Author Topic: Blessing in Disguise  (Read 4559 times)

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Blessing in Disguise
« on: March 13, 2009, 03:21:04 AM »

Offline threats13

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Man these injuries are just awful...BUT...we found out a ton of great things from this recent situation.  We found out that Leon Powe still brings the ruckus just as hard as he did last year in the playoffs.  Hes been tearing through teams with such great energy, great foul shooting, great rebounding, I mean hes the total package (and hes undersized!!).   

We found out that Marbury and Moore are real rusty, and they acknowldged it, and that they need to work extra hard to get on the right page, and they acknowledged that too.  Thats a great thing to see from these two guys. Theyre not just gonna let their poor play continue they want to work harder they want to play better they want to produce and they want to win games.  Thats the attitude I want from them and while Im not loving their play as of late Im loving that they are committed to getting better.   

Also, and kind of under the radar, I think BBD's confidence has risen dramatically while being off the court.  Not playing showed him how important he is to this team.  Its not all about the Big 4.  Hes been providing us with real quality minutes, especially when hes cashing that midrange jumper.  Having him in the lineup gives us good energy, WEIGHT in the post, and an effective midrange jumpshot.  Him and Perk can really bring it down in the trenches and are probably the most physical duo in the league when on the court together.  We saw this most recently against the Lebrons.  Cant wait to have him back.

One game with Bill Walker getting minutes and we found out that this guy is going to bring it every time hes on the floor.  He's got this look on his face like he can take on the world when hes out there. Good for him keep up the good work and Doc feed him some minutes he deserves them (even if its only to get PP and Ray some rest).

Lastly, and most importantly we learned that the "contenders" in the East are going to need to bring it come playoff time because this team is not messing around.  With all odds against them against the Magic they took them to the wire.  With D-Wade and the world against them they made a game out of it.  Shocking if you ask me.  With the way the Heat have been playing they are going to battle with any team in the league and the fact that we were fighting with them with the unbelievably depleted roster is actually a good sign.  Throw in the defending DPOY, Rondo, BBD, the Red Rocket B-Scal, and i guess Tony Allen wouldnt hurt even though he scares me more often than not and weve got two totally different ballgames in Orlando and Miami.

So, in conclusion, fellow C's fans DO NOT PANIC, we may not get HCA, we may not even get the 2 seed, BUT, we are better because of this injury plagued stretch, trust me. 
The NBA..where "this whole sport is a business and the referees decide games and David Stern is a snake and is only in this for the money" happens.

Re: Blessing in Disguise
« Reply #1 on: March 13, 2009, 03:54:32 AM »

Offline liam

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If we get healthy, all that you say is true.

Re: Blessing in Disguise
« Reply #2 on: March 13, 2009, 03:58:37 AM »

Offline greenwise

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I don't think anything happening to the C's recently is a blessing in disguise. There's nothing really so good about losing 5 players due to injuries and having to endure some losses that would have never happened if we had been healthy.

I know it's good to find silver linings and being optimistic (which i am), but I just believe the team is very strong minded and they are figthing the best they can with the players available.

I just wish the team is back together soon.

Re: Blessing in Disguise
« Reply #3 on: March 13, 2009, 07:38:55 AM »

Offline CoachBo

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Agreed. There's no silver lining whatsoever in losing players to injury, or games period.

It slows our development for the playoffs, mainly through the integration of the players we've added. And despite all the rationalization here, seeding is significant.

There's not much to like about the current situation.
Coined the CelticsBlog term, "Euromistake."

Re: Blessing in Disguise
« Reply #4 on: March 13, 2009, 08:35:24 AM »

Offline moiso

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As a whole, it's a bad thing.  The only good that I see is that Walker is getting some minutes which would be helpful if Doc chooses to use him in the playoffs.  I'm not even sure it's going to help the new guys get integrated more quickly since since Marbury isn't playing well enough to play big minutes and Moore is always going to be a stiff.

