How anyone can continue to think this team is a contender is beyond me

[indeedproceed]

I don't care anymore. The playoffs will come soon enough. I'm done lamenting the regular season that was, I'm just gonna watch and hope.

And I'm going to pray Kevin Garnett starts sleeping in a hyperbolic chamber and begins bathing in Hydroderm Age Defying Wrinkle serum.

If only KG were the only problem.

A healthy spring 2008 KG makes this thread irrelevant. He might never be that again, but the same swagger, with the ability to back it up, I believe this team would be a completely different animal.

Adding a vintage 1993 Michael Jordan to this team would make this thread irrelevant. But neither he nor spring-08 KG is walking through that door. Time waits for no man.

Yeah, that is as true as it is trite, but my point is that Garnett is not leading the team. I don't know who else is thinking what I'm thinking when they watch Garnett play, but I see a dog who got beat in a fight. Garnett might still talk the same kinda gangbuster trash he used to, but he doesn't play like he used to. I'm not just talking about a lack of explosiveness in his legs. I mean confidence wise.

He's getting blocked, he's tentative around the hoop, he's getting ignored in late game situations despite the FACT that the Celtics are the best when Rondo and KG are running the pick and roll.

This is all speculation, but I think Garnett has lost his mojo.

[Kuberski33]

Pierce has either lost it completely, or he's hurt.  But the guy I see who's main offensive move seems to be shooting the long range three's is nothing close to the player he was even at the start of this season. 

Rondo played hard 2nd half -- but all the made you realize is that he didn't play hard the first half. 

I think that Memphis got close to double the amount of rebounds the C's got. Epic Fail for KG and Perk.  Sheed actually wasn't completely awful tonight.  Baby was however.

I can't decide whether this team has quit on Doc or just can't play anymore.  Bet Wyc and Danny are having that conversation tonight.

[PLamb]

If we come in 4th in the East, just think, we get to play Milwaukee in a seven game series in the first round

I guess the Big Three might have to make some early May tee times times if that is true because as much as some are saying a second round exit, I can't honestly state at this time that this team can beat Milwaukee in a seven game series

They might done after one round

Are you really counting the Celtics out of a series against the Bucks when we just lost to them by 2 points? As bad as we've been I'd be pretty shocked if we lost to the bucks 4 times in a 7 game series.

All I am saying is that given the way they have been playing since Christmas and given the way Milwaukee has played since the end of January, I wouldn't take a first round win as something of a given

Since January 26th the Bucks are 16-4 beating Cleveland, Boston and Miami three times as impressive wins with an OT loss at Atlanta

Since January 26th the Celtics are 11-10 beating LA, Portland and Miami as impressive wins

Also one of these teams beat New Jersey in that time and one didn't, I'll let everyone figure out that one for themselves

[Kuberski33]

I think this team goes out in the first round -- either via sweep or in 5.  I was at the game tonight and it reminded me of the late Sydney Wicks/Curtis Rowe era when the team Tommy won two titles with completely fell apart.

Something is seriously broken here.

[FatjohnReturns]

I think this team goes out in the first round -- either via sweep or in 5.  I was at the game tonight and it reminded me of the late Sydney Wicks/Curtis Rowe era when the team Tommy won two titles with completely fell apart.

Something is seriously broken here.

What do you think is going on with this the team Kuberski?

[buzz]

17-18 since XMas. Below .500 for almost half a season's worth of games.

Bottom line is that this team just doesn't have the legs anymore. Too old and too slow.

Not saying that they are trying very hard, but it really has nothing to do with effort. We are just not physically capable.

[PLamb]

I would really hate to think that this team just had their stars get seriously old overnight

It wouldn't be the first time it has happened to a star player where they hit 30,000, 35,000, or 40,000 minutes and then they just lose it

It might be the first time in NBA history that it has happened to three star players on the same team all at the same time though

Time will tell and I guess we really won't have that answer until next season

And really really would hate to think that though since we still have three more years and $60+ million tied up in Big Three personnel

[Kuberski33]

What do you think is going on with this the team Kuberski?

I'm having trouble putting my finger on it. I think it starts with Pierce and KG.  As I said in a previous post, Pierce is a shell of himself.  He's got no quickness and no lift. Same with KG.  I think he's doing the best he can, but physically its just not happening right now.

But it goes way beyond that.  Perkins has stunk too many times this year.  And Baby has been equally as bad.  Don't know what the final rebound totals were but last I checked tonight it was something like 45-23 for Memphis.  You get killed like that off the boards and you're just not trying.

