Moore and Marbury

[celticinorlando]

but  a lot of good teams got guys late....spurs with hill...heck Chris D. Roberts looks like a player for the nets and boston passed on him 3 times...don't understand the giddens pick at all...or walker getting time too late in the season...IF boston doesn't repeat we can look back to the fact the bench was weak from the get go at the swing and big spots

[housecall]

but  a lot of good teams got guys late....spurs with hill...heck Chris D. Roberts looks like a player for the nets and boston passed on him 3 times...don't understand the giddens pick at all...or walker getting time too late in the season...IF boston doesn't repeat we can look back to the fact the bench was weak from the get go at the swing and big spots

Thats what im talking about ... Roger Mason Jr.was available.I just do not get the logic behind some of the management lately.

[cordobes]

the cavs have even gone out since we added Mikki and got a decent looking Big from the D-league.Why didn't Danny see this guy?Im placing the blame where i feel it should be,thats the GM and owners.

Who's that guy? Do you really mean the Cavs?

Maybe you're talking about Toronto and Pops Mensah-Bonsu. I wrote a post here suggesting that we should consider signing him from the D-League, but Ainge didn't read it He wouldn't be worse than Moore and that kind of guys, I don't think.

[housecall]

the cavs have even gone out since we added Mikki and got a decent looking Big from the D-league.Why didn't Danny see this guy?Im placing the blame where i feel it should be,thats the GM and owners.

Who's that guy? Do you really mean the Cavs?

Maybe you're talking about Toronto and Pops Mensah-Bonsu. I wrote a post here suggesting that we should consider signing him from the D-League, but Ainge didn't read it He wouldn't be worse than Moore and that kind of guys, I don't think.

Sunday while watching the cavs vs nets game they announced this new Big into the game.I forget his name but he is about 6'10",250ish.He played a pretty decent game too.They also said he was recently in the dleague.

[cordobes]

the cavs have even gone out since we added Mikki and got a decent looking Big from the D-league.Why didn't Danny see this guy?Im placing the blame where i feel it should be,thats the GM and owners.

Who's that guy? Do you really mean the Cavs?

Maybe you're talking about Toronto and Pops Mensah-Bonsu. I wrote a post here suggesting that we should consider signing him from the D-League, but Ainge didn't read it He wouldn't be worse than Moore and that kind of guys, I don't think.

Sunday i was watching the cavs vs nets game when they announced this new Big into the game.I forget his name but he is about 6'10",250ish.He played a pretty decent game too.They also said he was recently in the dleague.

Ah, that's Darnell Jackson from Kansas, no? He was their 2nd round pick in the last draft, he was in the D-League for a short stint, IIRC, but they called him up, like we did with Walker. Yeah, I've always found him a solid player.

[housecall]

the cavs have even gone out since we added Mikki and got a decent looking Big from the D-league.Why didn't Danny see this guy?Im placing the blame where i feel it should be,thats the GM and owners.

Who's that guy? Do you really mean the Cavs?

Maybe you're talking about Toronto and Pops Mensah-Bonsu. I wrote a post here suggesting that we should consider signing him from the D-League, but Ainge didn't read it He wouldn't be worse than Moore and that kind of guys, I don't think.

Sunday i was watching the cavs vs nets game when they announced this new Big into the game.I forget his name but he is about 6'10",250ish.He played a pretty decent game too.They also said he was recently in the dleague.

Ah, that's Darnell Jackson from Kansas, no? He was their 2nd round pick in the last draft, he was in the D-League for a short stint, IIRC, but they called him up, like we did with Walker. Yeah, I've always found him a solid player.

Very possible,i forgot his name,but he played some decent ball for the short minutes he was on the flr.I can't believe that we couldn't find 1 decent Big or wingman in all this time.Something is not right at the top. (imo)tp for help clearing this up.

[mahonedog88]

Yeah lets hope Danny realizes his mistakes and actually builds a bench for next year.

It was a solid try signing Moore and Marbury, but lets face it...both of these guys, Marbury I think more than Moore, have been complete failures.

I'm hopin some kind of switch will be turned on once the playoffs start, buuuut I wouldn't bet on it.

[Tr1boy]

Honestly lets not expect too much from moore. He hustles , has height can nail the jumper, good at screening. But lets not expect him to be able to handle howard easily nor block him out.

He was not given a break tonight at all from the refs and took 2 good charges plus was granted a foul on the offensive end. Refs are the worst in regards to favouring star / vet players its ridicoulus imo

In any case moore is better than patrick ob ever could have been and we couldn't have got a better centre

But marbury concerns me. He had all the time in the world to be in tip top shape while not playing but looks like he hasnt been at the gym trainning hard from what i can see. Looks sluggish and his body is definitely not at in nba shape. He is also playing too much into the role player everyone told him to play.

He needs to play with some edge and nastiness we remembered him before when he was a star

Pretty tiring to wait and see when he will wake up, its been already enough games for him to get his feet wet. He has bust written all over him and i can see why in ny he wasn't given worth a look

I really do like what ainge has done since being gm but his biggest mistake looks like not being able to secure posey . Not sure why he couldn't have thought in a couple of years he would have been still valuable to a contending team and we could have gotten back something else via trade if we couldn't afford him.

