This team needs changes, and trading Ray should be one of them (merged)

[Eddie20]

Who are we going to trade Ray for that's going to solve our problems, either in the short or long term? 

Don't think we can just sit on our hands and pray/hope that somehow time will light a fire in this team.

I like how you think just any trade will make this happen. Now, your answer seems sideways. Trades just for the sake of trades will not do anything.

I don't think it's necessary to provide a link to every Allen rumored deal that has been mentioned on this site or others in order to provide examples of moves that would benefit our team.

[csfansince60s]

Who are we going to trade Ray for that's going to solve our problems, either in the short or long term? 

9th time since Christmas we end up losing when we're up by double digits. As I stated in the OP, Ray may not be the problem, but he can be the trade bait for the solution: new blood>>>new life. I agree we have to be judicious in our trades, but a major trade is the only thing that can shake up this team. I guess being embarrassed 9 times is not enough. This team needs to be shaken (woken)  up in a big way.  

[FatjohnReturns]

Too early to say. Isn't this the first game we have had all our players available to play. With Garnett,Pierce and Marquis still coming back we need to patient.

Who are we going to trade Ray for that's going to solve our problems, either in the short or long term? 

Roys right there is no trade that will solve these problems. We should stay the course and see what happens. I still like our chances with everyone healthy.

[Roy Hobbs]

Who are we going to trade Ray for that's going to solve our problems, either in the short or long term? 

9th time since Christmas we end up losing when we're up by double digits. As I stated in the OP, Ray may not be the problem, but he can be the trade bait for the solution: new blood>>>new life. I agree we have to be judicious in our trades, but a major trade is the only thing that can shake up this team. I guess being embarrassed 9 times is not enough. This team needs to be shaken (woken)  up in a big way.  

We should only make trades that improve our talent, or keep our talent equal while giving us younger legs.  A trade just to shake things up isn't really what this team needs, in my opinion.  As mentioned above, all that trading Ray for the sake of trading him nets you is a more mediocre team, both in the long and short term.

[Mencius]

Who are we going to trade Ray for that's going to solve our problems, either in the short or long term? 

9th time since Christmas we end up losing when we're up by double digits. As I stated in the OP, Ray may not be the problem, but he can be the trade bait for the solution: new blood>>>new life. I agree we have to be judicious in our trades, but a major trade is the only thing that can shake up this team. I guess being embarrassed 9 times is not enough. This team needs to be shaken (woken)  up in a big way.  

We should only make trades that improve our talent, or keep our talent equal while giving us younger legs.  A trade just to shake things up isn't really what this team needs, in my opinion.  As mentioned above, all that trading Ray for the sake of trading him nets you is a more mediocre team, both in the long and short term.

Iggy and Ellis are better now, and certainly better long term.  Martin is as good now and certainly better long term.

If we let Ray expire, we have only the MLE with which to improve next year, and that's not going to offset the continuing decline of KG, PP, and Wallace.  Jumpstart the rebuild now with Ray's contract.

[Roy Hobbs]

Who are we going to trade Ray for that's going to solve our problems, either in the short or long term? 

9th time since Christmas we end up losing when we're up by double digits. As I stated in the OP, Ray may not be the problem, but he can be the trade bait for the solution: new blood>>>new life. I agree we have to be judicious in our trades, but a major trade is the only thing that can shake up this team. I guess being embarrassed 9 times is not enough. This team needs to be shaken (woken)  up in a big way.  

We should only make trades that improve our talent, or keep our talent equal while giving us younger legs.  A trade just to shake things up isn't really what this team needs, in my opinion.  As mentioned above, all that trading Ray for the sake of trading him nets you is a more mediocre team, both in the long and short term.

Iggy and Ellis are better now, and certainly better long term.  Martin is as good now and certainly better long term.

If we let Ray expire, we have only the MLE with which to improve next year, and that's not going to offset the continuing decline of KG, PP, and Wallace.  Jumpstart the rebuild now with Ray's contract.

I don't think anybody is arguing about Iggy or Martin; there's a little more debate about Ellis.  However, at least publicly, those teams are all saying that they're not going to trade their star players for expiring contracts.

The more realistic trades seem to be in the nature of Hinrich + Thomas.  A trade like that, in my mind, doesn't help us very much at all.

[More Banners]

Who are we going to trade Ray for that's going to solve our problems, either in the short or long term? 

That's the problem, isn't it?

I agree with the premise, though, that the hunger/intensity isn't there.  It seems to be missing more on the front line, though. We need the intensity on the boards.  Frankly, KG isn't getting it done, and Sheed isn't getting it done.  Is BBD the answer?  (if so, we're screwed).  Perk is doing okay, but as his offensive game has improved, is his focus on the boards less?  

