Author Topic: Does anybody think? (Rondo's Character)  (Read 11060 times)

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Re: Does anybody think? (Rondo's Character)
« Reply #15 on: February 03, 2010, 02:05:41 PM »

Offline Birdbrain

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I am glad SOMEONE on the team is standing up and having questions.  I don't care how young rondo is he is a LEADER.  Rajon is doing a good job of publicly calling out his teammate(s) without naming them.  I assume anyone associated with the team knows exactly who he is referring to but the public doesn't get to know that rondo is miffed at mr. (fill in blank)
I'm guessing its rasheed, eddie and davis , one or all

Completely against ubuntu but, that was 2 years ago mang.. amiright?

It's not against ubuntu. Ubuntu is about working as one cohesive unit, which that team had down to a science.

It doesn't follow that unbuntu advocate turning a blind eye to players not doing that and pretending there conduct doesn't exist as a form of self deception.

Who are the players?

I don't know, rondo, paul and ray didn't throw anyone under the bus.

But if you wanted my admittedly uninformed opinion of who don't give 100% or play as part of the team concept (particularly on defense) every night for the good of the team that they might be hinting at, it goes:

Sheed, by far
Eddie
Baby

Baby draws more offensive fouls than anyone on the team.  And if Rondo thinks ( I don't think he does ) that bench is too blame for the struggles I have to question his intelligence.  He never ' elaborated ' (Rondo's term) which is my problem with his comments.
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Re: Does anybody think? (Rondo's Character)
« Reply #16 on: February 03, 2010, 02:12:29 PM »

Offline crownsy

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I am glad SOMEONE on the team is standing up and having questions.  I don't care how young rondo is he is a LEADER.  Rajon is doing a good job of publicly calling out his teammate(s) without naming them.  I assume anyone associated with the team knows exactly who he is referring to but the public doesn't get to know that rondo is miffed at mr. (fill in blank)
I'm guessing its rasheed, eddie and davis , one or all

Completely against ubuntu but, that was 2 years ago mang.. amiright?

It's not against ubuntu. Ubuntu is about working as one cohesive unit, which that team had down to a science.

It doesn't follow that unbuntu advocate turning a blind eye to players not doing that and pretending there conduct doesn't exist as a form of self deception.

Who are the players?

I don't know, rondo, paul and ray didn't throw anyone under the bus.

But if you wanted my admittedly uninformed opinion of who don't give 100% or play as part of the team concept (particularly on defense) every night for the good of the team that they might be hinting at, it goes:

Sheed, by far
Eddie
Baby

Baby draws more offensive fouls than anyone on the team.  And if Rondo thinks ( I don't think he does ) that bench is too blame for the struggles I have to question his intelligence.  He never ' elaborated ' (Rondo's term) which is my problem with his comments.

We're going to have to disagree, because i know your a huge baby fan and thus won't want to hear or accept the following assessment.

but to me, davis has been on a diffrent agenda since the summer.

Davis has been very outspoken that he doesn't think the team treats him fairly, given his play when KG went down. He has been unable to control his immaturity and put the team first, as evidenced by breaking his hand in a drunken fight at 4 in the morning like a teenager, and getting into a altercation with a courtside fan, risking suspension.

He also comes to play some nights, but others seems disinterested in anything other than getting his shot up (just like sheed)

In my mind, baby is showing all the signs of a player who is playing for stats and a contract, not doing the little things that good teams need out of thier bench.





also, So your problem is he didn't throw a specific teammate under the bus? IMO that would have been a terrible idea, and would have shown a complete lack of a grasp on the situation.

Calling specific players out for things that you just want them to be aware of is what shows a leaders lack of intelligence. When is the last time you heard, as a example, tom Brady throw someone under the bus?

He does however, make statements like:

Quote
"I think that's the most important thing:  being mentally tough to overcome adversity.  When things don't go your way, you have to fight back.  That's a challenge for all of us.  I think at times we do, and at times I don't think we fight very hard.