[guava_wrench]

Honestly lets not expect too much from moore. He hustles , has height can nail the jumper, good at screening. But lets not expect him to be able to handle howard easily nor block him out.

He was not given a break tonight at all from the refs and took 2 good charges plus was granted a foul on the offensive end. Refs are the worst in regards to favouring star / vet players its ridicoulus imo

In any case moore is better than patrick ob ever could have been and we couldn't have got a better centre

But marbury concerns me. He had all the time in the world to be in tip top shape while not playing but looks like he hasnt been at the gym trainning hard from what i can see. Looks sluggish and his body is definitely not at in nba shape. He is also playing too much into the role player everyone told him to play.

He needs to play with some edge and nastiness we remembered him before when he was a star

Pretty tiring to wait and see when he will wake up, its been already enough games for him to get his feet wet. He has bust written all over him and i can see why in ny he wasn't given worth a look

I really do like what ainge has done since being gm but his biggest mistake looks like not being able to secure posey . Not sure why he couldn't have thought in a couple of years he would have been still valuable to a contending team and we could have gotten back something else via trade if we couldn't afford him.

If we wouldn't have been able to afford keeping Posey, who would? New Orleans blew their budget and tried to dump Chandler. Do we want to end up like that?

You don't get into bidding wars for guys like that when others are willing to overpay. Don't be spoiled. You aren't entitled to every player you want on your team. Sometimes you are stuck with KG, Jesus, and the Truth.

[johnnyrondo]

Inexpensive moves that could of helped our bench:

Drafting Mario Chalmers over Giddens
Signing Chris Anderson over POB
Signing Matt Barnes over Tony Allen
Passing on Marbury and Moore and waiting to see if you could sign Joe Smith
And going back a yr, when Phoenix was selling the pick we traded them for the Rondo pick, I anted us to buy it back and draft Rudy Fernandez. Portland ended up buying it.

Chalmers
Fernandez
Barnes
Smith
Anderson

Add three or four of those inexpensive players to a bench with House, BBD, and Powe and you have nice depth.

And its not 20/20 hindsight. I wasn't the only one calling for Chalmers on draft day or Anderson over POB or waiting on Smith.I was the only one regarding Rudy though Ha.

[gustusias]

Leon Powe's numbers are much better than Moore. Miki deserves to play when we are in severe foul trouble or we just plain need height. Every game he plays in he fails to rotate on defense fast enough to get back against high screened pick and rolls. Every attempted block is late. His offense is inconsistent, hesitant. He is just so much less than Leon Powe, and if every minute Baby plays then Leon does not, then why in the world should Moore play at all. His superior length means nothing is what we are discovering.

Stephon Marbury is not shooting or handling the ball well enough. Even his penetrations go nowhere most of the time. He also plays more off guard than point, Allen's normal position. I really love House and Tony Allen together on defense. Tony also scores a lot from the foul line. I know Steph is a better ball handler and passer, yet WITH HIM IN the C's also subtract a much larger number; defensive  pressure and intensity, weakside rebounding, height, speed, better penetration and finishing ability by far, and points on the scoreboard. Stephon Marbury has failed up to now to convince me that his outside shooting is any better than Tony Alen's. It is supposed to be, but he is not shooting well at all and he is shooting in doubt. Even his ball handling and turnovers are no better than TA's. Somebody say I am wrong.

[nickagneta]

Well, about Moore people just drank the kool-aid and the expectations were just too high. I'm not the bit surprised: he's shooting slightly better than expected, defending slightly worse (it's incredible how often he's out of position), but it'll eventually regress to the mean. Now, some of those threads from those days where people were giving different assessments on Moore should be bumped, just to allow us to know who to take seriously. Still, guys like Moore always have some weeks here and there where they play out of their mind, so maybe we get lucky. But I really hope we get Powe back for the playoffs.

Marbury, I was expecting him to play badly for awhile, hoping that eventually he'd be solid. Marbury was never an All-Star player, only statistically, and he wasn't even close to that in recent seasons, so solid solid and not AS was the correct expectation. I always had doubts if he'd be a better backup PG than House (especially considering how much we need another 3pt shooter in the rotation besides RA and PP) and till now he's been ridiculously bad - he can't shoot, can't defend, can't keep the ball safe, he's willing to pass the ball but he's not being very good doing it. I think there's still some reasons to have hope he can improve, but it's about time.

I will say that I, for one, thought Moore's defense and shot blocking were better than this and you did warn me. I never said he had a great game but thought his energy and style of defense and ability to get up on shots would be his assets coming in. I thought his length might not block shots but alter a lot. I will freely admit I was as wrong as wrong could be. He looks just completely and utterly lost out there and his fundamentals are a lot worse than what I had remembered seeing in New Jersey where he assisted in making NJ one of the better defensive rebounding teams in the league while he was there.

