Where Do We Go Now? (Celts off season plan)

[JSD]

I see Detroit banking on 2010 and blowing it up. The Pistons might not be in LT area as the Nuggets were but are probably in worse financial shape. Michigan's economy is dead in the water right now. I'm very much considering both teams we just have a different vision of where we think the Pistons are going.

They will already be enough under the cap that trading away two very decently priced veterans for cap relief makes no sense.

One can look no further than the recent home playoff games of the Pistons to understand the sheer magnitude of the depression that has hit Michigan. The team had to market their playoff games to Cleveland fans because they were not selling them out. The issue has nothing to do with the cap. It comes down to an owner looking to turn a profit because that's what business like to do. There is no bigger profit in the NBA then when a team is rebuilding. I'm done talking about this, I say Tay, Rip or both are gone this off-season. Some don't agree and that's fine.

[cordobes]

Regardless of whether or not Detroit will be trading Rip or Prince, does anyone think that we have the tools to make the best possible offer?

I guarantee half the league could offer more value than the celtics for those two.

I'd wish that people who are going to post trade ideas this off-season will take that line of reasoning into consideration. Not only if the trade makes sense for both teams, but if it's realistic to expect that no team will put a better offer on the table than the C's.

One should not take such a smug tone without looking at ideas with an open mind and from all angles. The dynamics of the NBA have changed, it's no longer about talent for talent it's about the bottom line

I completely understand that. My point was more than even if a thread makes both teams better it doesn't mean that it's a realistic scenario. For example, that trade you proposed, wouldn't a club like say, Dallas, that could offer Stackhouse expiring contract, which is unguaranteed for the most part this season, beat our offer easily?

[dlpin]

One can look no further than the recent home playoff games of the Pistons to understand the sheer magnitude of the depression that has hit Michigan. The team had to market their playoff games to Cleveland fans because they were not selling them out. The issue has nothing to do with the cap. It comes down to an owner looking to turn a profit because that's what business like to do. There is no bigger profit in the NBA then when a team is rebuilding. I'm done talking about this, I say Tay, Rip or both are gone this off-season. Some don't agree and that's fine.

Your proposal still doesn't make sense.  Rip's contract runs out in 2010, so they are not trading him for anyone if they want cap relief, and right now Prince is the only player signed for 2011. So unless they can't even afford 11 million in contracts for 2011, there is no point in them trading for additional cap relief.

[cordobes]

I'm done talking about this, I say Tay, Rip or both are gone this off-season. Some don't agree and that's fine.

You're misunderstand the point others are making. It's less about if Detroit will trade Prince or Hamilton; more about if the C's are the best trading partner they can get if they opt to do so.

[Lucky17]

One can look no further than the recent home playoff games of the Pistons to understand the sheer magnitude of the depression that has hit Michigan. The team had to market their playoff games to Cleveland fans because they were not selling them out. The issue has nothing to do with the cap. It comes down to an owner looking to turn a profit because that's what business like to do. There is no bigger profit in the NBA then when a team is rebuilding. I'm done talking about this, I say Tay, Rip or both are gone this off-season. Some don't agree and that's fine.

Your proposal still doesn't make sense.  Rip's contract runs out in 2010, so they are not trading him for anyone if they want cap relief, and right now Prince is the only player signed for 2011. So unless they can't even afford 11 million in contracts for 2011, there is no point in them trading for additional cap relief.

Hamilton's contract was extended this season (I believe on the same day they traded Billups). It was a curious move by Dumars; I still don't know why he did it.

Bill Davidson just died, so there may be a shift in philosophy as far as the Pistons front office goes, but he was never an owner whose moves were dictated by the bottom line. I would be very surprised if Tayshaun was traded, but Dumars is not averse to making a big trade.

[Who]

Bill Davidson just died, so there may be a shift in philosophy as far as the Pistons front office goes, but he was never an owner whose moves were dictated by the bottom line.

I think it was Bill Davidson's wife that took over ... whoever it was, that person said that the club would be ran exactly  the way Bill Davidson ran it ... for whatever that's worth.