Notice how he puts the team on notice that he's aware that they don't give 100% effort, disproves, but avoids creating animosity by calling out one or two playerS?

This was the exact same thing.

Done this way, it's a subtle reminder to guys in the locker room, by 3 of the starters, of what they should be playing for, and that they need to get on board.


 speaking of three starters, Do you have the same problem with paul and ray, who made EXACTLY the same sort of comments in the article?


IF they had specifically called one player out, they would have been seen as putting a spotlight on that player, and made a huge issue out of something they are trying to check but NOT make a huge issue of.
« Last Edit: February 03, 2010, 02:19:41 PM by crownsy »
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Re: Does anybody think? (Rondo's Character)
« Reply #17 on: February 03, 2010, 02:14:23 PM »

Offline Big_Matt34

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The 3 names that came to mind right away is Baby, House, Sheed. Sheed obviously doesnt go all out on defense and chucks up 3's, House has thrown up a ton of awful shots year, if those things annoy us fans imagine how the players feel watching it. Baby clearly isnt happy being a bench player again and seems to have maturity problems, i can see him complaining in the locker room.

I don't see this being about TA or Ray, Ray has always been a class guy who has been a mentor for Rondo, while TA always goes all out on the court, and has seemed to accept his role and play within himself.
« Last Edit: February 03, 2010, 02:24:25 PM by Big_Matt34 »

Re: Does anybody think? (Rondo's Character)
« Reply #18 on: February 03, 2010, 02:16:31 PM »

Offline ManUp

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First off I never bought the rondo character/chemistry issue talk. He mightve done something dumb last season but I don't think he's the problem he was made out to be in the offseason. Sheldon tweeted something very similar to what Rondo said weeks ago after a loss. I don't understand how him speaking his mind on what seems to be a real team issue makes him a knucklehead.

Re: Does anybody think? (Rondo's Character)
« Reply #19 on: February 03, 2010, 02:18:32 PM »

Offline Birdbrain

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I am glad SOMEONE on the team is standing up and having questions.  I don't care how young rondo is he is a LEADER.  Rajon is doing a good job of publicly calling out his teammate(s) without naming them.  I assume anyone associated with the team knows exactly who he is referring to but the public doesn't get to know that rondo is miffed at mr. (fill in blank)
I'm guessing its rasheed, eddie and davis , one or all

Completely against ubuntu but, that was 2 years ago mang.. amiright?

It's not against ubuntu. Ubuntu is about working as one cohesive unit, which that team had down to a science.

It doesn't follow that unbuntu advocate turning a blind eye to players not doing that and pretending there conduct doesn't exist as a form of self deception.

Who are the players?

I don't know, rondo, paul and ray didn't throw anyone under the bus.

But if you wanted my admittedly uninformed opinion of who don't give 100% or play as part of the team concept (particularly on defense) every night for the good of the team that they might be hinting at, it goes:

Sheed, by far
Eddie
Baby

Baby draws more offensive fouls than anyone on the team.  And if Rondo thinks ( I don't think he does ) that bench is too blame for the struggles I have to question his intelligence.  He never ' elaborated ' (Rondo's term) which is my problem with his comments.

We're going to have to disagree, because i know your a huge baby fan and thus won't want to hear or accept the following assessment.

but to me, davis has been on a diffrent agenda since the summer.

Davis has been very outspoken that he doesn't think the team treats him fairly, given his play when KG went down. He has been unable to control his immaturity and put the team first, as evidenced by breaking his hand in a drunken fight at 4 in the morning like a teenager, and getting into a altercation with a courtside fan, risking suspension.

He also comes to play some nights, but others seems disinterested in anything other than getting his shot up (just like sheed)

In my mind, baby is showing all the signs of a player who is playing for stats and a contract, not doing the little things that good teams need out of thier bench.





also, So your problem is he didn't throw a specific teammate under the bus? IMO that would have been a terrible idea, and would have shown a complete lack of a grasp on the situation.


