Author Topic: Championship repeat chances looking great  (Read 10649 times)

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Re: Championship repeat chances looking great
« Reply #15 on: July 23, 2008, 01:04:43 PM »

Offline Roy Hobbs

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Celtics might have got a little worst by losing posey but on the other hand i see guys like perk and rondo improving from last year so they will be a little better. Our core team is still here

Inversely, of course, the "big three" is a year older, so a slight decline can be anticipated.

there are many predictions we could make and we'll never know if they're correct or not. a counter to your arguement is that the big 3 have a full year of playing together, so they're more use to the style, and fluidity of each other. as many said to start the season, experts didn't pick the celtics to win this year but rather next year after a full year together.

my point is, the argument could go on forever.

I absolutely agree with that.  I was just pointing out the problem in relying upon the "our young players are a year older" argument.  Sure they are.  So are our old players.

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Re: Championship repeat chances looking great
« Reply #16 on: July 23, 2008, 01:07:28 PM »

Offline wdleehi

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Celtics are still the team to beat. 



They have some holes on the bench that can (and will) be plugged. 

Re: Championship repeat chances looking great
« Reply #17 on: July 23, 2008, 01:32:53 PM »

Offline zerophase

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Celtics are still the team to beat. 



They have some holes on the bench that can (and will) be plugged. 

any time a team is coming off of a championship season, they're the team to beat. it's just that this year, beating san antonio was easier than expected (as least for la, not for new orleans). mind you that they were at the top of the western conference for a while there during the season.

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Re: Championship repeat chances looking great
« Reply #18 on: July 23, 2008, 01:41:36 PM »

Offline Mr October

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Celtics might have got a little worst by losing posey but on the other hand i see guys like perk and rondo improving from last year so they will be a little better. Our core team is still here

Inversely, of course, the "big three" is a year older, so a slight decline can be anticipated.

there are many predictions we could make and we'll never know if they're correct or not. a counter to your arguement is that the big 3 have a full year of playing together, so they're more use to the style, and fluidity of each other. as many said to start the season, experts didn't pick the celtics to win this year but rather next year after a full year together.

my point is, the argument could go on forever.

I highly buy into this arguement. And I'll extend it to Rondo, Perkins, House, Powe, Davis and TA. This teams knows how to close the door on teams now. They have been clutch tested on the ultimate stage.

As a team I expect them to look a heck of a lot smoother/cohesive... expecially in the 4th quarter.

Now 66 wins is a tough mark to repeat. I think somewhere in the 56-63 range is expected. And this is the team to beat.

Re: Championship repeat chances looking great
« Reply #19 on: July 23, 2008, 01:58:03 PM »

Offline td450

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Next years success for us will be largely determined by the team's health at playoff time. If everyone is healthy then, they should be a better team than last year.

Re: Championship repeat chances looking great
« Reply #20 on: July 23, 2008, 02:10:44 PM »

Offline Triboy16

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The big three will need a slightly more reEdited.  Profanity and masked profanity are against forum rules and may result in discipline.l season. We got to utilize everyone else more. This is where docs coaching or there lackoff will come in

I also don't anticipate a 66 game win repeat but having the best record definitely something we have to accomplish again(my prediction 55 to 60 wins)

the bench consisting of powe, davis, house, t. allen, puitt, obryant, giddens at least 3 or 4 of these guys will need to play consistantly over 10 mins per game. If we can limit the big three to play 30 to a max of 35 min each we should be good

Re: Championship repeat chances looking great
« Reply #21 on: July 23, 2008, 02:51:37 PM »

Offline paintitgreen

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I'm with the OP and wdleehi, the Celtics are still the team to beat. Some teams have improved, but nobody to the point of looking superior to the Celtics. And the East is what we need to worry about not because it's better, but because we will play a maximum of 1 Western team in the playoffs. Why worry about how we match up with the Lakers when we may be matching up with the Hornets, Jazz, Spurs, or even Suns or Rockets, if we make it to the Finals? We have to beat 3 Eastern teams to get there.

It's really early, but here are my current thoughts.

