Author Topic: You just saw the 2009 NBA Champions  (Read 44964 times)

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Re: You just saw the 2009 NBA Champions
« Reply #105 on: April 12, 2009, 11:17:20 PM »

Offline Rondo_is_better

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The celtics suck in cleveland, and it leads to threads like this, but paul pierce outplays lebron almost everytime in boston and is every bit 'in his league'. this is why 1st place was important, (cleveland wanted it more) and why 2nd place is useless

not so sure cleveland wanted it more...i think the rash of injuries killed boston's chances to get it

Pretty sure cleveland wanted it more
Pretty sure cleveland went through injuries of there own
Pretty sure the celtics lost 13 of there 20 losses with a completly healthy KG, including a blowout loss in cleveland

But HEY, with KG we'd never lose..to the warriors, lakers twice, bobcats, knicks and blazers without brandon roy! wait..

You're right we'd go 82-0 like Kobe and his Lakers and Lebron and his LeBronettes. They have no bad losses. None.


Also losing Ben Wallace, Delonte and Z at separate times comes nowhere near equaling the effect of losing KG for 22 games, and having him barely play in 3 more. If the Cavs lost Lebron for 22 games, then you'd have a case. They didn't want it more; we got bitten badly by the injury bug.

« Last Edit: April 12, 2009, 11:23:44 PM by Rondo_is_better »
Grab a few boards, keep the TO's under 14, close out on shooters and we'll win.

Re: You just saw the 2009 NBA Champions
« Reply #106 on: April 12, 2009, 11:21:00 PM »

Offline winsomme

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My GOD! What has happened to this board. It wasn't over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor.

What is the matter with you guys?

When the going gets tough, the tough get going!

You guys are acting like Dean STERNER kicked you out of the NBA!!!!

And Lebron danced on our faces!

Are we going to lay down like whipped puppies?

Come on, we lost Game 3 of the 1984 Finals 137-103 and came back to win.

This was a meaningless game to us since Orlando handed us the #2 seed.

SO LEBRON is too tough, Oh the Referees screw us time and again, Mo Williams is better than Rondo, Davis is Varejevo's ****, LA DEE DA DEE DA!

Guess what!!! The Cadavers are going down in their building on Memorial Day against the Celtics and then they get compared to ......... (er I'm not going there - let Scotty or Wide Load fill in the ........).

The Celtics will win when it counts at the Q.



CLE is definitely beatable at the Q. I concede nothing against that team.....

this was a "live to fight another day" game....

Re: You just saw the 2009 NBA Champions
« Reply #107 on: April 12, 2009, 11:23:06 PM »

Offline mahonedog88

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Lets all watch Sportscenter...

Apparently they are going to explain "Why the Cavs won't win it all"

Re: You just saw the 2009 NBA Champions
« Reply #108 on: April 12, 2009, 11:33:25 PM »

Offline Cman

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Lets all watch Sportscenter...

Apparently they are going to explain "Why the Cavs won't win it all"

Why, cuz David Stern was in that hotel room with Kobe?

Oh, and the Germans never did bomb Pearl Harbor. It was the Japanese.
Celtics fan for life.

Re: You just saw the 2009 NBA Champions
« Reply #109 on: April 13, 2009, 12:02:24 AM »

Offline QuinielaBox

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Lets all watch Sportscenter...

Apparently they are going to explain "Why the Cavs won't win it all"

Why, cuz David Stern was in that hotel room with Kobe?

Oh, and the Germans never did bomb Pearl Harbor. It was the Japanese.

LOL Cman, ever watch Animal House starring John Belushi. I'm showing up at the Q with 10,000 marbles to throw onto the court when Lebron think he is going in for the dunk!
Wins are few, times are hard. Here is your bleeping St Patricks Day Card.

Re: You just saw the 2009 NBA Champions
« Reply #110 on: April 13, 2009, 12:49:53 AM »

Offline KCattheStripe

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this is disgusting. we've killed with injuries and still win 60, and our players are scheduled to come back for the beginning of the playoffs... yet when we lose a meaningless game with Cleveland (a team we beat without KG) we're hopeless against them. What would have been the difference today if we had a 50% KG? i think it would have been closer, otherwise your saying BBD is more than half the man Kevin is (which he isn't) or maybe your saying that Mikki Moore is our glaring weakness? well how about when we have Leon and Baby to battle Joe Smith in the second unit matchup?

