Tidbits on BBD

[jdpapa3]

Roy, with BBD's contract extension what kind of options will the celtics have once he's up? In other words, will he have bird rights?

I remember reading in one of the articles that he chose to go with a 2 year deal so that he would be unrestricted once the contract was up. Not sure how bird rights apply in his situation.

[Spilling Green Dye]

BBD shooting 3's makes absolutely no sense to me. 

First, you have a plethora of better 3 pt shooters on the team.

Secondly, and most importantly, it makes no sense from a matchup perspective.  Let's say you use BBD on offense to "spread the floor".  This would inherently force an opposing "big" to leave the basket area in an attempt to guard at range.  The typical counter to this is to put a smaller/quicker player on him to mitigate this.  Normally this counter might not work, but against BBD it absolutely works b/c BBD is not a good rebounder and has no go-to back to the basket offense.  All you'd have to do is put a SF with offense range to guard BBD and you automatically win the matchup.  On Celtic possesions the SF can guard BBD and his 3pt range, and on the other end of the court there is no way BBD can could guard a SF. 

IMO big players work on a 3pt shot b/c they are unwilling to put in the real time it takes to be valuable under the hoop.  Only a few big players can get away with 3pt range (like Rasheed) b/c they already have a very effective post game.  THAT is when 3pt shooting from a big becomes difficult to defend.

Also, doesn't it say something about BBD that they felt the need to put weight incentives into his contract?  It shouldn't take a contract to make sure he doesn't get obese.  And yes, his BMI is in the "obese" range.  Shaq and a few others can get away with that only b/c they have a great game under the hoop.

[Roy Hobbs]

Roy, with BBD's contract extension what kind of options will the celtics have once he's up? In other words, will he have bird rights?

Yes, we'll have his full Bird rights.  He'll be unrestricted, meaning we won't have the right to match, but we can offer him the best contract.

[Jon]

BBD shooting 3's makes absolutely no sense to me. 

First, you have a plethora of better 3 pt shooters on the team.

Secondly, and most importantly, it makes no sense from a matchup perspective.  Let's say you use BBD on offense to "spread the floor".  This would inherently force an opposing "big" to leave the basket area in an attempt to guard at range.  The typical counter to this is to put a smaller/quicker player on him to mitigate this.  Normally this counter might not work, but against BBD it absolutely works b/c BBD is not a good rebounder and has no go-to back to the basket offense.  All you'd have to do is put a SF with offense range to guard BBD and you automatically win the matchup.  On Celtic possesions the SF can guard BBD and his 3pt range, and on the other end of the court there is no way BBD can could guard a SF. 

IMO big players work on a 3pt shot b/c they are unwilling to put in the real time it takes to be valuable under the hoop.  Only a few big players can get away with 3pt range (like Rasheed) b/c they already have a very effective post game.  THAT is when 3pt shooting from a big becomes difficult to defend.

Also, doesn't it say something about BBD that they felt the need to put weight incentives into his contract?  It shouldn't take a contract to make sure he doesn't get obese.  And yes, his BMI is in the "obese" range.  Shaq and a few others can get away with that only b/c they have a great game under the hoop.

I wonder if he sees the writing on the wall, though.  The simple fact of that matter is that Perk, KG, and Wallace are going to eat up nearly all the minutes at the 4/5 spots.  Maybe Baby realizes that the only way he's going to get even limited minutes on this team is to be able to get minutes at the 3, 4, and 5 spots.  And to be honest, if that's what he's thinking, I'd have to agree with him. 

May not be best for the team or his future, but if he can play the 3 for a few minutes a game, it will get him more minutes. 

[Spilling Green Dye]

BBD shooting 3's makes absolutely no sense to me. 

First, you have a plethora of better 3 pt shooters on the team.

Secondly, and most importantly, it makes no sense from a matchup perspective.  Let's say you use BBD on offense to "spread the floor".  This would inherently force an opposing "big" to leave the basket area in an attempt to guard at range.  The typical counter to this is to put a smaller/quicker player on him to mitigate this.  Normally this counter might not work, but against BBD it absolutely works b/c BBD is not a good rebounder and has no go-to back to the basket offense.  All you'd have to do is put a SF with offense range to guard BBD and you automatically win the matchup.  On Celtic possesions the SF can guard BBD and his 3pt range, and on the other end of the court there is no way BBD can could guard a SF. 

IMO big players work on a 3pt shot b/c they are unwilling to put in the real time it takes to be valuable under the hoop.  Only a few big players can get away with 3pt range (like Rasheed) b/c they already have a very effective post game.  THAT is when 3pt shooting from a big becomes difficult to defend.

Also, doesn't it say something about BBD that they felt the need to put weight incentives into his contract?  It shouldn't take a contract to make sure he doesn't get obese.  And yes, his BMI is in the "obese" range.  Shaq and a few others can get away with that only b/c they have a great game under the hoop.