Celtics - I'm really bummed about losing Posey, but I have a lot of hope for us being able to pick up the pieces. I think Rondo and Perk both build on their improvements from last year and become recognized nationally as defensive studs. I also think both improve their offensive games a bit. While KG, Pierce and Allen will all be older, I think they actually play better together with a year and a title under their belts. I think Allen particularly will have a better season now that he's becoming more accustomed to a catch and shoot type game (instead of shooting off the dribble as he had done his entire career). And I think our bench is weakened but still good enough to keep us on top of the East with more than 60 wins.

Pistons - will be good, but barring a move, I don't see this team continuing its ECF trend. I just think, frankly, the Celtics, Cavs, Sixers and probably the Magic and Wizards are all better than them. Best case scenario for them is they finish 2nd or 3rd and Cleveland and Philly finish 4th and 5th. Then they could probably make their way back to the ECF, but I cannot see them beating Boston, Cleveland or Philly at all. I think they finish third with about 50-52 wins.

Magic - still a very good team, though I think they have weaknesses (no power forward or real shooting guard) that will be exploited more this year. I think losing Dooling and Evans will hurt them quite a bit, though I like the Pietrus signing to make up for much of it. And while I thought Turkoglu should have been an ALl Star this year, I don't think he will be as good this year. I think they drop down a bit to the 4th seed, maybe the 6th if Washington comes together. 45-50 wins

Cavs - probably a little improved with Gibson healthy and Lebron matured for another year. Hopefully for Cleveland's sake he works a lot on outside shooting with Team USA this summer. I think they'll be the two seed in the East next year with 52-55 wins.

But I think the thing that could make them an even tougher contender for the Celtics is their flexibility around the trade deadline. They have something like $30 million in expiring contracts this year (Wally $13, Snow $7.3, Joe Smith $4.8, Damon Jones $4.45, maybe Delonte $2.75 if he signs the qualifying offer - he may be trade bait if they want Gibson more than him). Depending on who becomes available, Cleveland is in the best position to go get a star from a bad team, if one is available.

For example, Denver appears to be throwing in the towel. What if Cleveland sent expiring contracts constituting about 80% of AI's salary (Wally and Damon Jones), their first rounder this year, Hickson, and a draft pick for Iverson? Heck, they could include Ben Wallace, who expires in 2010, and take on Kenyon Martin, who has a player option for $16.5 million in 2010-11, as a financial bonus for Denver (and maybe hold onto Hickson). Ben Wallace, Wally, Damon Jones, and 2 picks for Iverson and Martin probably works for both teams.

Denver focuses on building around Carmelo long term without spending quite as much money in the short term on a non-contender. They'd save about $23 million on the deal ($5 mil this year, $1.5 mil next year, $16.5 mil in 2010-11). Getting rid of Martin would mean they only have about $28.5 million in salary committed in 2010-11, so with close to $30 million in cap space (subtracting some rookie contracts, an extension for JR Smith, and minimum salaries for empty roster spots, probably more like $22-24 mil) they might be able to lure a big free agent to join their core of Anthony, Smith and Nene.

Cleveland ends up with a lineup of Iverson-West-Lebron-Martin-Z and a bench of Gibson, Pavlovic, Hickson, Smith and Varejao, and still has about $12 million in expiring contracts plus Hickson and West to go after a bigger 2 guard with another trade to start alongside Iverson. Maybe the Iverson thing doesn't work out great, but it gives Lebron a legitimate, secondary threat and maybe appeases him enough to look at staying. Plus, Cleveland still has only about $38 million committed to 2010-11 (that includes Lebron), so they can potentially try to attract a bigger name to join James that year if Iverson really doesn't work out.


Wizards - they're the same team they've always been. As usual, if they stay healthy, they're dangerous. But Jamison just had a career year and is in his 30s now, and I HATE signing Arenas for that much - I thought they were better without him there. They could win the South, and have given the Celtics trouble, so they would still be a dangerous 4th or 5th team. I think they finish 6th, though, and I think they'd have a legitimate chance at knocking off the Pistons in the first round. 42-46 wins.

Raptors - I don't know what to expect. I don't think O'Neal will add a ton, but I don't think they gave up anything substantial, or more appropriately, necessary, to get him. I'm not the biggest Bosh fan in the world, but I like Calderon and I think Bargnani will be better than last year with a little less pressure having a current and former All Star ahead of him. They might be able to move up to the 5th seed, but I think they actually will slide to 7th or 8th. I just don't think they're very good. 40-42 wins.