Done this way, it's a subtle reminder to guys in the locker room, by 3 of the starters, of what they should be playing for.


and, speaking of three starters, Do you have the same problem with paul and ray, who made EXACTLY the same sort of comments in the article?


IF they had specifically called one player out, they would have been seen as putting a spotlight on that player, and made a huge issue out of something they are trying to check but NOT make a huge issue of.

I know it may seem like I can't be fair about Baby but, trust me I agree that he's been a disappointment especially with respect to maturity but, the dude plays 5-10 min a game and he's only been active for a month or so.  So his effect on the game is so minimal that I don't see how it could be him.  

I only have problem with Rondo comments because I don't believe it's his place to comment.  Meaning he should play and keep the comments 'his' comments in the locker room
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Re: Does anybody think? (Rondo's Character)
« Reply #20 on: February 03, 2010, 02:23:04 PM »

Offline ejk3489

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I am glad SOMEONE on the team is standing up and having questions.  I don't care how young rondo is he is a LEADER.  Rajon is doing a good job of publicly calling out his teammate(s) without naming them.  I assume anyone associated with the team knows exactly who he is referring to but the public doesn't get to know that rondo is miffed at mr. (fill in blank)
I'm guessing its rasheed, eddie and davis , one or all

Completely against ubuntu but, that was 2 years ago mang.. amiright?

It's not against ubuntu. Ubuntu is about working as one cohesive unit, which that team had down to a science.

It doesn't follow that unbuntu advocate turning a blind eye to players not doing that and pretending there conduct doesn't exist as a form of self deception.

Who are the players?

I don't know, rondo, paul and ray didn't throw anyone under the bus.

But if you wanted my admittedly uninformed opinion of who don't give 100% or play as part of the team concept (particularly on defense) every night for the good of the team that they might be hinting at, it goes:

Sheed, by far
Eddie
Baby

Baby draws more offensive fouls than anyone on the team.  And if Rondo thinks ( I don't think he does ) that bench is too blame for the struggles I have to question his intelligence.  He never ' elaborated ' (Rondo's term) which is my problem with his comments.

We're going to have to disagree, because i know your a huge baby fan and thus won't want to hear or accept the following assessment.

but to me, davis has been on a diffrent agenda since the summer.

Davis has been very outspoken that he doesn't think the team treats him fairly, given his play when KG went down. He has been unable to control his immaturity and put the team first, as evidenced by breaking his hand in a drunken fight at 4 in the morning like a teenager, and getting into a altercation with a courtside fan, risking suspension.

He also comes to play some nights, but others seems disinterested in anything other than getting his shot up (just like sheed)

In my mind, baby is showing all the signs of a player who is playing for stats and a contract, not doing the little things that good teams need out of thier bench.





also, So your problem is he didn't throw a specific teammate under the bus? IMO that would have been a terrible idea, and would have shown a complete lack of a grasp on the situation.


Done this way, it's a subtle reminder to guys in the locker room, by 3 of the starters, of what they should be playing for.


and, speaking of three starters, Do you have the same problem with paul and ray, who made EXACTLY the same sort of comments in the article?


IF they had specifically called one player out, they would have been seen as putting a spotlight on that player, and made a huge issue out of something they are trying to check but NOT make a huge issue of.

I know it may seem like I can't be fair about Baby but, trust me I agree that he's been a disappointment especially with respect to maturity but, the dude plays 5-10 min a game and he's only been active for a month or so.  So his effect on the game is so minimal that I don't see how it could be him.  I only problem with Rondo since it's not his place to comment.

But why is it not his place to comment? Just because he's not a "veteran"? Would you have cared if it was Pierce or KG who said these things?


Re: Does anybody think? (Rondo's Character)
« Reply #21 on: February 03, 2010, 02:25:39 PM »

Offline crownsy

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I am glad SOMEONE on the team is standing up and having questions.  I don't care how young rondo is he is a LEADER.  Rajon is doing a good job of publicly calling out his teammate(s) without naming them.  I assume anyone associated with the team knows exactly who he is referring to but the public doesn't get to know that rondo is miffed at mr. (fill in blank)
I'm guessing its rasheed, eddie and davis , one or all

Completely against ubuntu but, that was 2 years ago mang.. amiright?

