeBron a hard "playoff" foul THEN the refs will call a flagrant foul. This does not work for anybody else. Well, maybe Kobe.


It is the chance the Celtics have to take.


Wallace gave Lebron one and it was not called Flagrant.