Rondo still averaging a triple double for the series

[BballTim]

At this stage, I couldn't care less about statistics.  It's not going to be much consolation if he keeps his milestone, but is sitting on the bench in Game 7 because he decided to be a punk.

If he gets suspended because someone decided to come after him and smack him in the face, I will be at a loss about what to think about the way those issues are being handled.

?

Rondo initiated the contact.  He threw Hinrich into the scorer's table.  Hinrich them came after his face, at which time Rondo got his elbow up, and moved it in a jabbing motion.  We'll see if it's deemed to be intentional, but if it is, it would be absolutely consistent for the NBA to suspend him.

That's the first characterization I've seen from Celtics fans where Rondo is shown to be the completely innocent party in last night's fracas.  Interesting.

  Rondo didn't initiate the contact. Hinrich was "boxing him out" 20 feet from the basket when the ball was already being rebounded by someone 10 feet away. Poeple are trying to paint Rondo as the bad guy (or the thug) but he certainly didn't attack Hinrich out of the blue.

[CelticsWhat35]

I'll be the first to admit Rondo had a bad game last night.  19 assists and zero turnovers looks good in a box score, but not when you watch the game.  He was very tentative and let the Chicago crowd take him out of his game, and the majority of assists came from passing the ball from 25 feet out to Ray Allen, who put together one of the greatest performances I've ever seen.

But the way people are talking about Rondo being a punk and everything is just ridiculous.  Hinrich's stitches were from him not bracing himself after there feet got tangled up and instead looking to see if he got an "and 1".  And there was nothing cheap about his foul on Miller.  It was a hard foul, and maybe it was flagrant too.  But if he had just gave Miller a light slap on the side of his chest, we would've had a 3pt play possibility on our hands.  Then with Hinrich last night, if you're getting boxed out after a play is well over, you're going to do something about it.  The only reason it escalated is because it was near the scorers table and then Hinrich came after Rondo.  This whole talk about his elbow motion is pathetic.  He didn't come close to taking a swing.  He got a flagrant foul for throwing Hinrich, which is fine.  But to suggest anything past that, or that the guy lacks character for that play, is just ludicrous.

And let's all be clear.  If Rondo hit's that shot that Rose blocked and they win the game, NO ONE here is talking about what a "punk" Rondo is.  I understand frustration, but this is pathetic.

[kenmaine]

Two players got tangled up?  I saw one player grab another player's arm and swing him into the scorers table.

Huge Rondo fan here, but last night he was horrible. And 19 assists don't mean much if it's just walking the ball upcourt and passing to Ray Allen.
For the entire game I kept waiting for Rondo to do something and he never did. Not sure if he was intimidated by the thug Miller's threats, or if it was some wierd kind of Rope-a-Dope strategy either he or Doc thought up.
And as for the nonsense with Hinrich- I saw one player hold and prevent another player from getting upcourt, and the guy being held got p---ed and threw the holder off him. Then the guy who initiated it bounced up and tried to start a fight. Should have been a foul on Rondo and a T on Hinrich IMO. WAY too much made of it.
BTW, all the legal wizards who yesterday were saying that "intent" has nothing to do with a flagrant foul, then I guess whoever it was who accidently hit PP in the nose and caused him to bleed should have been hit with a flagrant?

[guava_wrench]

Two players got tangled up?  I saw one player grab another player's arm and swing him into the scorers table.

Huge Rondo fan here, but last night he was horrible. And 19 assists don't mean much if it's just walking the ball upcourt and passing to Ray Allen.
For the entire game I kept waiting for Rondo to do something and he never did. Not sure if he was intimidated by the thug Miller's threats, or if it was some wierd kind of Rope-a-Dope strategy either he or Doc thought up.
And as for the nonsense with Hinrich- I saw one player hold and prevent another player from getting upcourt, and the guy being held got ****ed and threw the holder off him. Then the guy who initiated it bounced up and tried to start a fight. Should have been a foul on Rondo and a T on Hinrich IMO. WAY too much made of it.
BTW, all the legal wizards who yesterday were saying that "intent" has nothing to do with a flagrant foul, then I guess whoever it was who accidently hit PP in the nose and caused him to bleed should have been hit with a flagrant?

That hit to Pierce had no windup at all and no follow through. Just bad luck.

One thing the national broadcasters have been pointing out is how Rondo gets the ball to Ray at the perfect spot for him to shoot. He doesn't have to adjust like he does for passes from others.

