Marquis Daniels Is Not All That

[crownsy]

I had decided on Daniels the day we traded for him. Not only does he shoot extremely poor from three, he also isn't even an average shooter from two-point land. Supposedly a great defender, I do not concur. Look for yourselves. He is a good ballhawk, a Jason Kidd type, not what I would call a lockdown defender, ala RON ARTEST. Lastly, take a good look at him because the reason we needed a point guard was that Eddie House was not good enough. The main reason had to do with the difficulty he had bringing the ball up under playoff pressure. Marquis Daniels can do this better, I ask? And yes, for PP's sake and Ray Allen's, I do wish he was more durable.

So your concerns are that he's not a three point shooter, and his defense isn't the caliber of RON freaking ARTEST of the bench?

If he shot a mean three ball, and played all star cailber defense, we wouldn't have been able to sign him. He's a bench player, not an impact starter.

I think it's a little unrealistic to think that a bench sub needs to be as good as one of the leagues premier defenders to be useful to his squad.

 What teams outside of the rockets and hornets bring an all world defensive  wing defender off the bench on their second unit?

I'll wait.

Daniels is fine. He is exactly what we need as a 8th man and go to 2/3 off the bench.

He drives well, passes well, and defends well. His three point shooting is a non-issue, not every 2/3 needs to be a sniper from deep.

As brick pointed out, he will typically have eddie house, sheed, and either paul or ray in with him during his rotation. The "every team will play off him and stack the paint" concern will get teams killed by our bench shooting behind the arc if they try that.

His job is to drive and create against second units, something he showed himself more than capable of last night.

Hahahaha.  TP, both for the post and the joke.

hehe thanks, i figured i had to put posey on their, just because if i didn't someone would say bring it up 

[MBz]

First off, he is not going to have to shoot that often.  There's probably 7-8 better scoring options on this team with the entire starting 5, Sheed, Big Baby and possibly even House.  Second, if he is on the floor with House, Sheed and Big Baby, they can do the outside shooting, House and Sheed from 3 land, and Baby spreading the floor to 17 feet or so.  Daniels will have plenty of space to penetrate, he will not have to shoot from outside that often.  If people step back on him so be it, that just gives him a little more room to move in and make the right pass. 

[xmuscularghandix]

First off, he is not going to have to shoot that often.  There's probably 7-8 better scoring options on this team with the entire starting 5, Sheed, Big Baby and possibly even House.  Second, if he is on the floor with House, Sheed and Big Baby, they can do the outside shooting, House and Sheed from 3 land, and Baby spreading the floor to 17 feet or so.  Daniels will have plenty of space to penetrate, he will not have to shoot from outside that often.  If people step back on him so be it, that just gives him a little more room to move in and make the right pass. 

this is not true, Marquis can score. And he has more ways to score than House and even Baby. As someone above said "Marquis is the player TA was supposed to be"

[sully00]

Marquis Daniels can get in the lane and collapse a defense handle the ball and find the open man and more importantly not make Eddie House do those things.  He has the size to guard the two and gives an nice option against big points guards who Rondo struggles with.

He is a nice player, even better if he is coming off your bench and even better than that if you have pg sized SG's who can kill it from 3 but dribble, pass, and penetrate not so much.

The best attribute I saw of his as far as a primary ball handler is unlike House and others when a help defender came his way instead of covering up and waiting for help he just as quickly throws the ball to the man the defender left and moves to an open spot.  He constantly seems to look for the open man, which would seem elementary but for some reason is not.  I though he did a great job of keeping the ball moving against a pretty good group of defenders.

[ToppersBsktball10]

I still don't like Marquis at the point. He also is not a fair shooter from outside, he downright stinks, like disgustingly so. His career shows he is injury prone. Why he is praised so much for defense also bewilders me. I hate to be the foreteller of doom, but the Celtics signed a good player who can't shoot well, more than likely will get hurt during the year, and is really a disadvantaged pg and a fair sub for Pierce. They can yak, yak all they want. I will not be bought.

At first you said he sucked and then you said he's good?

[4THQTR]

Are we talking about a guy who is better than any player the celtics' bench had to offer last season, apparently impressed all his new teammates and his new coaching staff, fills a role of need and accepts that role, can be used if need be to play various positions thanks to his versatility, is terrific slasher and finisher, a guy most people say looked terrific in the first preseason game and was called "probably the best guy out there" afterwards by doc rivers, came here after a career season accepting a huge paycut and a one year contract only, despite reportedly getting better offers elsewhere but deciding to try and help a contender win another championship?

[2short]

Kendrick Perkins is a horrible 3-point shooter and is a bad free-throw shooter. Get him off my team!! And a bad dribbler to boot.

I'm sorry but you didn't see Perk dribbling on the fast break last night!!

[gustusias]

It seems everyone is against me here. I hope you all are correct and I am dumb, because that will mean our road to #18 will be easier. Yet, as I said, Doc, Danny, and all of you can yak, yak all you want, I still think my concerns are legit, but I hope I am proved wrong.