Should we do the modern equivalent of the Ainge for Ed Pinkney and Joe Klein trade?  That won't help.

[Mencius]

Who are we going to trade Ray for that's going to solve our problems, either in the short or long term? 

9th time since Christmas we end up losing when we're up by double digits. As I stated in the OP, Ray may not be the problem, but he can be the trade bait for the solution: new blood>>>new life. I agree we have to be judicious in our trades, but a major trade is the only thing that can shake up this team. I guess being embarrassed 9 times is not enough. This team needs to be shaken (woken)  up in a big way.  

We should only make trades that improve our talent, or keep our talent equal while giving us younger legs.  A trade just to shake things up isn't really what this team needs, in my opinion.  As mentioned above, all that trading Ray for the sake of trading him nets you is a more mediocre team, both in the long and short term.

Iggy and Ellis are better now, and certainly better long term.  Martin is as good now and certainly better long term.

If we let Ray expire, we have only the MLE with which to improve next year, and that's not going to offset the continuing decline of KG, PP, and Wallace.  Jumpstart the rebuild now with Ray's contract.

I don't think anybody is arguing about Iggy or Martin; there's a little more debate about Ellis.  However, at least publicly, those teams are all saying that they're not going to trade their star players for expiring contracts.

The more realistic trades seem to be in the nature of Hinrich + Thomas.  A trade like that, in my mind, doesn't help us very much at all.

Well, most of the trades proposed aren't about Iggy or Ellis by themselves for expirings.  Their real motiviation is to unload more onerous contracts, so most proposals include Dalembert or Brand with Iggy, or Maggette with Ellis. 

[MaxwellSmart86]

Who are we going to trade Ray for that's going to solve our problems, either in the short or long term? 

Iggy and Dalembert.

Iggy can score, defend opposing teams big men, shoots well, gets to the free throw line, doesn't need the ball in his hands to make a difference on the game, and hes only 26. His contract is around 13 mil a year which is a bargain for a player like him. He fits the system and with the way Pierce has shot the three (besides the magic game) we can use him for the long ball.

Dalembert brings great length and athleticism to the bench and the front court. He is rebounding very well this year and is blocking shots nicely. He has shot well and stats wise he has had a career year on a bad team. Bringing him off the bench allows us to have a hustle guy who can lay in the weeds and get up for a block shot to start the break...Unlike Sheed and Garnett who have just layups go in without contention or unlike baby who has a 3 cm vertical. Dalembert has a big contract but it only has one more year after this one and we can use his contract to make a trade next year if need be.

Ray, Scal, and Baby should make it happen.

Yeah, this is the trade we should be looking at...Iggy would be HUNGRY--which is what is needed DESPERATELY here---I was working the Realgm trade machine the other day--and this is the exact trade I came up with.

[Roy Hobbs]

Who are we going to trade Ray for that's going to solve our problems, either in the short or long term? 

Iggy and Dalembert.

Iggy can score, defend opposing teams big men, shoots well, gets to the free throw line, doesn't need the ball in his hands to make a difference on the game, and hes only 26. His contract is around 13 mil a year which is a bargain for a player like him. He fits the system and with the way Pierce has shot the three (besides the magic game) we can use him for the long ball.

Dalembert brings great length and athleticism to the bench and the front court. He is rebounding very well this year and is blocking shots nicely. He has shot well and stats wise he has had a career year on a bad team. Bringing him off the bench allows us to have a hustle guy who can lay in the weeds and get up for a block shot to start the break...Unlike Sheed and Garnett who have just layups go in without contention or unlike baby who has a 3 cm vertical. Dalembert has a big contract but it only has one more year after this one and we can use his contract to make a trade next year if need be.

Ray, Scal, and Baby should make it happen.

I like Iggy a lot.  He's far from a good shooter, though.  Still, I'd trade Ray for him, without much question.

Similarly, I like Dalembert, which is a rarity among people who live in my neck of the woods (outside Philly).  He's not a very smart player -- sort of like the Tony Allen of big men -- but he'd help on the rebounding end.

That said, I'm skeptical that Philly will pull the trigger on a trade like this at this point (although it could happen), and I'm further skeptical that Wyc will take on that sort of salary.

[jambr380]

Who are we going to trade Ray for that's going to solve our problems, either in the short or long term? 

Iggy and Dalembert.

Iggy can score, defend opposing teams big men, shoots well, gets to the free throw line, doesn't need the ball in his hands to make a difference on the game, and hes only 26. His contract is around 13 mil a year which is a bargain for a player like him. He fits the system and with the way Pierce has shot the three (besides the magic game) we can use him for the long ball.