It's not against ubuntu. Ubuntu is about working as one cohesive unit, which that team had down to a science.

It doesn't follow that unbuntu advocate turning a blind eye to players not doing that and pretending there conduct doesn't exist as a form of self deception.

Who are the players?

I don't know, rondo, paul and ray didn't throw anyone under the bus.

But if you wanted my admittedly uninformed opinion of who don't give 100% or play as part of the team concept (particularly on defense) every night for the good of the team that they might be hinting at, it goes:

Sheed, by far
Eddie
Baby

Baby draws more offensive fouls than anyone on the team.  And if Rondo thinks ( I don't think he does ) that bench is too blame for the struggles I have to question his intelligence.  He never ' elaborated ' (Rondo's term) which is my problem with his comments.

We're going to have to disagree, because i know your a huge baby fan and thus won't want to hear or accept the following assessment.

but to me, davis has been on a diffrent agenda since the summer.

Davis has been very outspoken that he doesn't think the team treats him fairly, given his play when KG went down. He has been unable to control his immaturity and put the team first, as evidenced by breaking his hand in a drunken fight at 4 in the morning like a teenager, and getting into a altercation with a courtside fan, risking suspension.

He also comes to play some nights, but others seems disinterested in anything other than getting his shot up (just like sheed)

In my mind, baby is showing all the signs of a player who is playing for stats and a contract, not doing the little things that good teams need out of thier bench.





also, So your problem is he didn't throw a specific teammate under the bus? IMO that would have been a terrible idea, and would have shown a complete lack of a grasp on the situation.


Done this way, it's a subtle reminder to guys in the locker room, by 3 of the starters, of what they should be playing for.


and, speaking of three starters, Do you have the same problem with paul and ray, who made EXACTLY the same sort of comments in the article?


IF they had specifically called one player out, they would have been seen as putting a spotlight on that player, and made a huge issue out of something they are trying to check but NOT make a huge issue of.

I know it may seem like I can't be fair about Baby but, trust me I agree that he's been a disappointment especially with respect to maturity but, the dude plays 5-10 min a game and he's only been active for a month or so.  So his effect on the game is so minimal that I don't see how it could be him.  I only problem with Rondo since it's not his place to comment.

- He's an all star Point guard, and NBA champion.

- Three hall of famers have repeatedly endorsed him as one of the leaders of this team

- He just got a long extension, after which his GM and coach talked about how great it will be to have him as a leader fo this team going forward.

- His coach routinely says his leadership is a huge factor for this team.


you wanna go ahead and explain to me why the above makes him unqualified to give an opinion on his teammates, especially on his bench players?

weather you like it or not, Rajon Rondo is a leader for this team. It's a leaders job to do exactly what he did, provide leadership and let others know that there level of play isn't acceptable.

Unless your position is that this isn't something ANY player on the team should be doing, which is ludicrous IMO. We are not playing well, leaders should step up and address that issue, which is what happened here, not lie to themselves and pretend everything is rainbows and gumdrops.
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Re: Does anybody think? (Rondo's Character)
« Reply #22 on: February 03, 2010, 02:26:23 PM »

Offline crownsy

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I am glad SOMEONE on the team is standing up and having questions.  I don't care how young rondo is he is a LEADER.  Rajon is doing a good job of publicly calling out his teammate(s) without naming them.  I assume anyone associated with the team knows exactly who he is referring to but the public doesn't get to know that rondo is miffed at mr. (fill in blank)
I'm guessing its rasheed, eddie and davis , one or all

Completely against ubuntu but, that was 2 years ago mang.. amiright?

It's not against ubuntu. Ubuntu is about working as one cohesive unit, which that team had down to a science.

It doesn't follow that unbuntu advocate turning a blind eye to players not doing that and pretending there conduct doesn't exist as a form of self deception.

Who are the players?

I don't know, rondo, paul and ray didn't throw anyone under the bus.

