Can the Celtics Be Both Champs and Chokers?

[Redz]

Say what you will about this years Celtics but they are certainly unique.  This phenomenon of "choke wins" is just bizarre.  After a great win like last night there is still apprehension from blowing all but a point of a big lead and having to hold on for dear life for the win.  It's a fantastic win in a clutch game situation, but you would have to blind to not see the Celtics freezing up and letting the Pistons back in the game.  Once put to the ultimate test though, the Celts seem to do what it takes to win (free throws, clutch shot from Ray, defensive stops etc...). 

This has held true whether within an individual game or a series as a whole.  When the Celtics have lost their "pad" they have responded every time.   What happens when they play from behind late in a game has not been so great, and we have yet to see what happens when they have to play from behind in a series, but that's for another discussion (one we hopefully ever have to tackle).

We've seen the "choke win" happen throughout much of the playoffs, and to a higher degree, this series.  I'm a big "bottom line" kind of guy, and you can not argue with the overall results - the Celts are a game away from reaching the Finals, but you have to wonder if it is truly possible for a team to be a living, breathing oxymoron: Champs & Chokers.

So I beg the question; can we define the Celtics moments of "choking" within a game truly as "choking" if they win the game in the end?  It's one of the strangest things I've ever experienced as a fan. 

The Big Picture remains great and I stay focused on that.  I swear they're gonna make me nuts though (or more nuts than I already am    )

[Mr October]

Last night nearly killed me.... the decision making in the 4th was terrible... But I think a team chokes, if they give up the big lead AND loose the game.

The C's held on, time to move on. Just about every team lets up when they have a big lead, and then the other team makes a run.

[angryguy77]

A team that chokes wouldn't have made the big shots that it did at the end. But they do choke when they are behind in the 4th it seems.

[TheReaLPuba]

Unfortunately this team is too good to be trailing in most games so they don't have luxury to learn how to execute "come-back" wins.

But we did have a big time win in San Antonio against the Champs and with the defense that we play and 3 top notch All-Stars to boot....I like our chances no matter if we're ahead or down.

[Redz]

A team that chokes wouldn't have made the big shots that it did at the end. But they do choke when they are behind in the 4th it seems.

This is what I'm saying.  Do we have redefine what choking is for this team?  The successful chokers? 

They did have some clutch plays at the end last night, but were it not for choking they wouldn't have been in the position to be clutch.  See what I mean?

[Toine43]

The most suprising thing about last night's 4th quarter was how quickly the lead just evaporated. That's why I was legitimately scared that we were going to lose the gamw. It didn't even seem like the Pistons had to expend any to get back into the game. Ray gets hot late in the 3rd, we pull ahead by 17, Van Gundy says something about us playing the score instead of the game, and all of a sudden Sheed and Billups hit a few threes and the Cs are clinging to a single-digit lead. As Pierce said, the quarter itself was excruciatingly long, but it look less than 5 minutes after our 84-67 lead for Detroit to make it a game again.

[angryguy77]

A team that chokes wouldn't have made the big shots that it did at the end. But they do choke when they are behind in the 4th it seems.

This is what I'm saying.  Do we have redefine what choking is for this team?  The successful chokers? 

They did have some clutch plays at the end last night, but were it not for choking they wouldn't have been in the position to be clutch.  See what I mean?

It's an interesting way to look at it. I could live with giving them that title. We could call them the "Boston mid game chokers"

[jay_jay54]

Redz i see what you saying here,and its been an ongoing thing happening,so you figure when it kicks in(choking),the coach(Doc)should recognize the signs by now, call time(tallking it over) and/or make adjustments with players in these moments.I think all teams have their moments,where players are a little more tentaive than others,especially in a playoff game,but the coach is the one who should make some adjustments.

[Bahku]

Yes. This team is playing like a team that has very little playoiff experience, and very little experience playing together as a team .... in other words, as expected.

One night way up, one night way down, and while it's driving me absolutely nuts to watch this happening with my team, it really isn't a mystery. When they're playing their best, they can beat anyone, and when they let down, they can be pretty bad.

So it may sound a bit bizarre, but they can play like champs and chokers .... and that's what we're all witnessing, obviously. Here's hoping the "champs" team has more games than the other, eh?

