Could adding Iguodala or Martin lead to the C's next dynasty?

[wdleehi]

The Celtics would need to acquire a top 15 player, possibly a top 10 guy, via free agency in order to be a contender again.

Unless the NBA shifts it's rules towards strong teams vs. strong Star.

[FatjohnReturns]

Sorry you underestimate Ray. The Celtics problems have little to do with Ray. If anything I think dealing Ray would actually kill team psyche. Possibly with Iggy we might improve but why would philly do that deal? Ray is gonna end up being the fall guy for Ainge's recent personnal decisions. (Rasheed,Powe,Birdman). Unfortunetly the next NBA dynasty will be the Cavs.

[Chris]

Sorry you underestimate Ray. The Celtics problems have little to do with Ray. If anything I think dealing Ray would actually kill team psyche. Possibly with Iggy we might improve but why would philly do that deal? Ray is gonna end up being the fall guy for Ainge's recent personnal decisions. (Rasheed,Powe,Birdman). Unfortunetly the next NBA dynasty will be the Cavs.

I think the problem is that this team has no chemistry right now, and their psyche is already dead.

The other issue to me is that this team is not good defensively anymore.  They cannot hide Ray anymore.  So if they can bring in a guy like Iggy (I don't think its possible either, fwiw, but hypothetically speaking), it could improve things.

[rondohondo]

Sorry you underestimate Ray. The Celtics problems have little to do with Ray. If anything I think dealing Ray would actually kill team psyche. Possibly with Iggy we might improve but why would philly do that deal? Ray is gonna end up being the fall guy for Ainge's recent personnal decisions. (Rasheed,Powe,Birdman). Unfortunetly the next NBA dynasty will be the Cavs.

If you can get Iggy or Martin you HAVE TO TRADE Ray. They give us just as good of a chance as ray for the next few years and they would greatly improve our chances in the future after KG and Sheed come off the books in 2012

[FatjohnReturns]

I posted this in the other trade Ray thread. Sorry I dont believe the Celtics struggles have to do with Ray. Therefore I dont think trading him will help much. Possibly with Iggy we would improve a little but why would Philly do that deal? I think our struggles can be attributed to a couple factors.

(1) Interior defense and reboudning.(Wow i miss Leon)
(2) Docs limited skills managing rotations(Lakers game and TA) (3) Rasheeds lackluster attitude.(really affected team psyche)

Ray may become the fall guy but I seriously doubt the team will improve with what we could get at this point for Ray.

[PosImpos]

Unfortunately Boston is not a top free agent destination, so it's going to be difficult to become a true contender again without some creative trades.

[Eddie20]

Rather have AI than Martin because he has a much higher ceiling. Martin is a better fit, but there are injury concerns and I question just how much better he can get, if at all.

The salaries are similar in the 12-13 season (only about a 2M difference), so going with AI wouldn't really impact a FA signing in the summer of 12.

[wdleehi]

I posted this in the other trade Ray thread. Sorry I dont believe the Celtics struggles have to do with Ray. Therefore I dont think trading him will help much. Possibly with Iggy we would improve a little but why would Philly do that deal? I think our struggles can be attributed to a couple factors.

(1) Interior defense and reboudning.(Wow i miss Leon)
(2) Docs limited skills managing rotations(Lakers game and TA) (3) Rasheeds lackluster attitude.(really affected team psyche)

Ray may become the fall guy but I seriously doubt the team will improve with what we could get at this point for Ray.

Ray is the one major trading piece the Celtics have.  So he is the one that would have to go in a major shake up.



Is Ray the main reason for the Celtics struggles?   Of course not.



Is he a major contributing factor?   Yes.  Diminished shooting.  Defense has dropped off.  He is at the point in the career where when SGs drop, they drop like a stone.  Stop comparing him to Miller.  Just because Miller was an exception, doesn't mean Ray will.


So, a good trade will upgrade that position.  A good trade will give the Celtics a player that can be here for a long period of time.  A good trade could be the wakeup call the rest of this team needs to get going again. 

[rondohondo]

Unfortunately Boston is not a top free agent destination, so it's going to be difficult to become a true contender again without some creative trades.