But if you wanted my admittedly uninformed opinion of who don't give 100% or play as part of the team concept (particularly on defense) every night for the good of the team that they might be hinting at, it goes:

Sheed, by far
Eddie
Baby

Baby draws more offensive fouls than anyone on the team.  And if Rondo thinks ( I don't think he does ) that bench is too blame for the struggles I have to question his intelligence.  He never ' elaborated ' (Rondo's term) which is my problem with his comments.

We're going to have to disagree, because i know your a huge baby fan and thus won't want to hear or accept the following assessment.

but to me, davis has been on a diffrent agenda since the summer.

Davis has been very outspoken that he doesn't think the team treats him fairly, given his play when KG went down. He has been unable to control his immaturity and put the team first, as evidenced by breaking his hand in a drunken fight at 4 in the morning like a teenager, and getting into a altercation with a courtside fan, risking suspension.

He also comes to play some nights, but others seems disinterested in anything other than getting his shot up (just like sheed)

In my mind, baby is showing all the signs of a player who is playing for stats and a contract, not doing the little things that good teams need out of thier bench.





also, So your problem is he didn't throw a specific teammate under the bus? IMO that would have been a terrible idea, and would have shown a complete lack of a grasp on the situation.


Done this way, it's a subtle reminder to guys in the locker room, by 3 of the starters, of what they should be playing for.


and, speaking of three starters, Do you have the same problem with paul and ray, who made EXACTLY the same sort of comments in the article?


IF they had specifically called one player out, they would have been seen as putting a spotlight on that player, and made a huge issue out of something they are trying to check but NOT make a huge issue of.

I know it may seem like I can't be fair about Baby but, trust me I agree that he's been a disappointment especially with respect to maturity but, the dude plays 5-10 min a game and he's only been active for a month or so.  So his effect on the game is so minimal that I don't see how it could be him.  I only problem with Rondo since it's not his place to comment.

But why is it not his place to comment? Just because he's not a "veteran"? Would you have cared if it was Pierce or KG who said these things?



I'd like that answer too, since pierce DID say it in the article, along with ray, and that part of my question was ducked previously.

EDIT: as did perk. is he out of line as well?

in fact, paul and rondo seem in lock step on this. same article:

Quote
Pierce then shook his head and added, “It’s like you have the answers to the test and you still fail. It’s just like that. We know the answers.”

The last statement was repeated to Rondo.

“That’s a great quote,” he said. “I can’t really describe it any better. He’s exactly right. We’re just not getting it done.”
“I will hurt you for this. A day will come when you think you’re safe and happy and your joy will turn to ashes in your mouth. And you will know the debt is paid.” – Tyrion

Re: Does anybody think? (Rondo's Character)
« Reply #23 on: February 03, 2010, 02:41:50 PM »

Offline Birdbrain

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I don't think anyone other than KG, Paul, or Doc should be commenting on the team to the media.  I would have added Ray except for the fact with his diminishing skills it's probably best that he stay quiet as well.  I just don't think Rondo has the weight (cache) in the league to have a positive effect with these types of comments.  I can seem them having negative effect though.

Also in regards to Doc's comments about leadership.  I succinctly remember him mentioning RR should do a bit more listening an tad less talking. 
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Re: Does anybody think? (Rondo's Character)
« Reply #24 on: February 03, 2010, 02:44:43 PM »

Offline crownsy

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I don't think anyone other than KG, Paul, or Doc should be commenting on the team to the media.  I would have added Ray except for the fact with his diminishing skills it's probably best that he stay quiet as well.  I just don't think Rondo has the weight (cache) in the league to have a positive effect with these types of comments.  I can seem them having negative effect though.

Wow, i couldn't disagree more that the measure of a player's leadership ability should be an arbitrary measurement like "time served" measured against stats.

by that token, zach randolph is a far better leader than rajon rondo. he's played longer, and  has better stats. He puts up a double-double every night, no further analysis needed.

I think the team would disagree completely with your reasoning for not seeing rondo as a leader as well, they clearly do.