Re: Blessing in Disguise
« Reply #5 on: March 13, 2009, 09:19:46 AM »

Offline PaulPierce34G

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Whatever happens is going to happen.  One thing that is for sure, once the team has the bulk of it's players back in uniform, it'll certainly change the way things have been going as of late.  Come playoff time, whether its a series with Cleveland, Orlando, or both, this team will not fold up, or get destroyed.  Each series, more specifically the Cleveland series will go down to the wire again.  Home court is truly important, but once the playoffs roll around, anything is possible...at that point, the regular season means nothing.  I 100% believe that Boston can overtake the Cavs in a 7 game series, even without homecourt advantage.  A difficult task?  Most definitely, but surely not impossible.  Players take their games to a new level come playoff time.  Of course Lebron will always be Lebron, but you'll see Pierce pull some tricks out of his hat, too. And if Ray Allen doesn't start out this yrs post season like he did last year, it will certainly make for good basketball.  KG will give you his normal contributions & Rondo has another year under his belt.  Anything can happen in the playoffs (8th seeded Denver upsetting #1 Seattle back in the 94. the Knicks making the finals versus the Spurs as an 8th seed back in 1999, and the upset of Dallas by GSW only a few years ago).. I would love to get that #1 seed, have the homecourt, but if they don't get it, they don't get it.  All we can do as fans is continue to support, sit back, relax & enjoy the ride.

Re: Blessing in Disguise
« Reply #6 on: March 13, 2009, 09:40:53 AM »

Offline TatteredOnMySleeve

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Not a blessing in disguise...AT ALL... every game is crucial, this team is completly lost right now, with little to no chemistry, Kevin Garnett isnt in basketball shape and we're without our starting PG...how is this a blessing? it makes other people step up? ...in losses? it gets marbury and moore acclimated to the celtics? wouldnt it be better for them to get up to speed with their real roles, on a full team? its putting HCA out of reach? we're running Pierce and ray into the ground?    im not feeling ya...the grizzlies have won 4 games on the road this season, and without rondo and KG I have no idea if this team is capable of winning even the easiest games..at home

Quote
One game with Bill Walker getting minutes and we found out that this guy is going to bring it every time hes on the floor.

So..One game of bill walker we learned hes going to bring it every time hes on the floor? huh? that doesnt make sense and shouldnt be factored into this "blessing in disguise" at all...Bill walker spelling pierce for 5 minutes means nothing when he will not get minutes down the stretch run or in the playoffs...he'll be glued to the bench, as he has been all season
« Last Edit: March 13, 2009, 09:47:02 AM by TatteredOnMySleeve »
When you got it going, you got it going. I just keep my focus down the stretch. That's when I want the ball. I'm just not afraid to fail."-PaulPierce

Re: Blessing in Disguise
« Reply #7 on: March 13, 2009, 10:08:58 AM »

Offline cordobes

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Why is Moore rusty? It's not like he has been injured or not playing for a good amount of time. I mean, has anyone here ever seen Moore playing significantly better than he's been playing with the C's?

Re: Blessing in Disguise
« Reply #8 on: March 13, 2009, 10:21:09 AM »

Offline TatteredOnMySleeve

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Why is Moore rusty? It's not like he has been injured or not playing for a good amount of time. I mean, has anyone here ever seen Moore playing significantly better than he's been playing with the C's?


Yes, everyone knows the 06-07 with the nets was the best year of his career by far, so yes Ive seen him play significantly better(with a playoff team) than hes been playing with the c's...that said he shouldnt be rusty, hes played over 900 minutes in the NBA this season, but hes clearly  rusty in terms of the celtics schemes etc, that and he went from the kings...to the celtics...the differece in the gameplay and style is huge
When you got it going, you got it going. I just keep my focus down the stretch. That's when I want the ball. I'm just not afraid to fail."-PaulPierce

Re: Blessing in Disguise
« Reply #9 on: March 13, 2009, 10:25:33 AM »

Offline Chris

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Why is Moore rusty? It's not like he has been injured or not playing for a good amount of time. I mean, has anyone here ever seen Moore playing significantly better than he's been playing with the C's?

Yes, he played better when he played for the Nets a few years back...which was really the only time he played for a good team that I can remember.