A FIRED UP 85% HEALTH CELTIC TEAM CAN BEAT THESE GUYS.


I believe that the CAVS are eerily similar to us last year. Remember that they didn't have a completely healthy Z last year and he is a very under rated player. Mo Williams was a big pickup. Most importantly though they play the hungry ferocious defense that we did last year. When was the last time you saw us come out with the defensive intensity in the first and third quarters like we used to? We used to win games in the first and third. Now we almost always are playing from behind because we can't come out focused. Even against bad teams. Say what you will, but there is no question they don't have the same level of hunger as they did last year. If you think they can just flip a switch in the EC finals you are sadly mistaken. You can't flip switches against teams that are as good or better than you are.



Edited for same reasons you point.
keep the conversation clean both and not continue on that fan status thing
Edgar


And in personal thinking
Isnt that what Atlanta does against us last year and almost beat us
ANY team can have 4 games of glory
Ask Golden State

Come on! You don't really expect us to believe that you think the CAVS are even remotely in the same league as Atlanta or Golden State?! If you are referring to us, then I am even more depressed...

This days with the simptoms of jumping off the ship we have around
yes I am refering to us
We are as good as any team in this league

If we are 100% healthy then I'd agree that we are right there. We aren't as good as last year though. I sure haven't been jumping on and off the bandwagon though because I was am the OP from 4 months ago and have been concerned about our depth. Look at these positions as objectively as you can and tell me we are the best:

      Boston           CAVS              Lakers
PG - Rondo          Williams        Fisher    - us and the Cavs are slightly ahead of LA
SG - Allen             West              Kobe    - LA in a landslide
SF - Pierce             Lebron         ?            - Cavs by a pretty good margin
PF - KG                 Varaejo          Gasol   - Gasols has stats and health. KG is better though
C - Perk                Big Z              Bynum - Probably a wash

Key Backups: Bos - BBD, POWE, House, Marbury
                         Cle - Gibson, Wally, Wallace, Joe Smith
                         LA - Ariza, Walton, Farmar, Powell

If you are talking starters, then the only one that we are arguably better at is at PF. With him not being 100% then that gives the edge IMO to LA and Gasol. The 2 best players on that list are not Celtics. As far as benches go we are talented, but small. The size is what hurts us otherwise I would say we are the best of the group, however Cleveland does have 3 former all-stars and one heck of a shooter in Gibson.

This is my rationale behind my worry. I am not going to put on blinders and pretend we are better than we are.




Why not put blinders on when you can't effect the game?

Re: You just saw the 2009 NBA Champions
« Reply #111 on: April 13, 2009, 06:24:20 AM »

Offline waltzero

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Rally! Rally! Hyah!
 
-Cavs don't have a playoff gear. They spent a lot of energy just to get home court. They have not paced themselves properly at all, whereas we've rested our guys well in preparation.

-Cavs still do not have the mental game it takes to win in the playoffs. Celtics fans should know how important the mental game is, only the Spurs might have a better mental game than us, and they are further along in their years.

-Cavs have had unbelievable home cooking this year. The idea that they are going to be in the record books with the 85-86 C's is just really stupid. It won't be more than 15 years before computers can analyze the footage and show how the refs targeted players, made momentum altering calls on purpose, ignored grabby grab defense, etc. Normally the NBA refs help the team that falls behind to keep games close, but when they want to annoint someone, they don't screw them when they get a lead. It's easy to play with lots of defensive hustle when the refs reward you so much. Most importantly of all, the league is really really scared of doing this in the playoffs. What they did to the C's last year was unprecedented; yet they still had to call the game 7s in a neutral way out of fear they'd hurt the league.

-the Cavs know they've gotten tons of help from the refs. Mentally, this undermines them. They know it means they are frauds which increases their mental weakness.