Rondo seems to me to play hard about half the time.  Daniels has added very little of late and Robinson, their supposed microwave shooter, hardly shoots.

Without Pierce taking it to the hole its strictly a jump shooting team and that doesn't help -- especially on nights like tonight when nothings going in.

It's a total mess, that's all I know and I don't think a band aid approach is going to fix this short term. I'm not sure anything can unfortunately.  It goes beyond injuries, but it also goes beyond certain players not trying hard enough.

[Who]

About 2-3 weeks ago, my expectations for this team to regain their early season form was somewhere around 90%.

Now, those expectations have plummeted to about 10-15%.

Two Reasons

There are two main reasons for that drop.

#1 -- I had said that I would give Garnett 4-6 weeks after returning to the court before becoming worried about his performances. His time is now up and my belief in his ability to regain his early season form is falling by the game. Garnett looked like he was on his way back to being an elite player during the Portland + LA games but he has been unable to sustain that type of form.

#2 -- I think this team has had the stuffing knocked out of them. I think they lack confidence + cohesion + know how in how to win games. I think they're beaten and exhausted. I think they've had too many losses, too many setbacks, too many failures to just snap out of it. I do not think this team can flip a switch and get back to Contender status.

I think the only way they get back there is through short steps in the right direction and by doing so they can rebuild some momentum + belief. Regain their collective understanding of what it takes to win, of what they need from one another to get the job done. It will be a long hard slog and it will take a great deal of effort. Nothing on that road will be handed to them, they'll have to fight for every inch.

As I watch this team collapse against NJ, repeat that performance against Washington and fail again against Memphis and Milwaukee ... I simply do not see this team playing with enough focus + effort, being mentally tough enough, to do what is needed to be done.

I think the team is trying to avoid the harsh realities of their situation. I think they're lying to themselves and what they're capable of. I think those lies are stopping the team from putting forth the type of effort they need to slowly turn around the season. Without that intent, without that drive, without that understanding that their season is on the line ... I just cannot see this team being able to fight through this and rediscover their best form.

[PLamb]

About 2-3 weeks, my expectations for this team to regain their early season form was somewhere around 90%.

Now, that has dropped to about 10-15%.

Two Reasons

There are two main reasons for that drop.

#1 -- I had said that I would give Garnett 4-6 weeks after returning to the court before becoming worried about his performances. His time is now up and my belief in his ability to regain his early season form is falling by the game. Garnett looked like he was on his way back to being an elite player during the Portland + LA games but he has been unable to sustain that type of form.

#2 -- I think this team has had the stuffing knocked out of them. I think they lack confidence + cohesion + know how in how to win games. I think they're beaten and exhausted. I think they've had too many losses, too many setbacks, too many failures to just snap out of it. I do not think this team can flip a switch and get back to Contender status.

I think the only way they get back there is through short steps in the right direction and by doing so they can rebuild some momentum + belief. Regain their collective understanding of what it takes to win, of what they need from one another to get the job done. It will be a long hard slog and it will take a great deal of effort. Nothing on that road will be handed to them, they'll have to fight for every inch.

As I watch this team collapse against NJ, repeat that performance against Washington and fail again against Memphis and Milwaukee ... I simply do not see this team playing with enough focus + effort, being mentally tough enough, to do what is needed to be done.

I think the team is trying to avoid the harsh realities of their situation. I think they're lying to themselves and what they're capable of. I think those lies are stopping the team from putting forth the type of effort they need to slowly turn around the season. Without that intent, without that drive, without that understanding that their season is on the line ... I just cannot see this team being able to fight through this and rediscover their best form.

Yet in another thread you said you thought they would win 13-14 of the next 19 games, against tough competition

I don't get it

You think they don't have what it takes to turn it around, flip a switch and do well but you think they will win 13-14 games

Can they really do both

[barefacedmonk]

Thank god the likes of Thomas Alva Edison, The Wright Brothers, Alexander Fleming, et al, didn't live in the dotcom era. Man, they would have given up in a heartbeat. There is no shortage of nay sayers. To be mad/disappointed at the present is one thing....but to give up on the future is another. Hope and belief is what brought the Big 3 together....lest we forget.

[CelticG1]

I think the team is trying to avoid the harsh realities of their situation. I think they're lying to themselves and what they're capable of. I think those lies are stopping the team from putting forth the type of effort they need to slowly turn around the season. Without that intent, without that drive, without that understanding that their season is on the line ... I just cannot see this team being able to fight through this and rediscover their best form.