Anyways, the real problem with Moore is that because of injuries he is being asked to do MUCH more than he was brought here to do.  Let him go back to being the 10th man, and an extra option against long, athletic front courts, and then we will see his value.

Re: Blessing in Disguise
« Reply #10 on: March 13, 2009, 10:47:57 AM »

Offline moiso

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I don't even think Moore was that good on the Nets.  So he led the league in field goal percentage... he's a 7 footer that nobody guarded in an open offense.  And he barely took enough shots to qualify.  Or maybe it was the 5 rebounds he averaged.
I don't even want this guy to play a second in the playoffs unless 3 of the following are fouled out- KG, Perk, Baby, Powe.  The playoffs are a physical grind and Moore will be the wimpiest guy on the floor.  At least PJ and even Pollard were physically strong enough to hold their ground.  Moore is like a tall 15 year old playing against men.

Re: Blessing in Disguise
« Reply #11 on: March 13, 2009, 10:54:46 AM »

Offline wdleehi

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Why is Moore rusty? It's not like he has been injured or not playing for a good amount of time. I mean, has anyone here ever seen Moore playing significantly better than he's been playing with the C's?

Yes, he played better when he played for the Nets a few years back...which was really the only time he played for a good team that I can remember.

Anyways, the real problem with Moore is that because of injuries he is being asked to do MUCH more than he was brought here to do.  Let him go back to being the 10th man, and an extra option against long, athletic front courts, and then we will see his value.


Jason Kidd effect.


Remember, because of Kidd, Kenyon Martin became a max contract player.


Now, he has to play off the point guard trio of Marbury, House and Pruitt.  Just not the same level as his one decent season. 

I would expect him to become more effective when
1) Rondo returns as PG
2) KG, Davis and Scali come back such limiting his minutes.

Re: Blessing in Disguise
« Reply #12 on: March 13, 2009, 11:11:36 AM »

Offline Chris

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Why is Moore rusty? It's not like he has been injured or not playing for a good amount of time. I mean, has anyone here ever seen Moore playing significantly better than he's been playing with the C's?

Yes, he played better when he played for the Nets a few years back...which was really the only time he played for a good team that I can remember.

Anyways, the real problem with Moore is that because of injuries he is being asked to do MUCH more than he was brought here to do.  Let him go back to being the 10th man, and an extra option against long, athletic front courts, and then we will see his value.


Jason Kidd effect.


Remember, because of Kidd, Kenyon Martin became a max contract player.


Now, he has to play off the point guard trio of Marbury, House and Pruitt.  Just not the same level as his one decent season. 

I would expect him to become more effective when
1) Rondo returns as PG
2) KG, Davis and Scali come back such limiting his minutes.

Absolutely.  He really gives nothing on offense when not playing with a good playmaker.  But when healthy this team has one of the best in the league (and maybe a second one once he hits his stride).

But again, the real key is the role.  Just like Powe and Davis were better last year when they were being used in a platoon, than they were at the beginning of this year, Moore will be much better when Doc is allowed to only use him in favorable matchups, rather than being forced to play him much more than he is comfortable with.

Re: Blessing in Disguise
« Reply #13 on: March 13, 2009, 04:58:01 PM »

Offline paintitgreen

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I think it's way too much to say there's "never" a silver lining to injuries and losses, at least in the regular season and particularly when the team has already wrapped up a playoff spot and is close to clinching the division. This is as ideal a time for this to happen as any - they only need six wins in their final 17 games to guarantee at least the third seed, and I think they handle that with or without KG. If the team is gonna hit a bump, it's better to have it happen with 30 games to go in the regular season while ahead of the pack, like this was, rather than with 5 games to go or after the playoffs start. Do we want the injuries? No, of course not. But it's only a silver lining (and not, say, a golden opportunity), precisely because it surrounds a cloud over the season, a bad situation. Only the lining is silver, not the situation as a whole.