[angryguy77]

Redz i see what you saying here,and its been an ongoing thing happening,so you figure when it kicks in(choking),the coach(Doc)should recognize the signs by now, call time(tallking it over) and/or make adjustments with players in these moments.I think all teams have their moments,where players are a little more tentaive than others,especially in a playoff game,but the coach is the one who should make some adjustments.

thats right. The coach has to call a to and settle them down and get them back to palying smart ball. Unfortunatly I don't see Doc doing that all too much.

[jay_jay54]

Redz i see what you saying here,and its been an ongoing thing happening,so you figure when it kicks in(choking),the coach(Doc)should recognize the signs by now, call time(tallking it over) and/or make adjustments with players in these moments.I think all teams have their moments,where players are a little more tentaive than others,especially in a playoff game,but the coach is the one who should make some adjustments.

thats right. The coach has to call a to and settle them down and get them back to palying smart ball. Unfortunatly I don't see Doc doing that all too much.

I thought i was the only one noticed it,especially last night.It was obvious,they needed to calm down,a few moments to regroup,gather themselves.But Doc,just let them continue to beat themselves.TP for recognizing.

[youcanthandlethetruth113]

Say what you will about this years Celtics but they are certainly unique.  This phenomenon of "choke wins" is just bizarre.  After a great win like last night there is still apprehension from blowing all but a point of a big lead and having to hold on for dear life for the win.  It's a fantastic win in a clutch game situation, but you would have to blind to not see the Celtics freezing up and letting the Pistons back in the game.  Once put to the ultimate test though, the Celts seem to do what it takes to win (free throws, clutch shot from Ray, defensive stops etc...). 

This has held true whether within an individual game or a series as a whole.  When the Celtics have lost their "pad" they have responded every time.   What happens when they play from behind late in a game has not been so great, and we have yet to see what happens when they have to play from behind in a series, but that's for another discussion (one we hopefully ever have to tackle).

We've seen the "choke win" happen throughout much of the playoffs, and to a higher degree, this series.  I'm a big "bottom line" kind of guy, and you can not argue with the overall results - the Celts are a game away from reaching the Finals, but you have to wonder if it is truly possible for a team to be a living, breathing oxymoron: Champs & Chokers.

So I beg the question; can we define the Celtics moments of "choking" within a game truly as "choking" if they win the game in the end?  It's one of the strangest things I've ever experienced as a fan. 

The Big Picture remains great and I stay focused on that.  I swear they're gonna make me nuts though (or more nuts than I already am    )

No chance the Celtic's "choked" last night.

When you choke you don't hit shots and lose....last night we made shots and won.

We did a lot of COUGHING (the lead), but we certainly did not choke.

One/a team can only choke by coughing too much, so while we coughed we certainly did not cough enough to choke. 

[angryguy77]

Redz i see what you saying here,and its been an ongoing thing happening,so you figure when it kicks in(choking),the coach(Doc)should recognize the signs by now, call time(tallking it over) and/or make adjustments with players in these moments.I think all teams have their moments,where players are a little more tentaive than others,especially in a playoff game,but the coach is the one who should make some adjustments.

thats right. The coach has to call a to and settle them down and get them back to palying smart ball. Unfortunatly I don't see Doc doing that all too much.

I thought i was the only one noticed it,especially last night.It was obvious,they needed to calm down,a few moments to regroup,gather themselves.But Doc,just let them continue to beat themselves.TP for recognizing.

Thanks!

[crownsy]

choke= lose in my book.

if you win, and had troubles, as we certainly did, you won ugly. but bottom line, as was said in an article this morning and i heard playing sports as far back as high school is:

SCOREBOARD
and i believe it said Celtics 106-pistons 102.

[Redz]

choke= lose in my book.

if you win, and had troubles, as we certainly did, you won ugly. but bottom line, as was said in an article this morning is

SCOREBOARD
and i believe it said Celtics 106-pistons 102.

Crownsy, this is basically my take too.   A win's a win and I'm pleased as punch.  I've just never seen a team have this much overall success with so many in game collapses.  It's a tribute to their resiliency and resolve.