Vin Baker: A sad story

[Birdbrain]

Sorry I'll save my sympathy for Children born with Aids or Cancer.  I say that having family members fall prey to the some of the same issues.

Feeling sad for a millionaire that can't put the bottle down is pretty low on my list of things to be concerned about. 

I have room in my heart for all of the above........and then some.

TP for you.  Can't argue with that.

[Birdbrain]

Sorry I'll save my sympathy for Children born with Aids or Cancer.  I say that having family members fall prey to the some of the same issues.

Feeling sad for a millionaire that can't put the bottle down is pretty low on my list of things to be concerned about. 

Birdbrain (awesome name btw) I totally get where you're coming from. I have empathy with Baker because I've had a similar situation, but I know what a hard thing it is to be related to someone with these kinds of problems. I just hope Baker is able to find some kind of success in recovery.

I'm glad you didn't take that the wrong way. Believe me I'm no Saint but, I just have a hard time trying to understand how a person with so many resources at his disposal couldn't get help. 

[bbc3341]

Sorry I'll save my sympathy for Children born with Aids or Cancer.  I say that having family members fall prey to the some of the same issues.

Feeling sad for a millionaire that can't put the bottle down is pretty low on my list of things to be concerned about. 

Birdbrain (awesome name btw) I totally get where you're coming from. I have empathy with Baker because I've had a similar situation, but I know what a hard thing it is to be related to someone with these kinds of problems. I just hope Baker is able to find some kind of success in recovery.

I'm glad you didn't take that the wrong way. Believe me I'm no Saint but, I just have a hard time trying to understand how a person with so many resources at his disposal couldn't get help. 

I get where you're coming from, and I find myself at times falling into the "hey, if I could do it, why can't he/she/they" and I have to step back and remember that it took me a while to see the light as well!

[iowa plowboy]

Absolute zero sympathy.  Zero.  Ain't a disease.  It's a decision.  I rarely agree with Birdbrain.  But his on this subject his was a solid post.  I take care of my dad who squandered his life the same way.  It has hardened me where this is concerned.  At some point, you have to make the decision to do right by your loved ones and yourself.

Agree with Roy.  Baker is still a young, famous, well spoken, and likable man.  Hopefully he gets it together.

[celticmaestro]

i've just read the piece on len bias and then i see "Vin Baker: A sad story" and i just laugh. sad? no. stupid? bingo. len bias's story was and still is a genuinely sad and tragic story. vin bakers? the story of someone who didn't learn from anyone else's mistakes and made a personal choice to continue to do what he did.

i know/knew people with similar problems, and unless they show/showed signs of change they get/got no sympathy from me and i refuse to call it a sad story.

sorry if i've offended anyone.

[Roy Hobbs]

i've just read the piece on len bias and then i see "Vin Baker: A sad story" and i just laugh. sad? no. stupid? bingo. len bias's story was and still is a genuinely sad and tragic story. vin bakers? the story of someone who didn't learn from anyone else's mistakes and made a personal choice to continue to do what he did.

Devil's advocate here (since I know we're on metaphorically hallowed ground) but was Bias' any sadder?  Reading that article, it seems that Bias wasn't the one-time coke user that you hear so often.  Instead, he may have been a heavy user that got his friends onto it, as well.  He certainly didn't deserve to die, but if Baker's problems are self-created, so were Bias'.

[celticmaestro]

i've just read the piece on len bias and then i see "Vin Baker: A sad story" and i just laugh. sad? no. stupid? bingo. len bias's story was and still is a genuinely sad and tragic story. vin bakers? the story of someone who didn't learn from anyone else's mistakes and made a personal choice to continue to do what he did.

Devil's advocate here (since I know we're on metaphorically hallowed ground) but was Bias' any sadder?  Reading that article, it seems that Bias wasn't the one-time coke user that you hear so often.  Instead, he may have been a heavy user that got his friends onto it, as well.  He certainly didn't deserve to die, but if Baker's problems are self-created, so were Bias'.

bias's story is more tragic in the sense that it had an impact on so many others. i agree to an extent that they're both self-inflicted problems, but bias didn't have the means baker did to kick his alleged habit. he was young, perhaps immature (i don't know enough about him to say whether he was mature or not) and clearly in with the wrong crowd. baker is older, should be wiser and should be able to see what addictions have done to others (bias included).

[hwangjini_1]

i wish him luck. what he is plagued by is a lot more complex than simply making a choice. it kills millions and destroys millions of lives because it is impossible to "overcome."

you only hope to keep it a bay.

[gpds69]

can anyone explain his Celtics story to me? I really cant remember. He was traded here then got hurt in the middle of the season or did he check into rehab? Then the  next season started off strong then started to slow off and we suspended him? i really don't remember. Someone tell me the actual sorry.