[Lucky17]

Bill Davidson just died, so there may be a shift in philosophy as far as the Pistons front office goes, but he was never an owner whose moves were dictated by the bottom line.

I think it was Bill Davidson's wife that took over ... whoever it was, that person said that the club would be ran exactly  the way Bill Davidson ran it ... for whatever that's worth.

Yes, Karen Davidson did take over, but she's learning the ropes on the fly, and will likely defer to Dumars and other members of the Pistons brass on tough decisions -- unless she decides to sell the team.

http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=200990426036

For the time being, I think Dumars will be calling the shots more than ever in Detroit.

[dlpin]

Hamilton's contract was extended this season (I believe on the same day they traded Billups). It was a curious move by Dumars; I still don't know why he did it.

Bill Davidson just died, so there may be a shift in philosophy as far as the Pistons front office goes, but he was never an owner whose moves were dictated by the bottom line. I would be very surprised if Tayshaun was traded, but Dumars is not averse to making a big trade.

Strange that it doesn't show on hoopshype salary page, but still, that means they have 2 players under contract for the 2010-2011 season, so unless they plan on putting out an NBDL type team with the smallest payroll out there, I don't think they'd be interested in trading the two players for basically nothing, especially since we can't really include any relevant draft picks to entice them.

[cordobes]

Just a heads-up: Nachbar ended his contract with Dynamo Moscow, he's an unrestricted free-agent now. Personally, I'm not interested on him, but a propos, I'll paste here something I wrote in the comments section of a fanpost:

I believe the Celtics should look at the european leagues in the free-agency market. There are always some good players available to grab there. Off the top of my head: Will Bynum, Stephen Jackson, Bruce Bowen, Udonis Haslem, Anthony Parker, José Calderon, Andreas Nocioni, Luis Scola, Raja Bell, Nocioni, James Singleton; or in the past guys like Bill Laimbeer, PJ Brown, Mario Ellie, Antonio Davis, Darrell Armstront, etc.: all of them were free-agents in Europe before joining the NBA.

I'm pretty sure there are some players currently in Europe that are legit NBA rotation players. You can pick from guys with NBA experience like Childress, Delfino, Nachbar, Pargo, etc.; former NBA busts who have developed their games like Marcus Haislip or Rakocevic;  undrafted free-agents like Bourousis, McIntyre, Romain Sato, Austin Nichols; or guys who were drafted but are still to join the league, like Fran Vasquez, Andersen or Lorbek.

I think it's stupid to limit yourself to the current crop of NBA players; most of those guys (and others I didn't cite) are good enough to play in the NBA and maybe you can get them for cheaper.

[elcotte]

I'm anything but certain that we will. My confidence in management is badly shaken right now.

You HOPE they realize what their strategy meant to this season. It's pretty obvious.

But money does funny things to people's thought patterns.

Put me down tonight for about 55 percent optimistic that we'll actually build a bench this summer.

And your major move is Nocioni. That's the bench we've been lacking?

[LB3533]

I have a few ideas, call me crazy please.

1.) Sign Ricky Davis after he opts out from the Clippers

2.) Sign FA Jason Hart

3.) Sign Steve Novak

4.) Trade Tony Allen for Mardy Collins


Yes, I just posted 4 moves to bring ex-Clippers to your Boston Celtics. (And yet all 4 of those guys makes our bench stronger).

[dlpin]

Just a heads-up: Nachbar ended his contract with Dynamo Moscow, he's an unrestricted free-agent now. Personally, I'm not interested on him, but a propos, I'll paste here something I wrote in the comments section of a fanpost:

I believe the Celtics should look at the european leagues in the free-agency market. There are always some good players available to grab there. Off the top of my head: Will Bynum, Stephen Jackson, Bruce Bowen, Udonis Haslem, Anthony Parker, José Calderon, Andreas Nocioni, Luis Scola, Raja Bell, Nocioni, James Singleton; or in the past guys like Bill Laimbeer, PJ Brown, Mario Ellie, Antonio Davis, Darrell Armstront, etc.: all of them were free-agents in Europe before joining the NBA.

