Ranking Power Forwards and Centers in the NBA for last ten years

[jdub1660]

I like the mix of retired players in there when the thread rules said no retired guys.

[Fafnir]

I like the mix of retired players in there when the thread rules said no retired guys.

The list would be terribly incomplete if you were to take out retired players. Threads are conversations, not court rooms with iron clad rules.

[celticsclay]

I like the mix of retired players in there when the thread rules said no retired guys.

The list would be terribly incomplete if you were to take out retired players. Threads are conversations, not court rooms with iron clad rules.

I guess to clarify a little I was originally thinking no retired people. However, I am ok with people like Webber that kind of abruptly retired after being very solid for most of the past decade. I was looking to avoid getting guys in like malone or Barkley that techinically played a game int he past decade. I wonder if shareef abdur raheem would have been on some lists if he didn't play for the worst teams ever (and worst locations)

[Moranis]

Shaq is #1 in the last ten years.  All four of his championships are in this time period and he still was a 20+/10+, player for 70% of the years (and was over 27 ppg for the first four years of the period).

[crownsy]

I like the mix of retired players in there when the thread rules said no retired guys.

The list would be terribly incomplete if you were to take out retired players. Threads are conversations, not court rooms with iron clad rules.

especially this thread, which asked for PF's but has centers on the list.

For only PF's

1.Duncan
2.KG
3.Dirk
4.Sheed

Add in C's

1.Shaq
2. Duncan
3.KG
4. Yao
5. Howard (with room to grow on)

[paintitgreen]

Shaq is #1 in the last ten years.  All four of his championships are in this time period and he still was a 20+/10+, player for 70% of the years (and was over 27 ppg for the first four years of the period).

I can respect that. Duncan was also a 20/10 guy for 70% of that time and didn't fall off completely for 3 years like Shaq did, and I think his far superior defense and teamwork places him above Shaq for the decade. I also have to consider that Shaq has missed 150 something games in this decade while Duncan has only missed 50 something. And he's led the only team never to miss the playoffs in the past ten years. I think Duncan's the best power forward ever and the best player of the past ten years, though I think Shaq might be higher on the all time list of best players (we'll see how each finishes his career).

I guess to clarify a little I was originally thinking no retired people. However, I am ok with people like Webber that kind of abruptly retired after being very solid for most of the past decade. I was looking to avoid getting guys in like malone or Barkley that techinically played a game int he past decade. I wonder if shareef abdur raheem would have been on some lists if he didn't play for the worst teams ever (and worst locations)

I tried to follow that, I just mentioned where I would put Webber and Malone (who didn't just play a game in the decade - he played 5 seasons, as many as Dwight Howard for example).

As for Abdur-Rahim, I never thought he was very good, just a big stats/bad team guy who never escaped that. Brand could potentially get that label and I placed him high, but Brand led the freaking Clippers to the playoffs and had a decent run. Plus he was way way more consistent than Abdur-Rahim who fell off abruptly about 6-7 years ago. I'd also place Abdur-Rahim behind Lamar Odom (close to making my list), Antawn Jamison, maybe Antoine Walker, maybe Kenyon Martin, hell probably even Zach Randolph.

Curious what people think about Shawn Marion in relation to this list. Does he count as a power forward? I didn't include him, but I'm not sure he'd crack my top 10 anyway.

[GaBerkowitz]

If its just counting the past 10 years, and future results arent factored in (i.e. if DH12 retired today)

PF/C

1) Shaq
2) Tim Duncan
3) K.G.
4) Nowitzki
5) C. Webb
6) Amare
7) Rasheed Wallace
Yao
9) Dwight Howard
10) Ben Wallace


Just PF

1) Duncan
2) K.G.
4) Dirk
5) C. Webb
6) Amare
7) Sheed
Chris Bosh
9) Elton Brand
10) Carlos Boozer

Some Notes:

1) You can't really go wrong with Shaq/Duncan at 1.  However the drop off from those two is so sever its not funny.  I have immense love for KG, but to sugguest he is in Duncan's class is laughable, and proves you havent watched Timmy enough.

2) I like guys who have won titles, and as much as I like Sheed, you'd be hard pressed to argue that Amare and C. Webb in his prime weren't better players.

3) The 3 B's (Brand, Bosh, Boozer) are all pretty much interchangable in my book.