I will agree, though, that there won't be any silver lining if Garnett can't come back healthy. So provided Garnett comes back before the playoffs, it's a good time for him to get a lot of rest - if he has more energy in the playoffs because of this rest, rehab and recuperation, he'll be even tougher, much like he started both last season and this season with a vengeance. And it's an opportunity for the bench, which has been frankly woeful this year on the whole, to sort out who the team can rely on come playoff time. On that front, the Allen, Davis and Scalabrine injuries hurt even more, but like the OP said, Moore and Marbury need to figure things out and now they have a trial by fire.

I don't agree with everything the OP said - specifically, I disagree that one game from Walker proves he'll bring it every night. I'm optimistic about him too, and would love to see him get more burn, but one game does not prove everything. It proves potential and opens the door to an opportunity to prove he will bring it every night. But his ability to contribute is not a foregone conclusion. I also am not sure about the Davis thing, especially the idea of him gaining confidence while on the bench. He definitely played adequately in Garnett's absence, which would have boosted his confidence, but if anything, his injury is pushing him further out of the rotation, as Powe is looking like he'll take all the backup PF minutes and Davis will be fighting Moore and maybe Scal for minutes in the playoffs. And I just don't see how he or anybody else gets in their head that if he was playing, they would have won either or both of the last two games. To reach that conclusion in games where two starters are missing is a bit much.

I agree completely, though, that the injuries has forced Marbury and Moore to see how far off they are from being ready to contribute to a good team. Hopefully it accelerates their pace of getting up to speed, which would most definitely be a silver lining. With Rondo out, Marbury saw how he would play in extended minutes with Pierce and Allen. And he and we saw it wasn't very good. He can move forward from that, and we get to see him in more situations to decide where he does and does not fit. And if neither guy takes the opportunity to push forward in getting into the system, it won't be because of the injuries, it will be because those guys just don't have what we need. Silver lining - we find out sooner rather than later, when we erroneously rely on them in the playoffs. 

I also agree that Powe has taken advantage of the opportunity and HIS confidence is rising. He can play with the starters, he can play with the bench players, he knows how to fit in both situations. I think he'll be crucial especially if Garnett needs a little extra rest in the playoffs, and this opportunity has picked him back up. He had an inconsistent at best season, but he's coming on strong now at the right time. If Garnett was healthy and Scalabrine was healthy and Davis was healthy, who knows how often Doc would have called Powe's number. Lord knows he didn't do a ton this season to merit inclusion as one of our key bench players. Without the injuries, maybe Scal and Moore (to get him involved) and Davis are splitting all the minutes at the big positions. Instead, Powe got the call and has run with it.

I also agree that the overall confidence of the team has to be rising a bit since they are at least competing and playing very well against other playoff contenders despite missing two key starters - one an All Star and the defensive catalyst of the team, the other a strong All Star candidate, key perimeter defender and now the offensive catalyst as point guard - and three other rotation players. Ideally, they would have won at least one of the last two to go with the great Cleveland win (had they gone 3-0, I think you could have drawn a lot of parallels between that three game stretch and the Texas Triangle last year, although we had a lot more adversity in this stretch), but staging those comebacks was huge even if they fell short. We all know that when healthy, this team comes out strong to start halves due to their great starting five. They probably wouldn't be in that come-from-behind position they've been in the past couple of nights if they had Rondo and KG there.

So there are definitely silver linings. That doesn't mean the situation was ideal or a blessing in disguise (not the same as a silver lining) but good can come out of it, and from where I'm sitting, the Celtics are getting some good things out of a bad situation.
Go Celtics.

Re: Blessing in Disguise
« Reply #14 on: March 13, 2009, 05:46:13 PM »

Offline Danimals

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After we beat the Cavs, LBJ delivered a backhanded compliment - even without Garnett, the C's are a great team since we have two other stars (implying that the Cavs, like many other teams, have had to make due with just one).

And to a certain degree, he has a point: Every team has injuries. Every team has imperfect rotation role players. Not every team has 2 max contract perennial all-stars with complete games like Pierce and Allen, both of whom are still playing near the peaks of their careers.

Wasn't merely keeping games close and competitive the Celtics' battle cry when Pierce was the only star?