what would it take to get hakim warrick on this team?

[D Dub]

I think Hakim would be a great fit off our bench for 15mpg.  Our defensive system is designed for players like him.

Not sure how we'd get him though...  Looks like we're using our trade chips for Daniels and we'll use our BAE on Marbury.

[Fan from VT]

I'd rather have Warrick than BBD

agreed. with Wallace, we could use the super-athletic 3/4 type more.

[GKC]

I'd rather have Warrick than BBD

agreed. with Wallace, we could use the super-athletic 3/4 type more.

We'd probably have to use MLE type salary at 3-4 mill a year, which is something we don't have unless we S+T

The proper discussion should be, who would you rather have? Hakim Warrick or Big Baby?

[ssspence]

I'd rather have Warrick than BBD

agreed. with Wallace, we could use the super-athletic 3/4 type more.

We'd probably have to use MLE type salary at 3-4 mill a year, which is something we don't have unless we S+T

The proper discussion should be, who would you rather have? Hakim Warrick or Big Baby?

but take a look at the Grizz roster -- they have lots of size and very little in the backcourt. they may be willing to take a flyer on TA and Giddens to help fill out potential back-up for Mayo, especially if we'd throw in cash or picks. And because they're under the cap, a trade of Warrick signed for 3.5mil in exchange for TA and Giddens would work, since they wouldn't have to comply with BYC / cap restrictions.

Meanwhile, we can cotinue to play hardball with Big Baby. We could for example then s&t him to Jersey for Dooling and Sean Williams (project).

[ssspence]

i wish the grizz had a blog so i could find out what's going on with him, but it doesn't seem that they do....

[Aeacus]

Eh, after thinking it over I'm not in a hurry to trade TA's deal (or Scal) for someone like Warrick.  With the moves we made so far (asuuming the Daniels S&T happens).  I'm content to go into the season with our current roster.  Our expiring deals will be worth way more near the deadline.  If the cap does drop as much as predicted I'm hoping for a starting caliber player in exchange for expiring deals.  There will be teams trying to do straight salary dumps then.  Isn't that proven to be the best time to approach Chris W. anyways? 

It might be a slight upgrade over BBD (if you like Warrick) but its not worth depleting our trade assets. I think this is one of those moves for the sake of doing something that GMs should avoid.

[Fafnir]

Eh, after thinking it over I'm not in a hurry to trade TA's deal (or Scal) for someone like Warrick.  With the moves we made so far (asuuming the Daniels S&T happens).  I'm content to go into the season with our current roster.  Our expiring deals will be worth way more near the deadline.  If the cap does drop as much as predicted I'm hoping for a starting caliber player in exchange for expiring deals.  There will be teams trying to do straight salary dumps then.  Isn't that proven to be the best time to approach Chris W. anyways? 

It might be a slight upgrade over BBD (if you like Warrick) but its not worth depleting our trade assets. I think this is one of those moves for the sake of doing something that GMs should avoid.

A TP for joining the fray finally! =D

[KCattheStripe]

two bits of nonsense:

1) i thought your arguement was a lack of effort, not talent. to say warrick isn't talented enough to be in the Cs rotation is the first;

2) as for heart, the guy played with alot of it at 'cuse. he now plays with the worst organization in the NBA. labeling him lazy or a loser because his team plays every game lazy and loses is the second.

a change of scenery is often the remedy for a lot of guys. i don't buy that warrick isn't capable of playing hard, and playing better d. and if he doesn't it's only at the risk of a 3, 4 mil dollar deal anyway...

1) It's actually both, he's not that talented and he doesn't play with heart.

2) If you're not talented and your team is likewise afflicted then the only way to make up for that is to play with a lot of heart. Some examples on bad teams: Chris Wilcox, Kevin Love, Marc Gasol, Leon Powe in 2007. All players who bust their humps despite how bad their teams were. Effort is a tangible skill.

Where a change of scenery works the way your talking is if a talented player gets out of a poisonous situation. Where as in Hack's case, he's part of the problem not a victim of it.

[MaineBleedsGreen]

two bits of nonsense:

1) i thought your arguement was a lack of effort, not talent. to say warrick isn't talented enough to be in the Cs rotation is the first;

2) as for heart, the guy played with alot of it at 'cuse. he now plays with the worst organization in the NBA. labeling him lazy or a loser because his team plays every game lazy and loses is the second.

a change of scenery is often the remedy for a lot of guys. i don't buy that warrick isn't capable of playing hard, and playing better d. and if he doesn't it's only at the risk of a 3, 4 mil dollar deal anyway...

1) It's actually both, he's not that talented and he doesn't play with heart.