I wonder if he sees the writing on the wall, though.  The simple fact of that matter is that Perk, KG, and Wallace are going to eat up nearly all the minutes at the 4/5 spots.  Maybe Baby realizes that the only way he's going to get even limited minutes on this team is to be able to get minutes at the 3, 4, and 5 spots.  And to be honest, if that's what he's thinking, I'd have to agree with him. 

May not be best for the team or his future, but if he can play the 3 for a few minutes a game, it will get him more minutes. 

Good point Jon, I never thought of that.  Perhaps he did realize that he needed some sort of niche ability.  Unfortunately I still think he'd be more valuable maintaining a serviceable 15 footer while being able to quickly finish around the hoop.  Perkins has dramatically improved his ability to finish quickly around the hoop over the years, and I'm always impressed with his touch in this ability.  I don't mean creating his own shot, but instead his catch and finish ability.

[Jon]

BBD shooting 3's makes absolutely no sense to me. 

First, you have a plethora of better 3 pt shooters on the team.

Secondly, and most importantly, it makes no sense from a matchup perspective.  Let's say you use BBD on offense to "spread the floor".  This would inherently force an opposing "big" to leave the basket area in an attempt to guard at range.  The typical counter to this is to put a smaller/quicker player on him to mitigate this.  Normally this counter might not work, but against BBD it absolutely works b/c BBD is not a good rebounder and has no go-to back to the basket offense.  All you'd have to do is put a SF with offense range to guard BBD and you automatically win the matchup.  On Celtic possesions the SF can guard BBD and his 3pt range, and on the other end of the court there is no way BBD can could guard a SF. 

IMO big players work on a 3pt shot b/c they are unwilling to put in the real time it takes to be valuable under the hoop.  Only a few big players can get away with 3pt range (like Rasheed) b/c they already have a very effective post game.  THAT is when 3pt shooting from a big becomes difficult to defend.

Also, doesn't it say something about BBD that they felt the need to put weight incentives into his contract?  It shouldn't take a contract to make sure he doesn't get obese.  And yes, his BMI is in the "obese" range.  Shaq and a few others can get away with that only b/c they have a great game under the hoop.

I wonder if he sees the writing on the wall, though.  The simple fact of that matter is that Perk, KG, and Wallace are going to eat up nearly all the minutes at the 4/5 spots.  Maybe Baby realizes that the only way he's going to get even limited minutes on this team is to be able to get minutes at the 3, 4, and 5 spots.  And to be honest, if that's what he's thinking, I'd have to agree with him. 

May not be best for the team or his future, but if he can play the 3 for a few minutes a game, it will get him more minutes. 

Good point Jon, I never thought of that.  Perhaps he did realize that he needed some sort of niche ability.  Unfortunately I still think he'd be more valuable maintaining a serviceable 15 footer while being able to quickly finish around the hoop.  Perkins has dramatically improved his ability to finish quickly around the hoop over the years, and I'm always impressed with his touch in this ability.  I don't mean creating his own shot, but instead his catch and finish ability.

Yeah, but fortunately for Perk he's much closer to 7-foot than Davis, has longer arms, and more athleticism.  Baby can barely dunk.  While I don't necessarily see him succeeding on the perimeter, I don't have the utmost confidence in his ability to play in the post either. 

[ScoobyDoo]

Big Baby may not be a big leaper around the rim, but he is fairly crafty down there. He already understand how to use his broad shoulders to keep bigger, longer guys away from the ball.

I think this kid, if he actually gets down to 265 to 275 on a KG / Karl malone type program, he would have a alot more lift and speed without losing any strength. And if he combines this with increased proficiency at using his body to protect the ball...

If that happens, I think you're talking about a real bulldog around the basket. He could become "like" a Charles Barkeley type player.

I remember a few times last year as he started dropping some weight every now and then you'd see come from nowhere for pretty impressive blocks at or near the rim and some dunks as well.

I guess I'm saying if this kid really looses the wierght and gets down to around 275, he could be one of the toughest matchups in the league around the basket. His jump shooting ability and ball handling only makes him tougher still.

He has "alot" of basketball skills and body wise you'd have to put him in the category of top five strongest, biggest bodies in the league.

Shaq, Perkins, Craig Smith, Baby. There aren't many true bangers in the league anymore, we have two of them. And with baby we also have one who has some pretty good offensive abilities.

I love the signing.     

[BCelts]

I do wish he would stay in the paint more but whats not helping is KG who is big who play mostly away from the paint and now Sheed who plays away from the paint all the time.. So hopefully they will let him know he can be a beast in the paint and be able to step out and hit the shot without a 2nd thought. We shall see whatever helps us win i am all for!

You're right.  But the brute reality about BBD is that due to his size and weight, he is not a good finisher around the basket.  From what I can see, he can barely dunk the ball and only does so when no one is around. 

Fortunately for the C's, they can get away with bigs on the perimeter as Pierce and Rondo, and to an extent Ray, are good penetrators. 

This is exactly right.  BBD is a good rebounder because of his size, strength, and skills; what Tommy would call a position rebounder.  Other bigs rely more on jumping ability, timing, and athleticism (e.g. Garnett, Marion).   Sure, both rebounding types benefit from position, but the difference to my eye is where they attack the ball.  The first type attacks their man first, moving them away from the path of hte ball, and then secures the ball.  The second type attacks the ball at the highest point possible to prevent another from moving them to get the rebound.