On the other hand, some assists are ridiculous. There are times when Rondo passes to Pierce, then after a second or two, Pierce puts on a move, dribbles twice, and then buries a jumper. I don't see how that should get an assist.

Personally, I don't think Rondo was horrible. He just wasn't as dominant. He seemed to have a hard time finishing when he drove, partly due to good defense. In general, I question the wisdom of forcing the same play if the other team adjusts their defense. Find the new vulnerability instead.

[kenmaine]

Two players got tangled up?  I saw one player grab another player's arm and swing him into the scorers table.

Huge Rondo fan here, but last night he was horrible. And 19 assists don't mean much if it's just walking the ball upcourt and passing to Ray Allen.
For the entire game I kept waiting for Rondo to do something and he never did. Not sure if he was intimidated by the thug Miller's threats, or if it was some wierd kind of Rope-a-Dope strategy either he or Doc thought up.
And as for the nonsense with Hinrich- I saw one player hold and prevent another player from getting upcourt, and the guy being held got ****ed and threw the holder off him. Then the guy who initiated it bounced up and tried to start a fight. Should have been a foul on Rondo and a T on Hinrich IMO. WAY too much made of it.
BTW, all the legal wizards who yesterday were saying that "intent" has nothing to do with a flagrant foul, then I guess whoever it was who accidently hit PP in the nose and caused him to bleed should have been hit with a flagrant?

That hit to Pierce had no windup at all and no follow through. Just bad luck.

One thing the national broadcasters have been pointing out is how Rondo gets the ball to Ray at the perfect spot for him to shoot. He doesn't have to adjust like he does for passes from others.

On the other hand, some assists are ridiculous. There are times when Rondo passes to Pierce, then after a second or two, Pierce puts on a move, dribbles twice, and then buries a jumper. I don't see how that should get an assist.

Personally, I don't think Rondo was horrible. He just wasn't as dominant. He seemed to have a hard time finishing when he drove, partly due to good defense. In general, I question the wisdom of forcing the same play if the other team adjusts their defense. Find the new vulnerability instead.

Good point, and the obvious vulnerability last night was the Bulls defense on Ray Allen. But I really think Rondo was not himself mentally last night. All the commotion and controversy may have gotten to him.
 No big deal though if we win the next game. He's been amazing and everyone can have an off game- Ray sucked in game one, but he's certainly made up for it since.
I just hope the C's win Saturday- it's too early for the off-season, and I love what this team has done this year.

 

[Jaycelt]

#1- I don't think Rondo was horrible last night, but he wasn't good either, 19 assists or not.

#2- I don't think the hit to Miller was flagrant or excessive.  It was a hard playoff foul, period.

#3- The play against Hinrich was stupid and unnecessary.  Anyone arguing that Hinrich initiated it is a pure homer.
Hinrich was playing basketball and Rondo was playing streetball.  Hinrich had every right to be upset.  If it had happened to anyone on our team I would have expected the same reaction.
 Even Doc lit into Rondo after that play and it happened right in front of him. Stupid, stupid, stupid.  That said, my guess is he won't get suspended.  Luckily for him it didn't evolve into anything worse.

#4- As well as Rondo has played offensively in this series, his defense has been just as bad.  I've maintained all season that Rondo's defense was overrated and this series is a microcosm of his deficiencies.  With a depleted front court and only one real shot blocker to rely on Rondo has to keep his man in front of him and he's absolutely failed in this regard.  Not only that but he never rotates to help.  Ever.

That's the way I see it.

[vinnie]

I honestly cannot believe that Rondo is being referred to as a punk. Unreal.

[vinnie]

I love the way Rondo has played, but he's pretty much been a cheap shot artist the last 2 games.  Hinrich and Miller both have stitches to verify it.

How quickly we forget when Hinrich raked Marbury face causing two cuts around the eye. I don't understand the persecution of Rondo here, other than the fact that he played incredibly scared last night.

[vinnie]

Two players got tangled up?  I saw one player grab another player's arm and swing him into the scorers table.

It is the first time I have ever seen someone get boxed out all the way to the sidelines! I think if there was no table and crowd, Hinrich would have continued pushing Rondo.

[Roy Hobbs]

I honestly cannot believe that Rondo is being referred to as a punk. Unreal.

