Why wasn't KG in the game?

[Steve Weinman]

A couple of weeks ago: "Who cares about the record?! Health and rest are the priorities, Doc is a moron if he doesn't understand this!"

Now: "Play the guy! It's just a few more minutes! Doc is being over-cautious! Regular season games count!!"

Can always count on cordobes to come through in the clutch.  Thanks, sir.

-sw

Can't agree anymore with cordobes and Steve here. the short term memory of Celtics fans at this blog is actually quite funny sometimes. Doc is sticking to his guns and keeping Ray's, Pierce's and Perk's and Rondo's minutes in lower more acceptable levels and is slowly bringing KG back while integrating Moore and Marbury in.

Did anyone really expect for Doc to do all those things and still come out with a record of 13-2 or 12-3 which would have kept us on a pace to still be within strinking distance of Cleveland?

TP's to cor and Steve for the sanity.

Thanks, Nick; reciprocated.

I'll bring back the question I posed in the front page thread as well, while we're on the topic: Much as I hate hypotheticals, I think this one is fairly possible given how last night's game turned out.  What happens if, as many have requested, Doc plays KG late in the game...and it goes to overtime?  Should he run him out for another five minutes?  At what point do we draw a line with a superstar in a late March game, as moderately important as it might be?

There's plenty to be upset about after this game as a Celts fan.  Two issues not on my list - Doc's use of KG and the officiating.

-sw

[guava_wrench]

He could have afforded 3 more minutes to give his teammates a psychological lift in the ending of the 4th imo. The fact he sat and looked on was distasteful, and Doc wouldn't have physically barred his path to going back in. McHale ran on a broken foot all 87' and Parish's ankles were blown out and Larry's back was shot. Each would rather die then lose and they made it to the finals. I'm not saying he should have played the game, but he should have came in to give an emotional uplift ending of the 4th.

And the Celtics lost.

I can't understand the anger some people feel about this. The win would have been nice, but all that really matters is that KG doesn't hurt himself doing too much too early.

Doc wanted to give KG more minutes against the Clips, but KG felt sore from the previous 2 games. They are increasing the minutes based on how KG's body reacts. These aren't rules from stubbornness. We already know Doc is stubborn about playing the guys who will give the team a best chance at a win in any given game, but we don't want to burn out for playoffs.

[ma11l]

If he can play in the first and third he can play in the fourth.  Cut his minutes in those quarters by 2 minutes each and there's 4 to play with in the 4th quarter.  We might as well be playing him in the D League to get healthy at this point.  He has minimal impact on the game playing at these times.  If he's gonna play 15 I'd take 8 in the second with the bench and the last 7 of the game.

[illestmcsgt]

I agree with cordobes, Steve, and nickagneta in this thread. Before people were complaining about Doc playing Pierce and Ray too much. Well now KG is back we should run him into the ground as well? There's not much he can do when the playoffs are right around the corner. We need to either try to limit the minutes then take some losses or try to win these last upcoming games by tiring out our guys.

If Doc did play KG and he wouldn't had much impact then what's the point? He didn't look too good he just trying to steadily bring him back. Rushing him back won't do anybody good if he re-injury it again. Be patient if the standings mean that much to you then expect disappointment.

No way would I take this game as a bad sign because we were close towards the end and we were down by 12 earlier. I would only be happy that we can prove we can win on the road if we faced them in the second round without HCA.

[nickagneta]

A couple of weeks ago: "Who cares about the record?! Health and rest are the priorities, Doc is a moron if he doesn't understand this!"

Now: "Play the guy! It's just a few more minutes! Doc is being over-cautious! Regular season games count!!"

Can always count on cordobes to come through in the clutch.  Thanks, sir.

-sw

Can't agree anymore with cordobes and Steve here. the short term memory of Celtics fans at this blog is actually quite funny sometimes. Doc is sticking to his guns and keeping Ray's, Pierce's and Perk's and Rondo's minutes in lower more acceptable levels and is slowly bringing KG back while integrating Moore and Marbury in.

Did anyone really expect for Doc to do all those things and still come out with a record of 13-2 or 12-3 which would have kept us on a pace to still be within strinking distance of Cleveland?

TP's to cor and Steve for the sanity.

Thanks, Nick; reciprocated.

I'll bring back the question I posed in the front page thread as well, while we're on the topic: Much as I hate hypotheticals, I think this one is fairly possible given how last night's game turned out.  What happens if, as many have requested, Doc plays KG late in the game...and it goes to overtime?  Should he run him out for another five minutes?  At what point do we draw a line with a superstar in a late March game, as moderately important as it might be?

There's plenty to be upset about after this game as a Celts fan.  Two issues not on my list - Doc's use of KG and the officiating.