[bbc3341]

Absolute zero sympathy.  Zero.  Ain't a disease.  It's a decision.  I rarely agree with Birdbrain.  But his on this subject his was a solid post.  I take care of my dad who squandered his life the same way.  It has hardened me where this is concerned.  At some point, you have to make the decision to do right by your loved ones and yourself.

Agree with Roy.  Baker is still a young, famous, well spoken, and likable man.  Hopefully he gets it together.

I have total sympathy for your point of view and am sorry for the situation you're in. I hope you're able to find some peace.

[bbc3341]

i've just read the piece on len bias and then i see "Vin Baker: A sad story" and i just laugh. sad? no. stupid? bingo. len bias's story was and still is a genuinely sad and tragic story. vin bakers? the story of someone who didn't learn from anyone else's mistakes and made a personal choice to continue to do what he did.

i know/knew people with similar problems, and unless they show/showed signs of change they get/got no sympathy from me and i refuse to call it a sad story.

sorry if i've offended anyone.

I have no problem with your feelings. Once someone is made aware of the problem (as Baker was by the Celtics, whom I believe thought they were helping him by suspending him), it is their decision whether or not they seek treatment. Yours is a point of view consistent with "tough love" that many loved ones are forced into when faced with alcoholics.

[mustang]

Absolute zero sympathy.  Zero.  Ain't a disease.  It's a decision.  I rarely agree with Birdbrain.  But his on this subject his was a solid post.  I take care of my dad who squandered his life the same way.  It has hardened me where this is concerned.  At some point, you have to make the decision to do right by your loved ones and yourself.

Agree with Roy.  Baker is still a young, famous, well spoken, and likable man.  Hopefully he gets it together.

Tommy Point for you. Well said. Calling it a disease demeans people who actually suffer from diseases, and provides a nice soft emotional landing for addicts and enablers alike. It's a choice every time, one that admittedly gets progressively harder, but it never stops being a choice.

Having said that, I truly hope Vin gets it together.

[cordobes]

If the man likes to drink, what's the problem? It's his money, isn't it? It's not like he's in such bad company; great decision makers like Churchill and Ulysses S. Grant used to drink a lot, geniuses like Hemingway, Amis, Bacon, Beethoven, Burroughs or Poe always loved the booze and produced most of their legacy to mankind while drinking... I'm not assuming he's uncomfortable with his addiction just because he lost his house. Really sad was the way he played for us.

[Bahku]

Actually, it is a disease, and speaking as one whose family has been ravaged and all but destroyed by substance abuse, this problem will never improve in this country until intolerance and a lack of understanding is squelched once-and-for-all. Sorry, but I have no tolerance for intolerance, and it makes me cringe when I see people outraged over racial bias, who turn right around and exhibit the same kind of prejudice towards those with substance abuse problems, or any kind of addiction. That "holier-than-thou" attitude is one of the main reasons this problem is as bad as it is in the first place. I find it hard to fathom that praise is showered on people who have no sympathy for other humans in desperate need of help and understanding. That's the truly saddest part of this story. I pray there's someone in Vin's life who cares enough about him to help him find the answers he needs to turn his life around.

[TripleOT]

Vin Baker earned $90 million in his career, and $15 million the past four years.  If he's broke, he's the stupidest human being on the planet.

Note to future NBA multimillionaires -  disregard the advice from your money people (who happen to make commissions on your investments) and pay cash for your homes when you're pulling down $60+ million for your career.  Buy just two or three of them, since property taxes, upkeep, staff, utilities, etc are a bit-ch.  Then put money aside in a safe investment vehicle to run these houses for 40 years or so.  Each $4 million house is going to cost at least $150,000 a year in property taxes, insurance, upkeep, etc.  Put $10 million aside at a 5% return and you're all set.  Between buying and the annuity for taking care of the three mansions for that's about $25 million, so you need to make about $45 million before taxes to pay for that. 

Put another $10 million in a safe investment, again generating 5%, and you have $40,000 a month in spending money.  With the other $30 million+ you make, invest it in higher risk, higher reward vehicles. 

Any investment pro who works with high worth individuals would say the above scenario is stupid, but a lot of these athletes are like lottery winners, with the added zinger that when their career ends, the thrill seeking starts.  Plus, these aren't ordinary investors, with the child support, crazy cars, jewelry, clothes, etc. The smart move for the undisciplined NBA superstar is to set themselves up with a foolproof plan, even if the returns are lousy, so they don't end up schlepping around Europe when they're broke, like Kenny Anderson ($63 Million in career earnings, now broke).     

Last piece of advice -- Don't ever own a restaurant.