Anybody -- regardless of what team they play for -- who throws another player down, and then starts throwing his elbows around in a confrontation is, to me, acting like a punk.  If Hinrich had done the same thing to Rondo, we'd all be calling for his head.

[guava_wrench]

Wins are nice, but what really matters is Rondo getting 10 rebounds tomorrow. He doesn't need any assists or points, so I would have him just crash the boards on offense. I would also put him in with a Marbury-House-Moore lineup, since that will provide many misses on offense.

It is also important that we minimize turnovers, because you cannot get an offensive rebound when you turn the ball over. Better to take and miss a bad shot, especially long 3s that can lead to long rebounds.

Perk also needs to be careful not to grab any boards when Rondo is in the vicinity. That sometimes costs us a Rondo triple double.

[Roy Hobbs]

Wins are nice, but what really matters is Rondo getting 10 rebounds tomorrow. He doesn't need any assists or points, so I would have him just crash the boards on offense. I would also put him in with a Marbury-House-Moore lineup, since that will provide many misses on offense.

It is also important that we minimize turnovers, because you cannot get an offensive rebound when you turn the ball over. Better to take and miss a bad shot, especially long 3s that can lead to long rebounds.

Perk also needs to be careful not to grab any boards when Rondo is in the vicinity. That sometimes costs us a Rondo triple double.

Pretty much.

[vinnie]

I honestly cannot believe that Rondo is being referred to as a punk. Unreal.

Anybody -- regardless of what team they play for -- who throws another player down, and then starts throwing his elbows around in a confrontation is, to me, acting like a punk.  If Hinrich had done the same thing to Rondo, we'd all be calling for his head.

I don't think this is true, but I sense you don't like Rondo. How do you explain Hinrich continuing to box out/shove Rondo about 30 feet from the basket after Chicago has already rebounded the ball? And, I guess it is ok for Hinrich to be the tough guy and go into a boxing stance and attempt to clock Rondo while Rondo was continuing to backup.

[Roy Hobbs]

I honestly cannot believe that Rondo is being referred to as a punk. Unreal.

Anybody -- regardless of what team they play for -- who throws another player down, and then starts throwing his elbows around in a confrontation is, to me, acting like a punk.  If Hinrich had done the same thing to Rondo, we'd all be calling for his head.

I don't think this is true, but I sense you don't like Rondo. How do you explain Hinrich continuing to box out/shove Rondo about 30 feet from the basket after Chicago has already rebounded the ball? And, I guess it is ok for Hinrich to be the tough guy and go into a boxing stance and attempt to clock Rondo while Rondo was continuing to backup.

Why do you sense that I don't like Rondo?  Because I'm being objective?  If a guy acts like a punk, I'm going to say he acted like a punk.  I've supported the guy his entire Celtics career, but last night his head wasn't in the game.

Let's say Hinrich was in the wrong.  Do you think it was a smart play for Rondo to fling him backward?  Was it a smart play for Rondo to get his elbows up in the aftermath?  I don't care what Hinrich did; Rondo needs to be the smarter player.

[guava_wrench]

I honestly cannot believe that Rondo is being referred to as a punk. Unreal.

Anybody -- regardless of what team they play for -- who throws another player down, and then starts throwing his elbows around in a confrontation is, to me, acting like a punk.  If Hinrich had done the same thing to Rondo, we'd all be calling for his head.

I don't think this is true, but I sense you don't like Rondo. How do you explain Hinrich continuing to box out/shove Rondo about 30 feet from the basket after Chicago has already rebounded the ball? And, I guess it is ok for Hinrich to be the tough guy and go into a boxing stance and attempt to clock Rondo while Rondo was continuing to backup.

Why do you sense that I don't like Rondo?  Because I'm being objective?  If a guy acts like a punk, I'm going to say he acted like a punk.  I've supported the guy his entire Celtics career, but last night his head wasn't in the game.

Let's say Hinrich was in the wrong.  Do you think it was a smart play for Rondo to fling him backward?  Was it a smart play for Rondo to get his elbows up in the aftermath?  I don't care what Hinrich did; Rondo needs to be the smarter player.

To add to this, Hinrich did nothing on the play that endangered his remaining in the game.

It seems some want to reinterpret this into a Rodman baiting Alonzo Mourning type play. While I consider this looking through homer glasses, it doesn't make a difference. You can't risk an ejection to lash out at a less important player who is annoying you.

Rondo should expect that the Bulls want to keep him off the boards so that he can't start the break.