Sixers - good but still inconsistent. No outside shooting threat as of now, Brand is excellent but I'm okay with having KG on him. Their other scoring threat is Iguodala, who the Pistons showed can be completely neutralized. I think they're a couple years (which may not be possible if Miller takes off) and a couple players away. Still, I'm a big fan of Brand, and I think if he stays healthy, they finish 5th and may knock off the Magic in the first round, depending on how Hedo and Lewis are shooting. But I think the Celtics would work them over fairly easily. 44-48 wins.

Hawks - a lot depends on what happens with Josh Smith, but I really don't see them being much better than last year, and it may take more wins to get to the playoffs this time around. I think losing Childress and the uncertainty surrounding Smith will undo all positive vibes they had going at the end of last season. The loss of Childress will expose their horrible bench as well as Smith's inconsistency and Marvin Williams' inconsistency and overall subpar play. And I think Bibby is essentially done. If they don't resolve the Smith situation, I don't see them making the playoffs, and they may not make it at all. 35-40 wins.

Others - the Bulls and Heat could improve in a hurry. With Deng, Gordon and Gooden playing for contracts and Hinrich playing to redeem his reputation, if Rose, Noah and Thomas can develop quickly enough, Chicago could easily make the playoffs. I mean, they were a second round team just two years ago. The Heat have PG and C problems, but Wade can be good enough to carry a team to the playoffs, especially with Marion playing for a contract and Beasley stepping in. The Bucks and Pacers also have an outside shot at cracking the playoffs since they both made what I consider good moves in the offseason.

I'd probably guess Chicago makes the playoffs as the 7th seed and Toronto drops to eighth. I think in the first round, Boston beats Toronto, Cleveland beats Chicago, Washington upsets Detroit, and Philly beats Orlando. I think we take Philly and Cleveland once again beats Washington, setting us up for an ECF showdown with the Cavs. Because I think Cleveland will make some type of huge move at the trade deadline, I just can't say how I see it shaking out. But if the rosters stay as they are now, I think we take it again.  
Go Celtics.

Re: Championship repeat chances looking great
« Reply #22 on: July 23, 2008, 08:47:39 PM »

Offline Triboy16

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this is how i rank the top 5 teams in each conference

east
1. celtics
2. cavs
3. pistons
4. wizards
5. philly

Toronto and Orlando close by after

west
1. Lakers
2. New Orleans
3. Spurs
4. Utah
5. Clippers

Teams i wouldn't like to face are washington and new orleans


Re: Championship repeat chances looking great
« Reply #23 on: July 23, 2008, 09:13:11 PM »

Offline jaketwice

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I too think we could repeat. My concern is whether we can play with the intensity we had last year. We'll just have to see.

As far as contenders and pretenders, I'd put the Sixers (with Iggy) as contenders, along with the Cavs (only because of LeBron).  Also, I am going out on a limb and picking Toronto to have a great club.  There are a lot of questions with the team (Jermaine O'Neil, a center named "Andrea" and the defensive intensity of a paper bag in a wind storm). But if they can answer those questions, Toronto could be great.

I'll pick Detroit as a pretemder(with the morale destroying off-season comments and coach-firing); also Chicago to look stupid for picking Rose under new head coach Vinnie Del Negro, whose inability to resolve the point guard controversy should cause problems, and for Dwight Howard to become even more of a leader in Orlando, who I think will be contenders.

I also predict the West is not going to be as good...

Re: Championship repeat chances looking great
« Reply #24 on: July 23, 2008, 09:24:29 PM »

Offline bdm860

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this is how i rank the top 5 teams in each conference

east
1. celtics
2. cavs
3. pistons
4. wizards
5. philly

Toronto and Orlando close by after

west
1. Lakers
2. New Orleans
3. Spurs
4. Utah
5. Clippers

Teams i wouldn't like to face are washington and new orleans



Hey Triboy, I'm kinda wondering about your picks.  Top 4 in both conferences make sense to me, but I'm really baffeled by your #5 picks in both conferences. 