Dalembert brings great length and athleticism to the bench and the front court. He is rebounding very well this year and is blocking shots nicely. He has shot well and stats wise he has had a career year on a bad team. Bringing him off the bench allows us to have a hustle guy who can lay in the weeds and get up for a block shot to start the break...Unlike Sheed and Garnett who have just layups go in without contention or unlike baby who has a 3 cm vertical. Dalembert has a big contract but it only has one more year after this one and we can use his contract to make a trade next year if need be.

Ray, Scal, and Baby should make it happen.

Yeah, this is the trade we should be looking at...Iggy would be HUNGRY--which is what is needed DESPERATELY here---I was working the Realgm trade machine the other day--and this is the exact trade I came up with.

Yeah, I would pretty much feel like we really pulled off an amazing thing if this trade went down. The 'junk' contract we would be taking would actually be useful.

I think this is generally the case in most of our 'dream' scenarios, though. Ellis and Maggette from GS or Martin and Nocioni from SAC also give us an additional rotation player, in addition to our semi-star that we are acquiring...Iggy is definitely my favorite of the three, though.

[csfansince60s]

Who are we going to trade Ray for that's going to solve our problems, either in the short or long term? 

9th time since Christmas we end up losing when we're up by double digits. As I stated in the OP, Ray may not be the problem, but he can be the trade bait for the solution: new blood>>>new life. I agree we have to be judicious in our trades, but a major trade is the only thing that can shake up this team. I guess being embarrassed 9 times is not enough. This team needs to be shaken (woken)  up in a big way.  

We should only make trades that improve our talent, or keep our talent equal while giving us younger legs.  A trade just to shake things up isn't really what this team needs, in my opinion.  As mentioned above, all that trading Ray for the sake of trading him nets you is a more mediocre team, both in the long and short term.

Iggy and Ellis are better now, and certainly better long term.  Martin is as good now and certainly better long term.

If we let Ray expire, we have only the MLE with which to improve next year, and that's not going to offset the continuing decline of KG, PP, and Wallace.  Jumpstart the rebuild now with Ray's contract.

I don't think anybody is arguing about Iggy or Martin; there's a little more debate about Ellis.  However, at least publicly, those teams are all saying that they're not going to trade their star players for expiring contracts.

The more realistic trades seem to be in the nature of Hinrich + Thomas.  A trade like that, in my mind, doesn't help us very much at all.

Add Salmons to that trade, and I think it's the one we want. He's 5 years younger than Ray, can D up big (leads his team in steals) and can hit the open shot (3rd on team in scoring).
Hinrich to run the second unit and anything Ty (SSwift) Thomas gives us is a bonus

[Gomesfan]

So what will be the new rumore as of tomorrow 2.8.10 for RayAllen? Any guess's? I say Kevin Martin rumor may start to gain some steam, I think it is the trade that makes the most sense for us now and in the future!

[Bahku]

Sorry, but the real useless player on the floor right now is Sheed ... if anyone should be traded, it's him.

[Roy Hobbs]

Who are we going to trade Ray for that's going to solve our problems, either in the short or long term? 

9th time since Christmas we end up losing when we're up by double digits. As I stated in the OP, Ray may not be the problem, but he can be the trade bait for the solution: new blood>>>new life. I agree we have to be judicious in our trades, but a major trade is the only thing that can shake up this team. I guess being embarrassed 9 times is not enough. This team needs to be shaken (woken)  up in a big way.  

We should only make trades that improve our talent, or keep our talent equal while giving us younger legs.  A trade just to shake things up isn't really what this team needs, in my opinion.  As mentioned above, all that trading Ray for the sake of trading him nets you is a more mediocre team, both in the long and short term.

Iggy and Ellis are better now, and certainly better long term.  Martin is as good now and certainly better long term.

If we let Ray expire, we have only the MLE with which to improve next year, and that's not going to offset the continuing decline of KG, PP, and Wallace.  Jumpstart the rebuild now with Ray's contract.

I don't think anybody is arguing about Iggy or Martin; there's a little more debate about Ellis.  However, at least publicly, those teams are all saying that they're not going to trade their star players for expiring contracts.

The more realistic trades seem to be in the nature of Hinrich + Thomas.  A trade like that, in my mind, doesn't help us very much at all.

Add Salmons to that trade, and I think it's the one we want. He's 5 years younger than Ray, can D up big (leads his team in steals) and can hit the open shot (3rd on team in scoring).
Hinrich to run the second unit and anything Ty (SSwift) Thomas gives us is a bonus

If we were getting last year's version of Salmons, I'd feel a lot better about that proposal.  This year, he hasn't been playing well enough to be a starter.

I'd much rather than trade some of our expiring bench fodder for Hinrich or Salmons.  If we're going to trade Ray, I want it to be for a player who can come close to filling his shoes.