2) If you're not talented and your team is likewise afflicted then the only way to make up for that is to play with a lot of heart. Some examples on bad teams: Chris Wilcox, Kevin Love, Marc Gasol, Leon Powe in 2007. All players who bust their humps despite how bad their teams were. Effort is a tangible skill.

Where a change of scenery works the way your talking is if a talented player gets out of a poisonous situation. Where as in Hack's case, he's part of the problem not a victim of it.

Have to say I don't agree on the Warrick hate...

He isn't their 7th best player either. I'd have him tied for 5th. I'd say

Rudy
OJ
Randolf
Marc
and then Warrick and Conley around the same level at this point.

But I wouldn't include Randolf quit yet in regards to the Warrick argument because they just got Randolf this off-season.

Warrick has averaged 50% shooting for the past 3 season. He was the 4th leading scorer on the team and 3rd in FG% only behind their two Centers. He played all 82 games last year. He is not a great rebounder but still manages ~5 per game, which was actually good for 3rd best on the team.

His FT shooting seems to have declined over the past 3 season, which is something he should clearly work on, but other then that his stats seem to have stayed stagnant the last 3 seasons.

He seems like the classic case of a player need a change of scenery. I don't know how we'd manage to get him on the Celtics but I'd be all for it. We could really use and athletic 3/4 on this team. Though I am on the fence about whether I'd prefer him or BBD.

I watched a few memphis games last year. though admittedly not many. I remember a very talented and driven player in college, who's ceiling coming into the draft was always going to be a very good role player in the NBA. I still think he's the same guy, just stuck on the worst team in the league. I definitely didn't notice a lack of effort on his part though. I don't think lazy players play 82 games 24mins a game averaging decent stats for their team ... but maybe I'm wrong.

As far as the Arthur / Warrick argument. Warricks PER was ~17 while Arthurs was ~11. Also their per 36min stats are pretty similar across the board, except Warrick winds up with 7 more ppg, and shoot 7% better from the field. I'd definitely rather have Warrick then a player that would be considered somewhere between the 8th and 10th best player on the worst team in the league.

[MaineBleedsGreen]

wow. did I really kill this thread? I was looking forward to a little lively discussion in these dog days of summer.

[Michael Anthony]

Warrick is in the mix as their second or third best player with Conley and Gasol - Gay is better, Mayo will be better and Randolph was not on the squad. Using Arthur as an example is a little silly - he shot less than 44% from the floor and rebounds at about the same rate.

But more important than absolute skill is the fact that Warrick fills an important gap on this roster - a true swing forward to backup Pierce match up against Lewis/Smith/James off the bench in the playoffs.

The two problems I see with the proposed trade (TA & Giddens) is that (1) TA is going to Indiana for Daniels and (2) moving Scalabrine would leave us with just four bigs.

[fairweatherfan]

As a Cuse fan, I'd love to see Warrick on this team, or any team other than Memphis, but I don't think it's feasible.  He has a good shot, good length, and would fit in well with our defense if properly motivated.  Unfortunately Memphis probably matches whatever we'd be willing to pay, and an S+T would probably cost us Scal.

[KCattheStripe]

But more important than absolute skill is the fact that Warrick fills an important gap on this roster - a true swing forward to backup Pierce match up against Lewis/Smith/James off the bench in the playoffs.

He shoots 22% from beyond the arc, shot just under 50% last year and only averaged 5 boards a game. There is no ounce of efficiency or hustle in his game. This isn't James Posey people.

[Fafnir]

But more important than absolute skill is the fact that Warrick fills an important gap on this roster - a true swing forward to backup Pierce match up against Lewis/Smith/James off the bench in the playoffs.

He shoots 22% from beyond the arc, shot just under 50% last year and only averaged 5 boards a game. There is no ounce of efficiency or hustle in his game. This isn't James Posey people.

So he's not a three point shooter, shooting 50% isn't bad at all. His true shooting is a respectable 55% and he rebounds at a better rate than Pierce.

I don't think we'd be able to manage a sign and trade for him.

[Michael Anthony]

But more important than absolute skill is the fact that Warrick fills an important gap on this roster - a true swing forward to backup Pierce match up against Lewis/Smith/James off the bench in the playoffs.

He shoots 22% from beyond the arc, shot just under 50% last year and only averaged 5 boards a game. There is no ounce of efficiency or hustle in his game. This isn't James Posey people.

So he's not a three point shooter, shooting 50% isn't bad at all. His true shooting is a respectable 55% and he rebounds at a better rate than Pierce.

I don't think we'd be able to manage a sign and trade for him.

Ray never played defense before. Garnett could not win big games. Pierce was a trouble maker. Rondo is not a championship point guard. Perkins is a stiff. Marbury does not care.

Playing for perenial losers can do a number on the players and on our perception of them. Put him on the Celtics and he will be diving on the floor and getting out on the break in no time.