-sw

Personally I think you draw the line exactly where the doctor and trainer have advised Doc to draw it, so as to bring KG back as efficiently and with the least amount of risk possible. If Doc, Ed Lacerte and the doctor feel that 2-8 minute straight stretches of ball per half are best at the moment, then the score and situation doesn't matter. Don't brea break it into 4 4 minute stretches and don't go over the limits. Plain and simple and that's what is being done. If KG is putting up 20/10/4 numbers while playing KG like defense in April, May and June because Doc stuck to his protocol and lost some games in March, who cares?

[guava_wrench]

If he can play in the first and third he can play in the fourth.  Cut his minutes in those quarters by 2 minutes each and there's 4 to play with in the 4th quarter.  We might as well be playing him in the D League to get healthy at this point.  He has minimal impact on the game playing at these times.  If he's gonna play 15 I'd take 8 in the second with the bench and the last 7 of the game.

KG could be stiff by the end of the fourth.

Why have him play with the bench? He is a starter. Why mix things up so much. The new guys on the bench need to adjust to their roles.

There are an infinite number of possibilities that upset fans can come up with I suppose, so it is probably pointless for me to reply to this.

D League? That is ridiculous. Why play with players he doesn't need to get have chemistry with? And why send him there when he can benefit the team here? Minimal impact? Only against Orlando. He had solid contributions in the other 3 games. Don't let your anger cloud your memory.

Let the coaches and medical staff handle this. The want to win as much as you do.

[Kiorrik]

My view:

Let's say they had set his minutes for the first 5 games to maximums of: 4, 8, 12, 16 and 22.

What if this was the first game. And you make an exception. Instead of 4 minutes, you play him 8. Then next game "he was able to play 8 last game so he can move on to 12 easily!" - and what if that second game happens to have a close finish and you put him back in there for 2 minutes to win it. He'll have played 14 minutes.

.edit: forgot to make the point that in an extreme case, he could end up with 48 mins while he should have just played 22.

Garnett seems like the kind of player that doesn't take "you can't go out there right now" for an answer. Strict rules *do* work, and they're there for a reason. No need to divert from it halfway through.

Funniest thing, a week or so ago everyone was saying "Doc needs to learn how to limit the minutes to his starters!" (Mainly PP) and now that he does limit an injured starters minutes, you seem surprised?

Doc.

My kind of coach.

[thebirdman]

I am OK with Doc`s decision.

He only plays KG at the start of each half because he can warm up before it. You can`t put Garnett in after sitting him for so long because he cools off. That would be too dangerous.

[hpantazo]

I agree with KG sitting and hopefully being ready for the playoffs. My question is, why did rondo stay in after clearly re-injuring his ankle? I know he's stubborn, but we need him for the playoffs as much as we need KG.

[Bankshot]

Sorry, but I'm not buying that KG couldn't play at least the last two minutes of the game.  And I'm not one of those who agreed with the way Doc is doling out his minutes.  I thought the plan was to increase his minutes gradually, but I haven't seen any increase in his minutes.  I'm the one that started the thread the other day asking if KG will play more minutes against the Magic, because if he doesn't the Celtics wouldn't win and that's exactly what happened.

Two minutes would have been all that was needed and I don't think anyone can convince me that two minutes would have hurt KG.

[hpantazo]

Sorry, but I'm not buying that KG couldn't play at least the last two minutes of the game.  And I'm not one of those who agreed with the way Doc is doling out his minutes.  I thought the plan was to increase his minutes gradually, but I haven't seen any increase in his minutes.  I'm the one that started the thread the other day asking if KG will play more minutes against the Magic, because if he doesn't the Celtics wouldn't win and that's exactly what happened.

Two minutes would have been all that was needed and I don't think anyone can convince me that two minutes would have hurt KG.

If he plays and then sits for a long time, he stiffens up and increases the likelyhood of reinjuring his leg, especially in a game where fouls are not being called. Good move by Doc.

[CelticsWhat35]

A couple of weeks ago: "Who cares about the record?! Health and rest are the priorities, Doc is a moron if he doesn't understand this!"

Now: "Play the guy! It's just a few more minutes! Doc is being over-cautious! Regular season games count!!"

Absolutely agree with you.  Everyone likes to say that health is the #1 thing, but aren't willing to make that sacrifice when it actually comes to the games.  Obviously the #2 seed is preferential over the #3 seed, but not at the expense of health.

But it's nice to hear from the doctors on this board who claim that KG is "fine".  I guess Doc didn't get that memo. 

[BballTim]

  I think not playing KG extra minutes late in the game sends the right message to Orlando, that it was just another regular season game for us and we aren't overly concerned about our ability to beat them.

[Redz]

  I think not playing KG extra minutes late in the game sends the right message to Orlando, that it was just another regular season game for us and we aren't overly concerned about our ability to beat them.

And we could beat you, but chose not to?

[idrinkdetergent]

And we almost beat them w/o KG. We chose to rest the best player so we could beat them when it counts. So even with the 3rd seed, if thats where we end up, The Celts shouldnt worry about the Magic in the second round. Its not last year these guys have been playing together more now and already have proved they can win home or on the road.