TP my man. Out of everything you said this paragraph really stuck out to me and just seems spot on. I have no idea what is really going on or if they will turn a corner but the best way to start is through baby steps as you were saying.

Instead of putting forth the effort they need to they are relying on the names on the back of their jersey's. Garnett, Pierce, Allen, Rondo, Wallace, Finley, Robinson etc. That certainly sounds good but names aren't going to do anything. They need to stop relying on reputation and just thinking that these names are going to turn it around and save everyone.

They need to go back to square one and take it one game at a time. No playoff talk, no talking about struggles or what there problem is. They need to go out and beat the pacers on Friday. They are trying to figure out their struggles for the big picture and they have forgot about focusing at the task at hand: the next game on the schedule.

[Bahku]

Call me a "blind optimist" if you want, but if you think this team is "done" and that they, (especially the Big Three), don't have what it takes physically, mentally or spiritually to dig down deep and still kick basketball butt, then you just plain do not know what these guys are about or the intense level of determination and spirit they possess. Please feel free to save this post and throw it back in my face at the end of the season if things don't change, but I honestly am not too worried about eating these words, (besides, I've eaten worse, trust me ).

[ACF]

When the playoffs begin, all teams are 0-0. I take great comfort in that.

[Who]

About 2-3 weeks, my expectations for this team to regain their early season form was somewhere around 90%.

Now, that has dropped to about 10-15%.

Two Reasons

There are two main reasons for that drop.

#1 -- I had said that I would give Garnett 4-6 weeks after returning to the court before becoming worried about his performances. His time is now up and my belief in his ability to regain his early season form is falling by the game. Garnett looked like he was on his way back to being an elite player during the Portland + LA games but he has been unable to sustain that type of form.

#2 -- I think this team has had the stuffing knocked out of them. I think they lack confidence + cohesion + know how in how to win games. I think they're beaten and exhausted. I think they've had too many losses, too many setbacks, too many failures to just snap out of it. I do not think this team can flip a switch and get back to Contender status.

I think the only way they get back there is through short steps in the right direction and by doing so they can rebuild some momentum + belief. Regain their collective understanding of what it takes to win, of what they need from one another to get the job done. It will be a long hard slog and it will take a great deal of effort. Nothing on that road will be handed to them, they'll have to fight for every inch.

As I watch this team collapse against NJ, repeat that performance against Washington and fail again against Memphis and Milwaukee ... I simply do not see this team playing with enough focus + effort, being mentally tough enough, to do what is needed to be done.

I think the team is trying to avoid the harsh realities of their situation. I think they're lying to themselves and what they're capable of. I think those lies are stopping the team from putting forth the type of effort they need to slowly turn around the season. Without that intent, without that drive, without that understanding that their season is on the line ... I just cannot see this team being able to fight through this and rediscover their best form.

Yet in another thread you said you thought they would win 13-14 of the next 19 games, against tough competition

I don't get it

You think they don't have what it takes to turn it around, flip a switch and do well but you think they will win 13-14 games

Can they really do both

Yes, for three reasons (1) performance + results aren't completely tied together. I think this team can still win at a good clip and not be good enough to be a contender. (2) My math was wrong, I thought there was 20 games instead of 19, so it should be 12-13 wins instead of 13-14 wins (3) I don't think the schedule is that tough.

I don't consider Houston or Toronto as tough opponents. The Rockets are a much easier team to beat following their mid-season trade. They have lost a lot of their toughness, their grit. Nowadays they're merely a streaky jump shooting offensive team. If the C's get them on one of their good days they could be a handful ... but otherwise I'd expect the C's to take care of business. Same reasons with the Raptors.

I also think Denver is vulnerable without Kenyon Martin. His loss is a big blow to their big man rotation + their overall defense. And I like the C's chances of winning 2 out of 3 to close the season against Milwaukee/Chicago/Milwaukee. Heck, the Celtics almost beat the Bucks despite a poor performance win Milwaukee and at a time when the Bucks were in midst of their hottest stretch of the season (unsustainable form I believe).

That is why I would expect the Celtics to win 12-13. I don't expect them to fold and give up on the season entirely ... I think they'll up their performances over the remainder of the season. They almost have to given how bad they've been recently ... I'm just not convinced they'll be committed enough to reach the heights they need to reach in order to become a legitimate contender again.