I'm pretty sure there are some players currently in Europe that are legit NBA rotation players. You can pick from guys with NBA experience like Childress, Delfino, Nachbar, Pargo, etc.; former NBA busts who have developed their games like Marcus Haislip or Rakocevic;  undrafted free-agents like Bourousis, McIntyre, Romain Sato, Austin Nichols; or guys who were drafted but are still to join the league, like Fran Vasquez, Andersen or Lorbek.

I think it's stupid to limit yourself to the current crop of NBA players; most of those guys (and others I didn't cite) are good enough to play in the NBA and maybe you can get them for cheaper.

I think it is a great idea to look to Europe. But just as an additional info, while I think Childress would be a great pick up, I think the Hawks still have his rights because he was an rfa, and therefore we'd need to deal with them to get him.

[Scribbles]

I have a few ideas, call me crazy please.

1.) Sign Ricky Davis after he opts out from the Clippers

2.) Sign FA Jason Hart

3.) Sign Steve Novak

4.) Trade Tony Allen for Mardy Collins


Yes, I just posted 4 moves to bring ex-Clippers to your Boston Celtics. (And yet all 4 of those guys makes our bench stronger).

Ricky Davis is done.  He's always been a me first player and wouldn't fit well here.  Plus he's aging and he won't be effective anymore.

Hart is a downgrade from Marbury imo, but that's just me.  I've watched Novak for years at Marquette and am a big fan of his but he's a taller version of Scal, who doesn't play near the defense Scal does.

Mardy Collins is unknown.  He has talent, but never really has put it all together.  You could say the same for Tony Allen. 

I'm not sure if you were being sarcastic or not but I'd stay away from all of them.   

[CoachBo]

I'm anything but certain that we will. My confidence in management is badly shaken right now.

You HOPE they realize what their strategy meant to this season. It's pretty obvious.

But money does funny things to people's thought patterns.

Put me down tonight for about 55 percent optimistic that we'll actually build a bench this summer.

And your major move is Nocioni. That's the bench we've been lacking?

No, my major move is to dump a bag of Danny's trash, with Tony Allen as the bow, on New Orleans so they can rid themselves of the horrible scourge that is James Posey.

But in lieu of that, Nocioni is an excellent, younger - and more expensive alternative.

[cordobes]

Just a heads-up: Nachbar ended his contract with Dynamo Moscow, he's an unrestricted free-agent now. Personally, I'm not interested on him, but a propos, I'll paste here something I wrote in the comments section of a fanpost:

I believe the Celtics should look at the european leagues in the free-agency market. There are always some good players available to grab there. Off the top of my head: Will Bynum, Stephen Jackson, Bruce Bowen, Udonis Haslem, Anthony Parker, José Calderon, Andreas Nocioni, Luis Scola, Raja Bell, Nocioni, James Singleton; or in the past guys like Bill Laimbeer, PJ Brown, Mario Ellie, Antonio Davis, Darrell Armstront, etc.: all of them were free-agents in Europe before joining the NBA.

I'm pretty sure there are some players currently in Europe that are legit NBA rotation players. You can pick from guys with NBA experience like Childress, Delfino, Nachbar, Pargo, etc.; former NBA busts who have developed their games like Marcus Haislip or Rakocevic;  undrafted free-agents like Bourousis, McIntyre, Romain Sato, Austin Nichols; or guys who were drafted but are still to join the league, like Fran Vasquez, Andersen or Lorbek.

I think it's stupid to limit yourself to the current crop of NBA players; most of those guys (and others I didn't cite) are good enough to play in the NBA and maybe you can get them for cheaper.

I think it is a great idea to look to Europe. But just as an additional info, while I think Childress would be a great pick up, I think the Hawks still have his rights because he was an rfa, and therefore we'd need to deal with them to get him.

Yes, you're correct about Childress. The same is true for Delfino, Vasquez, Lorbek and Andersen, btw. (we wouldn't need to deal with Atlanta though; but we'd need to sign Childress to an offer sheet that they'd have the right to match).