He is lost comprehending how to blitz the high post pick and roll. His rotations are easily the worst on the team. He constantly is coming down with his arms and making contact when attempting to block or alter a shot, often drawing the foul. He is oblivious as to his status with fouls and plays without thinking of the situation at hand. He is caught looking at the shot upon an opponents outside shot all the time while ignoring where he should be positioning himself for a rebound or who and how to block out. I mean that's pre high school basketball fundamentals right there that he is clueless about. his defensive stance is so straight upright with almost no crouch or spread base that with his slight frame he is moved out of the box by shooting guards.

I never though he would be this bad. But he is eating minutes up(much like a 5th starter in baseball eats up innings even though he might suck or have bad stats) and getting other players rest they would be getting if he wasn't here. I guess you can find a silver lining anywhere.

As for Marbury, I thought and still think the man is toxic for a team. Fortunately for the C's he has been encased in lead for the time he has been here, figuratively speaking. Unfortunately he appears to be playing at time like he is leterally encased in lead. I will say that if he can get his shot going and continues with the energy output on defense that he has given, good things should start to happen for him.

[guava_wrench]

Well, about Moore people just drank the kool-aid and the expectations were just too high. I'm not the bit surprised: he's shooting slightly better than expected, defending slightly worse (it's incredible how often he's out of position), but it'll eventually regress to the mean. Now, some of those threads from those days where people were giving different assessments on Moore should be bumped, just to allow us to know who to take seriously. Still, guys like Moore always have some weeks here and there where they play out of their mind, so maybe we get lucky. But I really hope we get Powe back for the playoffs.

Marbury, I was expecting him to play badly for awhile, hoping that eventually he'd be solid. Marbury was never an All-Star player, only statistically, and he wasn't even close to that in recent seasons, so solid solid and not AS was the correct expectation. I always had doubts if he'd be a better backup PG than House (especially considering how much we need another 3pt shooter in the rotation besides RA and PP) and till now he's been ridiculously bad - he can't shoot, can't defend, can't keep the ball safe, he's willing to pass the ball but he's not being very good doing it. I think there's still some reasons to have hope he can improve, but it's about time.

What I am particularly disliked about Marbury is how his passes seem always a few feet off from where a player wants it. Still, Marbury can normally get to the hoop and finish much better than he has with us. Seems he always wants to shoot.

Mikki seems like a guided missile. He has a gift for jumping into people. The first think I would like him to stop is fouling jump shooters. As tall as he is, he shouldn't be following through as slapping jump shooters.

[hpantazo]

Well, about Moore people just drank the kool-aid and the expectations were just too high. I'm not the bit surprised: he's shooting slightly better than expected, defending slightly worse (it's incredible how often he's out of position), but it'll eventually regress to the mean. Now, some of those threads from those days where people were giving different assessments on Moore should be bumped, just to allow us to know who to take seriously. Still, guys like Moore always have some weeks here and there where they play out of their mind, so maybe we get lucky. But I really hope we get Powe back for the playoffs.

Marbury, I was expecting him to play badly for awhile, hoping that eventually he'd be solid. Marbury was never an All-Star player, only statistically, and he wasn't even close to that in recent seasons, so solid solid and not AS was the correct expectation. I always had doubts if he'd be a better backup PG than House (especially considering how much we need another 3pt shooter in the rotation besides RA and PP) and till now he's been ridiculously bad - he can't shoot, can't defend, can't keep the ball safe, he's willing to pass the ball but he's not being very good doing it. I think there's still some reasons to have hope he can improve, but it's about time.

What I am particularly disliked about Marbury is how his passes seem always a few feet off from where a player wants it. Still, Marbury can normally get to the hoop and finish much better than he has with us. Seems he always wants to shoot.

Mikki seems like a guided missile. He has a gift for jumping into people. The first think I would like him to stop is fouling jump shooters. As tall as he is, he shouldn't be following through as slapping jump shooters.

TP, that's my biggest problem with Moore, he fouls almost every jump shooter. If he doesn't foul them, he goes for the upfake and they go by him, and the worst part is, most of them can't even make a shot outside 10 ft.

[Bankshot]

Honestly lets not expect too much from moore. He hustles , has height can nail the jumper, good at screening. But lets not expect him to be able to handle howard easily nor block him out.

He was not given a break tonight at all from the refs and took 2 good charges plus was granted a foul on the offensive end. Refs are the worst in regards to favouring star / vet players its ridicoulus imo

In any case moore is better than patrick ob ever could have been and we couldn't have got a better centre

But marbury concerns me. He had all the time in the world to be in tip top shape while not playing but looks like he hasnt been at the gym trainning hard from what i can see. Looks sluggish and his body is definitely not at in nba shape. He is also playing too much into the role player everyone told him to play.

He needs to play with some edge and nastiness we remembered him before when he was a star

Pretty tiring to wait and see when he will wake up, its been already enough games for him to get his feet wet. He has bust written all over him and i can see why in ny he wasn't given worth a look

I really do like what ainge has done since being gm but his biggest mistake looks like not being able to secure posey . Not sure why he couldn't have thought in a couple of years he would have been still valuable to a contending team and we could have gotten back something else via trade if we couldn't afford him.

This is one of the things I don't like about Moore.  His height gives him zero advantage.  Our smaller players, Powe and BBD are better rebounders.