Clippers #5? They added Baron and Camby, but lost Brand and Maggette, sounds like a wash to me (not completely, but that's another argument), you really think they are gonna go from 23 wins to 50+? (I'm just assuming they'd have to win 50+ to be considered a top 5 threat in the West).  I just don't see it, but then again I haven't watched alot of Clipper ball and haven't been paying much attention to them so maybe I'm just missing something.  I know they had injuries, but then are you really expecting Camby and Davis, two guys who have been notoriously injury prone throughout their careers, to stay healthy?

And you're more scared of Philly than Orlando?  I guess I'm not really baffled by the Philly pick though, just really disagree with that one.  I'm way more scared of Orlando.  Dwight Howard may be the most unstopable player after Lebron and Kobe, I could even see him being more dominant then either next year or soon thereafter, Howard is just a beast.  Philly doesn't scare me at all, I like Brand, but I just don't think he puts any team (short of an already stacked team) over the top.  I'm scared of Orlando because 2 quick fouls by Perk and we're really in trouble, plus with their ability to hit the 3 with guys like Rashard and Turk , that's a pretty tough inside-outside threat.  Of their 4 returing startes, 3 of them averaged 40% or better from behind the arc, the other being Howard.  Their core is back and is only getting better or at least isn't declining yet (unlike stars on the C's, Piston's, Sun's, Spurs, etc who are on the decline).  Add in JJ Redick and I think you can see why I'm concerned.  (Ok that last line is a joke, I'm serious about the other stuff though).
« Last Edit: July 23, 2008, 09:31:02 PM by bdm860 »

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Re: Championship repeat chances looking great
« Reply #25 on: July 23, 2008, 09:27:47 PM »

Offline KCattheStripe

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Until Detroit blows everything up they are always going to be contending with their 4 guys as well as Jason Maxiell and Stuckey.


Their 4 guys? did one of their starting five die?

Re: Championship repeat chances looking great
« Reply #26 on: July 23, 2008, 09:28:46 PM »

Offline sns0274

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One thing that I think works to our advantage is the fact that none of the Big 3 really had a stellar year. While they were all solid, none of them had a great year and statistically speaking, they all had lower than average years. I am not sure that I can see that happening again and would almost be willing to bet, that after a season of playing together at least one of them has a better than average year statistically.

I see everyone noting that Cleveland was our toughest test and that is difficult to argue, but the fact is, the C's were still learning playoff basketball at that point. After they learned that lesson, they made short work of Detroit and LA. add to that the fact that Rondo and Perk now have 26 games of playoff experience and I think we are good to go, but hey, that's me.
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Re: Championship repeat chances looking great
« Reply #27 on: July 23, 2008, 09:34:16 PM »

Offline jay_jay54

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I think we can repeat,but thought the first issue DA would have addressed,our backup center position.With no disrespect to Perk, he only plays approx.25 min.a game.Even though he got us through the season,we always needed another center(imo ).We need someone at the Center position next season,who can possible carry 25 minutes at a high level of play.Maybe Perk's minutes will increase this season,but (imo) the backup center position  should have been as much a priority as the backup sf position.I know its not over till its over,but the pickings are slim.O'Bryant  is not the answer yet to be Perk's backup only.

Re: Championship repeat chances looking great
« Reply #28 on: July 23, 2008, 09:35:58 PM »

Offline Shaqzilla

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I just hope Rajon Rondo has the ball in his hands more. When he does the Big 3 can't be double teamed. He has the quickness to get anywhere on the court. I think Game 6 of the NBA Finals was a preview of what he's going to do next year!

I also think KG loses a lot of his anxiety and stress now that he knows he can win it all.

Re: Championship repeat chances looking great
« Reply #29 on: July 23, 2008, 10:50:42 PM »

Offline fairweatherfan06

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Philly, Toronto, Indiana, Milwaukee, Miami are all better teams not "threats" but they are better.  And Washington, Detroit, Cleveland are in holding patterns (though Detroit might get more interesting if they get Artest). Washington beat us 3 times last year, and we barely beat Cleveland (who will have another year with this new group) in a series.  All this is to say the East WILL be tougher and (as of now ) we are Posey-less and our bench is weaker because of it.  Do I think the Celtics are the best team in the East, yes, do I think we have the run away we did last year NO.  I think we'll be a weaker regular season team but a better playoff team, but getting out of the East and homecourt will come much harder next season. 

HOWEVER I do get the feeling a trade is coming (before training camp) which may make things look different.