-Everybody tried hard to beat us this year and the refs tried to help them make every game a close one. Yet when the refs said 'screw you' to so many teams in the first quarter against the Cavs and Lakers, teams did what the C's did Sunday. They smelled bs and decided it wasn't worth more than going through the motions. Again, the refs think they are helping the Cavs and Lakers, but it makes them weaker and it makes the C's stronger. Because we have passed a lot of tough tests and they know they've been helped.

-The Cavs owe their home record to the C's record win streak. The refs etc hated the idea of this Celtics team being 'the best ever' so they 'took them down' and proceeded to pump up the Cavs home record.

-Lebron has never been clutch. He's still just a kid really. Pierce is a way better decision maker in crunch time. And all this year, Ray has been our life line. So we have at least two players who are more clutch than their best player. Kobe...nobody misses more clutch shots than Kobe.

-check 82games.com to see how much better our starting lineup is compared to theirs. It's WAY WAY BETTER than theirs. Anyone should have been able to see that by now, but if you are confused for some reason, look at those numbers.

-Rondo and Perkins leveled up big time this year. Ray Allen was under utilized all last year and this year is his most efficient season ever. Baby and Powe are better too. Pose was great, but he's just one guy. We were this close to having four legit all stars in our starting line up. No way does last year's team beat this year's team in a dream match up. It's not even close. This year's team is soooooo much better than last year's, anyone who has watched most of the games should know that.

-Marbury gives us another point guard who can run an offense, that's huge. Eddie House has been red hot since we got Marbury.

I could keep going, but why bother.

Lebron will never beat this C's team just as Jordan never really beat Larry's C's. Kobe will never win another ring. Jackson will never pass Red.

BELIEVE PEOPLE BELIEVE

Re: You just saw the 2009 NBA Champions
« Reply #112 on: April 13, 2009, 07:42:42 AM »

Offline CoachBo

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this is disgusting. we've killed with injuries and still win 60, and our players are scheduled to come back for the beginning of the playoffs... yet when we lose a meaningless game with Cleveland (a team we beat without KG) we're hopeless against them. What would have been the difference today if we had a 50% KG? i think it would have been closer, otherwise your saying BBD is more than half the man Kevin is (which he isn't) or maybe your saying that Mikki Moore is our glaring weakness? well how about when we have Leon and Baby to battle Joe Smith in the second unit matchup?

A FIRED UP 85% HEALTH CELTIC TEAM CAN BEAT THESE GUYS.


I believe that the CAVS are eerily similar to us last year. Remember that they didn't have a completely healthy Z last year and he is a very under rated player. Mo Williams was a big pickup. Most importantly though they play the hungry ferocious defense that we did last year. When was the last time you saw us come out with the defensive intensity in the first and third quarters like we used to? We used to win games in the first and third. Now we almost always are playing from behind because we can't come out focused. Even against bad teams. Say what you will, but there is no question they don't have the same level of hunger as they did last year. If you think they can just flip a switch in the EC finals you are sadly mistaken. You can't flip switches against teams that are as good or better than you are.



Edited for same reasons you point.
keep the conversation clean both and not continue on that fan status thing
Edgar


And in personal thinking
Isnt that what Atlanta does against us last year and almost beat us
ANY team can have 4 games of glory
Ask Golden State

Come on! You don't really expect us to believe that you think the CAVS are even remotely in the same league as Atlanta or Golden State?! If you are referring to us, then I am even more depressed...

This days with the simptoms of jumping off the ship we have around
yes I am refering to us
We are as good as any team in this league

If we are 100% healthy then I'd agree that we are right there. We aren't as good as last year though. I sure haven't been jumping on and off the bandwagon though because I was am the OP from 4 months ago and have been concerned about our depth. Look at these positions as objectively as you can and tell me we are the best:

      Boston           CAVS              Lakers
PG - Rondo          Williams        Fisher    - us and the Cavs are slightly ahead of LA
SG - Allen             West              Kobe    - LA in a landslide
SF - Pierce             Lebron         ?            - Cavs by a pretty good margin
PF - KG                 Varaejo          Gasol   - Gasols has stats and health. KG is better though
C - Perk                Big Z              Bynum - Probably a wash