4) Dirk is closer to K.G. than C. Webb

 

[jdpapa3]

However the drop off from those two is so sever its not funny.  I have immense love for KG, but to sugguest he is in Duncan's class is laughable, and proves you havent watched Timmy enough

KG not in Duncan's class??? Come on now. This is such a tough argument because KG had awful teammates in Minnesota, but KG is clearly at least in the discussion. Garnett has been a ridiculous offensive player with comical statlines, one of the top 5 defensive players of the last 10 years unquestionably, the undisputed leader of any team he has been on, and led a team of Sprewell and Cassell to the WCF's in a stacked western conference. He finally gets real teammates and leads his team to the title in the very first year, and then is on pace with the 72 win Chicago Bulls 30 games into the season, before his knee starts bugging him.

[GaBerkowitz]

I dont think so.  Again this is not dissing KG, its just stating my belief that Duncan's body of work is greatly superior.

4 titles to 1 is the easy evidence to look at.

But think about who Duncan won with.  An aging David Robinson, a young Manu Ginobli, and Tony Parker (admitedly 07 Tony Parker was  really good) but other than that, I dont think it was like Timmy had stacked teams.  He was just really really good.

And all the talk abotu KG being saddled with bad teams in Minnesota he did play with

Marbury, Wally, Sam Cassell, Joe Smith, Troy Hudson, Latrell, who arent exactly chumps.

I just think if you asked non-Celtic fans who is better 90% would go for Timmy.  And again, dont jump down my throat and say I hate on KG.  Not true, I just think he is a lot closer to Dirk than to Tim Duncan.

[Fafnir]

Marbury, Wally, Sam Cassell, Joe Smith, Troy Hudson, Latrell, who arent exactly chumps.

They really were chumps compared to the quality of players Duncan has had around him from the start.

The Admiral was a better player when Duncan joined the team than Garnett has probably ever had play with him. I think you're really underating Manu, he was awesome for the Spurs during their last two title runs.

[paintitgreen]

I'd say Duncan did have much better teammates, a much better front office, and much better coaching. However, he is also a better player. I love KG, but Duncan is the best power forward ever to play. Garnett's top five, but not really in Duncan's league. Hurt by circumstances? Yes. But saying he's not as good as Duncan is not a big insult.

[Fan from VT]

I'd say Duncan did have much better teammates, a much better front office, and much better coaching. However, he is also a better player. I love KG, but Duncan is the best power forward ever to play. Garnett's top five, but not really in Duncan's league. Hurt by circumstances? Yes. But saying he's not as good as Duncan is not a big insult.

I'd disagree. I think the differences between the two are unnoticeable if placed in a vacuum. Had their situations been reversed, we'd be talking about Duncan like people talk about KG, and vice versa

[Celtics17]

I always thought that Duncan was the unquestionable number one. But, after KG joined the C's and I have gotten to see more of his game I really feel that may deserve the ranking more then Duncan. It's hard to say on those two but they are definitely the top 2.

[Chris]

I always thought that Duncan was the unquestionable number one. But, after KG joined the C's and I have gotten to see more of his game I really feel that may deserve the ranking more then Duncan. It's hard to say on those two but they are definitely the top 2.

Yeah, I would still give Duncan the edge because of the number of championships.  However, if KG can get 1 to 2 more, it will be a dead heat between the two of them.

[drza44]

And all the talk abotu KG being saddled with bad teams in Minnesota he did play with

Marbury, Wally, Sam Cassell, Joe Smith, Troy Hudson, Latrell, who arent exactly chumps.

I'll probably post more on this thread later, but I had to hit this one really quick.  Did you actually look at the names that you posted here?  Let's spend a quick second on every name on this list:

Marbury: played 2 seasons next to KG when they were 19 and 20 years old.  Not exactly their primes.  Plus, since leaving Minnesota Marbury has cemented a reputation as one of the worst "winners" of all time, putting up great stats with not a lot to show for it.

Wally: Wally is, and always was, an extremely 1-dimensional player.  He is a shooter/scorer that operates off of other great players.  That's it.  He is bizarro Bruce Bowen, just his one trick is on offense instead of defense.  And Bowen was never more than just a role player for Duncan, never his 2nd best player (for half a decade, at that).

Cassell: Played one season with KG at age 34.  That team was the #1 seed in the West and in the WCF when Cassell's hip gave out.  Thus, in reality, he played ZERO full healthy seasons with Garnett.

Joe Smith: Career role player/journeyman.

Troy Hudson: Undrafted career journeyman who had one semi-almost-respectable season that is owed almost entirely to KG.  

Sprewell: Played in Minnesota with a huge fork sticking out of his back in his last 2 seasons before retirement.

And that's it.  That's your list.  Less than one full season with a healthy (and old) Cassell and Sprewell, two teenaged seasons with Marbury, and a series of has-beens/never-weres for the rest of his 12 years in Minny.  You can't possibly believe that supporting cast is within light years of what Duncan had in San Antonio...can you?