Also, you still didn't address the other issue, do you think paul is out of line for talking about the same issue? if not, I need a better reason than "he's played alot longer" to justify the complete dismissal of rajon rondo as a leader on this team, which is contrary to everything we know about the team dynamic and his place on it.

EDIT: docs comments were last year, and he always prefaced them by saying he's learning and that's to be expected.
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Re: Does anybody think? (Rondo's Character)
« Reply #25 on: February 03, 2010, 02:55:19 PM »

Offline Fafnir

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I think talk is cheap. Most players on the team say the right things about team and effort.

They aren't following through, I think it goes up and down the roster. I really think it all started when KG went down. KG playing at a top 10 level could will the team on how to play and it was his team.

Now I don't know if its his team anymore.

Re: Does anybody think? (Rondo's Character)
« Reply #26 on: February 03, 2010, 02:57:28 PM »

Offline crownsy

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I think talk is cheap. Most players on the team say the right things about team and effort.

They aren't following through, I think it goes up and down the roster. I really think it all started when KG went down. KG playing at a top 10 level could will the team on how to play and it was his team.

Now I don't know if its his team anymore.

I agree, the team needs to see KG play his way back into shape.

I think Kevin going down with an injury to the same knee scarred the crap out of them. They need to believe he's the same fire eating, baby punting, bad man that he used to be to get that swagger back on defense.
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Re: Does anybody think? (Rondo's Character)
« Reply #27 on: February 03, 2010, 03:02:37 PM »

Offline Birdbrain

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I don't think anyone other than KG, Paul, or Doc should be commenting on the team to the media.  I would have added Ray except for the fact with his diminishing skills it's probably best that he stay quiet as well.  I just don't think Rondo has the weight (cache) in the league to have a positive effect with these types of comments.  I can seem them having negative effect though.

Wow, i couldn't disagree more that the measure of a player's leadership ability should be an arbitrary measurement like "time served" measured against stats.

by that token, zach randolph is a far better leader than rajon rondo. he's played longer, and  has better stats. He puts up a double-double every night, no further analysis needed.

I think the team would disagree completely with your reasoning for not seeing rondo as a leader as well, they clearly do.

Also, you still didn't address the other issue, do you think paul is out of line for talking about the same issue? if not, I need a better reason than "he's played alot longer" to justify the complete dismissal of rajon rondo as a leader on this team, which is contrary to everything we know about the team dynamic and his place on it.

EDIT: docs comments were last year, and he always prefaced them by saying he's learning and that's to be expected.

First off I never said he wasn't a leader.  He's the head of the snake and most talented player on the team.  Now to this issue.

I'm not getting into comparing Zack Randolf a career cancer with Rondo.  I'm commenting on this issue with regard to the C's and Rondo's pecking order on the team.  

I don't have an issue with Paul since he's the Captain.  Let the Captain Captain and everyone else do your job.  I did mention that in my previous post, fyi.
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Re: Does anybody think? (Rondo's Character)
« Reply #28 on: February 03, 2010, 03:04:56 PM »

Offline Birdbrain

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I think talk is cheap. Most players on the team say the right things about team and effort.

They aren't following through, I think it goes up and down the roster. I really think it all started when KG went down. KG playing at a top 10 level could will the team on how to play and it was his team.

Now I don't know if its his team anymore.

It better be or we (the C's) have bigger issues than injuries.  This is where knowing your role comes into play.
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Re: Does anybody think? (Rondo's Character)
« Reply #29 on: February 03, 2010, 03:06:35 PM »

Offline 2short

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leaders are leaders
anyone old enough to remember a punk ROOKIE catcher named Carlton Fish get into it with vets because they weren't playing hard enough or the correct way? (he was right)
my guess is lots of things have been said in the locker room between the team/coaches etc
by the way if kg is commented on anything publicly it would have to be bleeped out because you know he isn't going to be as gracious as rondo was, he'll name players and crush them ! if they don't follow the team rules
(see davis crying on sideline)