Key Backups: Bos - BBD, POWE, House, Marbury
                         Cle - Gibson, Wally, Wallace, Joe Smith
                         LA - Ariza, Walton, Farmar, Powell

If you are talking starters, then the only one that we are arguably better at is at PF. With him not being 100% then that gives the edge IMO to LA and Gasol. The 2 best players on that list are not Celtics. As far as benches go we are talented, but small. The size is what hurts us otherwise I would say we are the best of the group, however Cleveland does have 3 former all-stars and one heck of a shooter in Gibson.

This is my rationale behind my worry. I am not going to put on blinders and pretend we are better than we are.



Good analysis, and a reasonable basis to be concerned. We aren't as good as we were last year, Cleveland is markedly better, despite all the blind Celtics allegiance you read in this thread. TP for your objectivity in a thread decidedly short of same.

The window doesn't have to shut, however, for the next year or two if management gets serious about building and paying for depth behind the starting unit, which is as good as any in the league. Another year like this one, though, and you might be right. We may be forced to remember last year for awhile.

Coined the CelticsBlog term, "Euromistake."

Re: You just saw the 2009 NBA Champions
« Reply #113 on: April 13, 2009, 07:48:39 AM »

Offline BballTim

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If we are 100% healthy then I'd agree that we are right there. We aren't as good as last year though. I sure haven't been jumping on and off the bandwagon though because I was am the OP from 4 months ago and have been concerned about our depth. Look at these positions as objectively as you can and tell me we are the best:

      Boston           CAVS              Lakers
PG - Rondo          Williams        Fisher    - us and the Cavs are slightly ahead of LA
SG - Allen             West              Kobe    - LA in a landslide
SF - Pierce             Lebron         ?            - Cavs by a pretty good margin
PF - KG                 Varaejo          Gasol   - Gasols has stats and health. KG is better though
C - Perk                Big Z              Bynum - Probably a wash

Key Backups: Bos - BBD, POWE, House, Marbury
                         Cle - Gibson, Wally, Wallace, Joe Smith
                         LA - Ariza, Walton, Farmar, Powell

If you are talking starters, then the only one that we are arguably better at is at PF. With him not being 100% then that gives the edge IMO to LA and Gasol. The 2 best players on that list are not Celtics. As far as benches go we are talented, but small. The size is what hurts us otherwise I would say we are the best of the group, however Cleveland does have 3 former all-stars and one heck of a shooter in Gibson.

This is my rationale behind my worry. I am not going to put on blinders and pretend we are better than we are.


  We're not playing both teams at once. Cleveland's clearly better than us at one spot and we're definitely better than them at 2 spots. Same with the Lakers, and that's if you don't consider us better at pf.

Re: You just saw the 2009 NBA Champions
« Reply #114 on: April 13, 2009, 07:55:07 AM »

Offline crownsy

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this is disgusting. we've killed with injuries and still win 60, and our players are scheduled to come back for the beginning of the playoffs... yet when we lose a meaningless game with Cleveland (a team we beat without KG) we're hopeless against them. What would have been the difference today if we had a 50% KG? i think it would have been closer, otherwise your saying BBD is more than half the man Kevin is (which he isn't) or maybe your saying that Mikki Moore is our glaring weakness? well how about when we have Leon and Baby to battle Joe Smith in the second unit matchup?

A FIRED UP 85% HEALTH CELTIC TEAM CAN BEAT THESE GUYS.


I believe that the CAVS are eerily similar to us last year. Remember that they didn't have a completely healthy Z last year and he is a very under rated player. Mo Williams was a big pickup. Most importantly though they play the hungry ferocious defense that we did last year. When was the last time you saw us come out with the defensive intensity in the first and third quarters like we used to? We used to win games in the first and third. Now we almost always are playing from behind because we can't come out focused. Even against bad teams. Say what you will, but there is no question they don't have the same level of hunger as they did last year. If you think they can just flip a switch in the EC finals you are sadly mistaken. You can't flip switches against teams that are as good or better than you are.



