Sam Cassell wants to come back; how does that effect House? (merged)

[BballTim]

Those guys wouldent contribute as much as Sam because none of them besides Brent Barry have won a championship or have significant playoff experience.    Pargo in particular looked awful down the stretch for the hornets this year.  Barry being the only one with a championship averaged 5 points, 1 rebound, and one assist during the playoffs.  Not very good if you ask me. 

  None of our starters had won a championship before this year, and they all managed to contribute in the playoffs. We'll be looking for 10 minutes a game behind Rondo, and defensive contributions will be as important as offensive contributions.

[crownsy]

what exactly, pray tell, did sam's playoff experiance net us? one decent game in clevland off the bench? weeeee!!!!



he went on a prolonged slump, and got benched for his defense in not one, but two  series. By the finals he was getting DNP's for eddie house, the man who's job he was supposed to take for the playoffs, and i thought would be the liablity. instead eddie proved a decisive asset in 2 playoff series, providing big time bench preformances in games 5 and 7 in clevland, and games 2,4, and 6 in the finals.

playoff experiance is all well and good, but he utterly failed to cash in on it, so in the end what did it net us? a (i belive, nba.com blocked at work) 0-17 stretch that ended him up at 3-32 at one point. sweet.

he got benched in clevland for poor defense, played a bit in detroit, and got benched again in the finals for horrid defense.

so, in my book, him and pargo pretty much evened out dont you think? neither did anything significant past the 1st round, and both shot the ball horrable and played bad defense.

[Rondo2287]

what exactly, pray tell, did sam's playoff experiance net us? one decent game in clevland off the bench? weeeee!!!!

Please look at his actual numbers because you are making yourself look stupid by saying that. 

[bbc3341]

In game 1 of the finals, Cassell had a good stretch in the 1st half that helped us stay in the game... if I recall, he did that a couple of times, just came in a hit 2 or 3 jumpers that kept it close or put us ahead...

[Birdbrain]

Hopefully none.  Sam ain't coming back unless he's playing assistant coach next year.

[2short]

Shake his hand, tell him thanks call George Karl and tell him his player/assistant coach is ready.
My thought was he was signed to spell Rondo against Detroit (only).
please no

[crownsy]

Please look at his actual numbers because you are making yourself look stupid by saying that.

ok, im home lets see how stupid i looked.

http://www.nba.com/playerfile/sam_cassell/index.html?nav=page

round 1:

his only marginally redeemable series overall. shot a decent percentage (41%) didn't turn the ball over. had a pretty good assist average for his minutes.

I already mentioned he was fine in this series, lets go to the series i said he was bad to awful in and see if i do indeed look stupid.

Round 2:

shot incredibly poorley, ending up at 23% on 6/29 shooting. had the one good game i mentioned in which he went 4-12, but provided good energy and had some assists in sparking a bench run that kept us in the game. overall, a decent series passing the ball, but not great. averaged almost a turnover per 5 minutes on the floor, and was benched for games 6 and 7 due to his inablity to stay in front of "boobie" gibson, a noted jumpshooter who took the opportunity to drive on sam. no defensive numbers, rebounds or steals, to speak of.

looks pretty forgettable to me. so far we are cashing in on that playoff experience son.

round 3:

another horrid series for sam i am. only played 4 games, due to ineffectiveness, shot a laughable 22.9 % on 3/14 shooting, and was used sparingly as his TO's jumped through the roof against full court pressure (which is what we got him for btw, to take that weakness away with eddie in the game) to 1.25 in extermly limited minutes. yanked after giving up a steal to hunter under his own basket.

again, im really looking foolish here. clearly this guy was the rock that held our backup PG position together.

Finals:

mabey this is the round im going to look stupid in, lets take a look.

shot a decent percentage, but still couldn't crack 40% . ended ay 37% in limited minutes due to the back up PG spot being given back to eddie. played ok in the loss on june 15th, his only real significant minutes, shooting by far his best night since atlanta, going 4-8 from the field. did pass the ball better as tim pointed out, pushing his average assists to 1.4


where do i "look stupid" again?

to recap

round 1: decent
round 2: trash except game 2
round 3: utter trash
finals: marginalized  as the 3rd gaurd off the bench

your right, i totally overlooked his contributions. how can we afford to risk upgrading this spot, i mean, with another full season of wear and tear by next years playoffs, how can we not snap up this guys playoff "experience".

its a huge effort to replace a 39 year old gaurd that shot 30% for the playoffs and stunk up the joint in 2 series, playing ok in a third. where are we going to replace that kind of production?

[12417]

To analyze the stats of Cassell to determine 'his' value to the team is missing the point. Its the same with KG raising the intensity of the whole team by osmosis. Cassell has a presence or charisma of extreme confidence that elevates other players around him. This is especially important for players like Rondo and Pruitt who have raw talent and need to develop the confidence in their games to let it shine. Cassell brings an intangible that can't be appreciated by disecting a stat sheet.

http://www.boston.com/sports/basketball/celtics/articles/2008/02/27/true_value_think_hardware/

[EJPLAYA]

Please look at his actual numbers because you are making yourself look stupid by saying that.

ok, im home lets see how stupid i looked.

http://www.nba.com/playerfile/sam_cassell/index.html?nav=page

round 1:

his only marginally redeemable series overall. shot a decent percentage (41%) didn't turn the ball over. had a pretty good assist average for his minutes.