[Chris]

It seems everyone is against me here. I hope you all are correct and I am dumb, because that will mean our road to #18 will be easier. Yet, as I said, Doc, Danny, and all of you can yak, yak all you want, I still think my concerns are legit, but I hope I am proved wrong.

For me, it comes down to one thing with Daniels...is he an upgrade over their backup wings last season?  And I think the answer is clearly yes, dramatically so.  And given the fact that they need even less from that position with the addition of Rasheed, then even if Daniels is not as good as advertised, he is still going to be plenty good enough for what this team needs. 

[nickagneta]

I don't think your concerns are completely out of line gustusias. There are definite flaws in Daniels' game. But, I think you might be exaggerating those flaws to prove a point that the team needs a true PG back up. While I would rather see a really good backup for Rondo than having Daniels do the work, i think for the amount of time that a backup PG is going to be needed ion most games, Daniels can do the job.

I don't see Rondo playing less than 37 minutes per game this year. he will lead the team in minutes played, IMO. If that means that on the average night Daniels needs to bring the ball up and initiate the offense from the point forward position for 5 and a half minutes a half, I think the team will be just fine.

Also, I think Daniels strengths in regard to his ball handling, taking it to the basket, finishing in the open floor, versatility, and wing defense are definite skills the bench needed badly. And in the end, I think it is important for a coach to have a myriad of different skills to bring in from all sorts of different positions and that versatility is only going to help this team come playoff time.

That said, if the team could get their hands on Shane Battier in a mid season trade and it cost them Daniels, I would pull that trigger in a heart beat.

[crownsy]

It seems everyone is against me here. I hope you all are correct and I am dumb, because that will mean our road to #18 will be easier. Yet, as I said, Doc, Danny, and all of you can yak, yak all you want, I still think my concerns are legit, but I hope I am proved wrong.

I don't in any way think your dumb bro, i think your expectations for a bench wing are out of proportion.

Correct me if im wrong, but your main problems seems to be:

He can't shoot the three ball at a high clip

granted, but i don't think every 2/3 combo player in the league has to be a great premieter shooter. It's nice but his ability to drive and dish, score at the rim, and create are much more valuable to a second unit that includes, at worst, three knock down shooters.

He play's defense well, but not at a ron artest lock down level

again, unrealistic for a bench player, i can think of two....mabey three pure bench players who approach that level of defense (posey (though he's slipping), battier...mabey a few others) and they all make significantly more money and play on worse defensive teams overall.

He's injury prone

I don't know how to respond to this one. Injuries are random. If he gets injured, that will suck. I hope he doesn't.


Again, i don't think anyones calling you dumb, we are questioning what seems to be an incredibly harsh eval of a bench player. He is a very good bench wing.

If he was our starting 3, or even our 6th man, i would share your concerns. but he isn't, he's our 8th man. His specialized job is:

1) run the point while eddie floats and drive and kick

2) play good defense on the other teams guards/ SF, either the PG if eddie can't or more likely the SG.

3) get into the paint to open up shots for the second units shooters.


All of those he did well last night, and that's why people are excited about him, because he filled the role we expected.

I don't think anyone suddenly thinks he's an all star, they think we might have got what we needed, a versital guy who can play a bunch resting other gaurds and paul, and contribute.

[j804]

LOL at the OP knitpicking Marquis apart after 1 preseason game. When he looked prob the best out there on our squad. Wow.

[BrickJames]

LOL at the OP knitpicking Marquis apart after 1 preseason game. When he looked prob the best out there on our squad. Wow.

Welcome to CelticsBlog



Seriously though I suspect after a good 10-15 games everyone will be on the same page when it comes to the new guys (Sheed, Quis, Landlord).

My prediction: all three will be well liked.

[Bahku]

WAY too early to make a judgement on Daniels, and while I think some of your concerns are legit, I like what I've seen so far from this kid. The skills and experience will come with time, but he seems to meld well with the other players, has very competent technique at both ends, is at ease when on the floor and running the offense, and even comfortable enough to give a convincing post-game interview. I think he's going to be a great fit for this team, and I think he has a lot yet to be discovered ... give it time.

[bucknersrevenge]

what's so interesting about daniels is a point made in a recent herald article i think. daniels didn't even play the wing til he came to the pros. he was a pf at auburn and a pf in high school. that explains why his game from 15ft in is so refined. he never even played the perimeter in his developmental years. and while that may be seen as a negative that he doesn't have much range, he's gonna be on the floor at all times with at least 2 if not 3(house, bbd, sheed, paul/ray) other guys that can all hit the perimeter jumpshot. his skill actually becomes a complement to who we have here. and because his post game is so well refined he's gonna be able to operate as a facilitator in the post a lot more when he's in the offense and score on perimeter bench players probably not used to defending on the block as much. if used right daniels can be a pretty dangerous weapon for us.