I always hear this ,but I just don't agree. If a player wants to win championships is he really going to care that it gets cold in Boston for 5 months? The C's would already have Rondo, Iggy or Martin and Perk as their core . They would all be relatively young players entering their prime years together(Rondo 26, Perk 27, Iguodala 28 or Martin 29). Rondo and Perk already have rings. They would just need one superstar ( Melo , Durant or Dwight Howard) to lead us to multiple championships.   

I think that would be very attractive to one of those players. Not to mention the history of the Franchise.

[the_Bird]

They've got to do something.  Ray's been showing his age for a while, and he's too valuable a trade chip right now to reposition the franchise going forward to let just expire. 

I think I'd prefer AI over Martin just because I'd prefer his D; seems like he'd be able to handle at least some of the heavy lifting on Joe Johnson and LeBron and D-Wade and those guys, maybe helping save Pierce's legs a bit. Don't see how you do NOT do that trade if Philly will take it.

What if they also want to to swap Dalembert for Perk, though?  Would you do Ray/Perk for AI/Dalembert?  Perk's due for a huge raise in another year, we may or may not be able to hold onto him anyway....

[FatjohnReturns]

Su

I posted this in the other trade Ray thread. Sorry I dont believe the Celtics struggles have to do with Ray. Therefore I dont think trading him will help much. Possibly with Iggy we would improve a little but why would Philly do that deal? I think our struggles can be attributed to a couple factors.

(1) Interior defense and reboudning.(Wow i miss Leon)
(2) Docs limited skills managing rotations(Lakers game and TA) (3) Rasheeds lackluster attitude.(really affected team psyche)

Ray may become the fall guy but I seriously doubt the team will improve with what we could get at this point for Ray.

Ray is the one major trading piece the Celtics have.  So he is the one that would have to go in a major shake up.



Is Ray the main reason for the Celtics struggles?   Of course not.



Is he a major contributing factor?   Yes.  Diminished shooting.  Defense has dropped off.  He is at the point in the career where when SGs drop, they drop like a stone.  Stop comparing him to Miller.  Just because Miller was an exception, doesn't mean Ray will.


So, a good trade will upgrade that position.  A good trade will give the Celtics a player that can be here for a long period of time.  A good trade could be the wakeup call the rest of this team needs to get going again. 

Who can we REALISTICALLY get that will be a upgrade?

[rondohondo]

They've got to do something.  Ray's been showing his age for a while, and he's too valuable a trade chip right now to reposition the franchise going forward to let just expire. 

I think I'd prefer AI over Martin just because I'd prefer his D; seems like he'd be able to handle at least some of the heavy lifting on Joe Johnson and LeBron and D-Wade and those guys, maybe helping save Pierce's legs a bit. Don't see how you do NOT do that trade if Philly will take it.

What if they also want to to swap Dalembert for Perk, though?  Would you do Ray/Perk for AI/Dalembert?  Perk's due for a huge raise in another year, we may or may not be able to hold onto him anyway....

If I could get Iguodala and Dalembert for Ray and Perk I have to do this. Both players fit better with Rondo at this point Iguodala and Dalembert can both play above the rim and are very athletic which we can use, and both can run with Rondo on the fast break getting us easier points. Perk is a better Man to Man low post defender , but I actually think Dalembert might be more effective against Bynum or Gasol if we reach the finals because he is longer and taller than perk. Dalembert numbers are actually pretty good and he would add more rebounding and shot blocking.

 We would still have KG ,Dalembert and Sheed to play low post D against Howard and Shaq. I am sure we would pick up a buyout to throw up against them to. Kurt Thomas?

[Who]

Dalembert improves that lack of quickness amongst the big man rotation.

[Chris]

Dalembert improves that lack of quickness amongst the big man rotation.

He does.  I am a HUGE Dalembert detractor, but I think he could actually help this team.  He is a terrible team defender, and doesn't block anyone out, but if he can actually attack the boards, and cause a few guys to think twice about taking it into the lane, he would give this team something they are missing.

[the_Bird]

RealGM says that it works.  Be hard to trade 40% of what's still one of the best starting lineups in the league for 40% of the lineup for a bad team, but I'd *love* to see Iggy here, and as much as I love Perk wouldn't mind Dalembert.  He's expiring next year, too, IIRC. 

Would definately change the complexion of the team.  Seems like we'd be better matched up against Atlanta, although I'm not sure if we'd be better off against Orlando and Cleveland.  Worried we'd really be missing Perk against Shaq and Dwight.