I already mentioned he was fine in this series, lets go to the series i said he was bad to awful in and see if i do indeed look stupid.

Round 2:

shot incredibly poorley, ending up at 23% on 6/29 shooting. had the one good game i mentioned in which he went 4-12, but provided good energy and had some assists in sparking a bench run that kept us in the game. overall, a decent series passing the ball, but not great. averaged almost a turnover per 5 minutes on the floor, and was benched for games 6 and 7 due to his inablity to stay in front of "boobie" gibson, a noted jumpshooter who took the opportunity to drive on sam. no defensive numbers, rebounds or steals, to speak of.

looks pretty forgettable to me. so far we are cashing in on that playoff experience son.

round 3:

another horrid series for sam i am. only played 4 games, due to ineffectiveness, shot a laughable 22.9 % on 3/14 shooting, and was used sparingly as his TO's jumped through the roof against full court pressure (which is what we got him for btw, to take that weakness away with eddie in the game) to 1.25 in extermly limited minutes. yanked after giving up a steal to hunter under his own basket.

again, im really looking foolish here. clearly this guy was the rock that held our backup PG position together.

Finals:

mabey this is the round im going to look stupid in, lets take a look.

shot a decent percentage, but still couldn't crack 40% . ended ay 37% in limited minutes due to the back up PG spot being given back to eddie. played ok in the loss on june 15th, his only real significant minutes, shooting by far his best night since atlanta, going 4-8 from the field. did pass the ball better as tim pointed out, pushing his average assists to 1.4


where do i "look stupid" again?

to recap

round 1: decent
round 2: trash except game 2
round 3: utter trash
finals: marginalized  as the 3rd gaurd off the bench

your right, i totally overlooked his contributions. how can we afford to risk upgrading this spot, i mean, with another full season of wear and tear by next years playoffs, how can we not snap up this guys playoff "experience".

its a huge effort to replace a 39 year old gaurd that shot 30% for the playoffs and stunk up the joint in 2 series, playing ok in a third. where are we going to replace that kind of production?

TP to you Crownsy. Way to back up your comments with actual statistics and facts. Funny how Sam supporters try to look over the actual numbers and just try to babble on about his "experience" and his "ability to bring the ball up the floor under pressure".

How anyone can look at his production as a Celtic and think he was a success is beyond me... Time to fade away Selfish Sam...

[BrickJames]

how about game 5 of the finals where an offensive spurt triggered by SAM almost won us the game in LA?  where did that show up on the stat sheet?

remember when he came into the game, found ray in motion a couple of times...ran the pick and pop with KG, got under farmars skin and abused him, leaning in and drawing a foul and banking it off the glass?

i dont see "momentum changing plays" anyway on the stat sheet

[Mr October]

how about game 5 of the finals where an offensive spurt triggered by SAM almost won us the game in LA?  where did that show up on the stat sheet?

remember when he came into the game, found ray in motion a couple of times...ran the pick and pop with KG, got under farmars skin and abused him, leaning in and drawing a foul and banking it off the glass?

i dont see "momentum changing plays" anyway on the stat sheet

But for every good game, good shot, good momentum swing, there were about 3 bad ones. Not a good ratio. I'd rather take House over Cassell.

[NicaraguanFan]

Sam wants one more year back in NBA. It doesn't mean he will be with us.  If you ask I'd rather House than Cassell for my money.

NF.

[crownsy]

how about game 5 of the finals where an offensive spurt triggered by SAM almost won us the game in LA?  where did that show up on the stat sheet?

remember when he came into the game, found ray in motion a couple of times...ran the pick and pop with KG, got under farmars skin and abused him, leaning in and drawing a foul and banking it off the glass?

i dont see "momentum changing plays" anyway on the stat sheet

we lost that game if i recall.

also, i mentioned he had good games. but, as was just pointed out, for every good game, he was horrid in 2-3 others.

if i give you that loss as a good game, thats 3 games total, 4 if your generous, where he was effective. out of 21.

you can try the same tired "stats dont prove anything, you don't see the value" that we tried in the walker thread, but honestly, its quite foolish IMO. I presented the stats because rondo2287 said i was stupid and the stats didnt back up what i said my eyes saw. turns out they do.

[EJPLAYA]

how about game 5 of the finals where an offensive spurt triggered by SAM almost won us the game in LA?  where did that show up on the stat sheet?

remember when he came into the game, found ray in motion a couple of times...ran the pick and pop with KG, got under farmars skin and abused him, leaning in and drawing a foul and banking it off the glass?

i dont see "momentum changing plays" anyway on the stat sheet

Really?! He was ALMOST the difference in us winning a game?! Sign me up for that. How about if he ALMOST is a good PG again next year?! Maybe we can ALMOST repeat as champions...

[crownsy]

how about game 5 of the finals where an offensive spurt triggered by SAM almost won us the game in LA?  where did that show up on the stat sheet?

remember when he came into the game, found ray in motion a couple of times...ran the pick and pop with KG, got under farmars skin and abused him, leaning in and drawing a foul and banking it off the glass?

i dont see "momentum changing plays" anyway on the stat sheet

Really?! He was ALMOST the difference in us winning a game?! Sign me up for that. How about if he ALMOST is a good PG again next year?! Maybe we can ALMOST repeat as champions...

lol TP.

im all set with moral victories.