Although a good rebounder, BBD's type of rebounding and overall game makes it harder to finish at the basket and avoid the shot block.  I remember watching him side-step, step-around, or sweep under the rim  many, many times to avoid a block.  BBD has great hands but, also similar to employee number 8, his vertical is less than average.  Honestly, he needs a jump-hook where he can use his body between his man and the ball, but given the lack of jump, he will still be vulnerable to weakside help.

Having said that, there is plenty of spack for a guy BBD's size to get off an 18 footer.  I am more concerned about a 3 in the corner, though, because being a not-so-fleet-of-foot type, how does he use his position rebounding skills on the offensive glass if he is shooting corner 3s?

I'd tell BBD (he'd only listen to a novice like me were he a fool) to work on a one-on-one sweeping-style hook to use his body on the block down low, and to perfect the 15 to 18 footer.  Also, learn the 15 to 18 footer off the glass to further minimize blocks.  Focus on the coner 3 after those items are checked off.

My two cents.

[Spilling Green Dye]

I do wish he would stay in the paint more but whats not helping is KG who is big who play mostly away from the paint and now Sheed who plays away from the paint all the time.. So hopefully they will let him know he can be a beast in the paint and be able to step out and hit the shot without a 2nd thought. We shall see whatever helps us win i am all for!

You're right.  But the brute reality about BBD is that due to his size and weight, he is not a good finisher around the basket.  From what I can see, he can barely dunk the ball and only does so when no one is around. 

Fortunately for the C's, they can get away with bigs on the perimeter as Pierce and Rondo, and to an extent Ray, are good penetrators. 

This is exactly right.  BBD is a good rebounder because of his size, strength, and skills; what Tommy would call a position rebounder.  Other bigs rely more on jumping ability, timing, and athleticism (e.g. Garnett, Marion).   Sure, both rebounding types benefit from position, but the difference to my eye is where they attack the ball.  The first type attacks their man first, moving them away from the path of hte ball, and then secures the ball.  The second type attacks the ball at the highest point possible to prevent another from moving them to get the rebound.

Although a good rebounder, BBD's type of rebounding and overall game makes it harder to finish at the basket and avoid the shot block.  I remember watching him side-step, step-around, or sweep under the rim  many, many times to avoid a block.  BBD has great hands but, also similar to employee number 8, his vertical is less than average.  Honestly, he needs a jump-hook where he can use his body between his man and the ball, but given the lack of jump, he will still be vulnerable to weakside help.

Having said that, there is plenty of spack for a guy BBD's size to get off an 18 footer.  I am more concerned about a 3 in the corner, though, because being a not-so-fleet-of-foot type, how does he use his position rebounding skills on the offensive glass if he is shooting corner 3s?

I'd tell BBD (he'd only listen to a novice like me were he a fool) to work on a one-on-one sweeping-style hook to use his body on the block down low, and to perfect the 15 to 18 footer.  Also, learn the 15 to 18 footer off the glass to further minimize blocks.  Focus on the coner 3 after those items are checked off.

My two cents.

He absolutely should develop a hook shot so that he can put his body between the ball and the basket.

However, I think you are mistaken about his rebounding.  As a whole he is not a good rebounder.  For offensive rebounds he's semi-decent, but for defense he's downright bad for someone in his position.  Because of this, if you put him out at the 3pt line on offense then he's going to get less offensive rebounds, which is the only kind of rebound he adequately gets. 

[BudweiserCeltic]

I'm pretty sure he's working on a hookshot, or something similar to it. If not mistaken, he used it a couple of times last year.

[Spilling Green Dye]

I'm pretty sure he's working on a hookshot, or something similar to it. If not mistaken, he used it a couple of times last year.

I'd much rather he work on a "baby hook" shot than a 3pt shot.  Am I alone in this?

[xmuscularghandix]

I'm pretty sure he's working on a hookshot, or something similar to it. If not mistaken, he used it a couple of times last year.

he used it alot against dwight

[BudweiserCeltic]

I'm pretty sure he's working on a hookshot, or something similar to it. If not mistaken, he used it a couple of times last year.

I'd much rather he work on a "baby hook" shot than a 3pt shot.  Am I alone in this?

He can work on both.

[Spilling Green Dye]

I'm pretty sure he's working on a hookshot, or something similar to it. If not mistaken, he used it a couple of times last year.

I'd much rather he work on a "baby hook" shot than a 3pt shot.  Am I alone in this?

He can work on both.

So you want BBD spotting up at the 3pt line this upcoming season?  He has only so much time this offseason, my order of preference for his dedication should be:  1) get in great shape and lose some weight, 2) work on finishing near the hoop (and/or hookshot), 3) continue working on his 15 footer.  To adequately work on the first 3, I don't see there being any time for the 3pt shot.

[RAcker]

Cringe...swish!

PA: Big Baby for threeeeeeeee!