Edited for same reasons you point.
keep the conversation clean both and not continue on that fan status thing
Edgar


And in personal thinking
Isnt that what Atlanta does against us last year and almost beat us
ANY team can have 4 games of glory
Ask Golden State

Come on! You don't really expect us to believe that you think the CAVS are even remotely in the same league as Atlanta or Golden State?! If you are referring to us, then I am even more depressed...

This days with the simptoms of jumping off the ship we have around
yes I am refering to us
We are as good as any team in this league

If we are 100% healthy then I'd agree that we are right there. We aren't as good as last year though. I sure haven't been jumping on and off the bandwagon though because I was am the OP from 4 months ago and have been concerned about our depth. Look at these positions as objectively as you can and tell me we are the best:

      Boston           CAVS              Lakers
PG - Rondo          Williams        Fisher    - us and the Cavs are slightly ahead of LA
SG - Allen             West              Kobe    - LA in a landslide
SF - Pierce             Lebron         ?            - Cavs by a pretty good margin
PF - KG                 Varaejo          Gasol   - Gasols has stats and health. KG is better though
C - Perk                Big Z              Bynum - Probably a wash

Key Backups: Bos - BBD, POWE, House, Marbury
                         Cle - Gibson, Wally, Wallace, Joe Smith
                         LA - Ariza, Walton, Farmar, Powell

If you are talking starters, then the only one that we are arguably better at is at PF. With him not being 100% then that gives the edge IMO to LA and Gasol. The 2 best players on that list are not Celtics. As far as benches go we are talented, but small. The size is what hurts us otherwise I would say we are the best of the group, however Cleveland does have 3 former all-stars and one heck of a shooter in Gibson.

This is my rationale behind my worry. I am not going to put on blinders and pretend we are better than we are.



Good analysis, and a reasonable basis to be concerned. We aren't as good as we were last year, Cleveland is markedly better, despite all the blind Celtics allegiance you read in this thread. TP for your objectivity in a thread decidedly short of same.




right, because if you root for and believe in your team instead of getting down on your knees and slurping lebron and Kobe while discounting out own team, your clearly a "homer" who doesn't deserve to have your opinion respected due to your "blinders" and inability to be objective.

this is why i hate threads like this, any positive opinion brought up is decried as "homerism" while the "objective" posters who want to hammer home why we have no shot in hell congratulate themselves on being the only smart fans who figured out other teams are really good in the NBA.

Me, i'll back our boys till we get eliminated thanks, I understand that CLEV and LA are great teams, but so are we IMO, and i'll be staying out of these types of threads where saying so gets you labeled as a green kool aid drinking homer, its not worth my time.



“I will hurt you for this. A day will come when you think you’re safe and happy and your joy will turn to ashes in your mouth. And you will know the debt is paid.” – Tyrion

Re: You just saw the 2009 NBA Champions
« Reply #115 on: April 13, 2009, 08:07:55 AM »

Offline CoachBo

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Whatever.

I don't recall "must forfeit objectivity" as a requirement for being a fan. EJ's post is objective, and worthy of note for what I believe is a realistic assessment of the matchups the future may bring. The Lakers and Cavs are pretty good, whether anyone on this board wants to admit it or not.

I don't recall him, or anyone else in this thread, saying the Celtics are going to lose. God bless anyone on this board who truly believes that this team can just flip a switch and start playing championship basketball in the playoffs. I hope they're proven right.

Sunday was an opportunity to go into Cleveland short-handed and send the Cavs a message. The message we sent apparently was funny, based on the reaction of their bench. Not good. Not good at all.
« Last Edit: April 13, 2009, 08:14:57 AM by CoachBo »
Coined the CelticsBlog term, "Euromistake."

Re: You just saw the 2009 NBA Champions
« Reply #116 on: April 13, 2009, 08:19:33 AM »

Offline BballTim

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Whatever.

I don't recall "must forfeit objectivity" as a requirement for being a fan. EJ's post is objective, and worthy of note for what I believe is a realistic assessment of the matchups the future may bring. The Lakers and Cavs are pretty good, whether anyone on this board wants to admit it or not.

  He seems to be matching our starters against a combination of the Cavs and Lakers starters. Ray's advantage over Delonte is canceled out by Kobe, Rondo's advantage over Fisher is canceled out by Williams, KG's advantage over Varajao is canceled out by Gasol.

Re: You just saw the 2009 NBA Champions
« Reply #117 on: April 13, 2009, 08:29:51 AM »

Offline Carhole

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The Cleveland Cavs are playing the physical style of play that we beat everyone with last year and seemed to have lost somehow along the way. Add the fact that they have the single most difficult player to stop in Lebron and the pickup of Mo Williams and they have the offense to go along with it. Lebron is like a PP on steroids... PP isn't even in his league anymore.

I think we will unfortunately look back in a couple years and be glad we put the banner up when we did. If we don't make a drastic change in either our teams components or our heart we are done. We can't beat Cleveland in 7. That's not over reaction or sour grapes, that is fact.

That is both over reaction and sour grapes. And I am not going to promise victory over the Cavs if healthy. But I will say we have a very legit shot.

first, the components will change with adding KG and Powe who is our best interior scorer at the 4. Those are two pretty big additions if healthy add to that the fact the Cavs just got waxed worse then this on the road in orlando - but now the fact that it happened to the celtics guarantees the Cavs champs? Shouldnt the lost last week have guaranteed they were not going to be?

Secondly - saying this team needs a drastic change in heart sure sounds like sour grapes. Who are any of us to question a teams heart that won a title, has really only been blown out of maybe 4 games in two full years? Saying they laid an egg is one thing, for someone on this or any board to say the team is lacking heart is ridiculous and really the height of arrogance.

With the HCA ina 7 game serioius, I feel like the C's have a 40% chance of taking it, and I have no doubt they are going to leave it out on the court - this team has never given me any reason to question their heart. I wish they were better but I will take those chances


Re: You just saw the 2009 NBA Champions
« Reply #118 on: April 13, 2009, 08:36:57 AM »

Offline celticinorlando

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this is why you play the games...60 percent of teams that have had homecourt throughout the playoffs have not won the title....ask dallas vs miami...cleveland good ? sure they are...has boston played their best basketball yet? no way.....will KG and powe help...yeah i wager they will...i am going to go ahead and say boston wins game one or two in cleveland....just a hunch....

Re: You just saw the 2009 NBA Champions
« Reply #119 on: April 13, 2009, 08:52:05 AM »

Offline MMacOH

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If we are 100% healthy then I'd agree that we are right there. We aren't as good as last year though. I sure haven't been jumping on and off the bandwagon though because I was am the OP from 4 months ago and have been concerned about our depth. Look at these positions as objectively as you can and tell me we are the best:

      Boston           CAVS              Lakers
PG - Rondo          Williams        Fisher    - us and the Cavs are slightly ahead of LA
SG - Allen             West              Kobe    - LA in a landslide
SF - Pierce             Lebron         ?            - Cavs by a pretty good margin
PF - KG                 Varaejo          Gasol   - Gasols has stats and health. KG is better though
C - Perk                Big Z              Bynum - Probably a wash

Key Backups: Bos - BBD, POWE, House, Marbury
                         Cle - Gibson, Wally, Wallace, Joe Smith
                         LA - Ariza, Walton, Farmar, Powell

If you are talking starters, then the only one that we are arguably better at is at PF. With him not being 100% then that gives the edge IMO to LA and Gasol. The 2 best players on that list are not Celtics. As far as benches go we are talented, but small. The size is what hurts us otherwise I would say we are the best of the group, however Cleveland does have 3 former all-stars and one heck of a shooter in Gibson.

This is my rationale behind my worry. I am not going to put on blinders and pretend we are better than we are.


  We're not playing both teams at once. Cleveland's clearly better than us at one spot and we're definitely better than them at 2 spots. Same with the Lakers, and that's if you don't consider us better at pf.

What is the second spot where Boston is definitely better?  I am just waiting for you to say PG
« Last Edit: April 13, 2009, 09:08:28 AM by MMacOH »