Did JB make the players around him better?

[Kernewek]

I thought Jaylen made the players around him better last season because it was a less talented team but on a stronger team he does a lot less to help his teammates.

The reason why he helped his teammates last year was because he allowed them to play roles within their skill-level. By taking a high usage high volume scoring role, he allowed those more limited guys to stay within role player roles where they could still be effective.

Without Jaylen doing that, those role players would have had to extend their games beyond what they were able to do. Their offense (particularly their efficiencies) would have gradually declined / collapsed and the team would have been much worse off.

There was statistical study Kevin Pelton did years ago (maybe 15 years ago now) on Allen Iverson that argued AI had this effect when he played with less talent AI made them more efficient by taking on more responsibility offensively even thought AI himself was an inefficient scorer. That he managed to boost the efficiency of guys around them.

The study also looked at Vernon Maxwell on the 1994 Rockets and noted the same thing. Mad Max was streaky shooter with an itchy trigger finger but HOU's other role players were more spot up shooters who could not create their own offense. Max allowed them to stay within their shooting profile by taking more difficult shots himself. It allowed his teammates to stay efficient but made him look worse because he was more inefficient individually. Yet, it was still an overall positive. Just not easily picked up by looking at individual player's TS% / scoring efficiency.

Jaylen accomplished this for the Celtics last season when he was paired with so many limited offensive teammates (the young wings, Hauser, Queta, Garza). And to a lesser extent D White & Pritchard (good but not great offensive players).

Sure, but the difference is that the game is very, very different from the 90's and early 00's - not least of the differences come from the perceived value of inefficient shooting.

In other words, Brown can be both of these things:

so individually talented that he can carry the team"s deadweight to the point where we barely noticed the loss of Tatum, Jrue, KP, Horford and Kornet.

Brown is an inefficient chucker that is a turnover machine, poor passer, mediocre rebounder and foul generator.

(The Celtics also have very good W/L when Tatum sits, so I don't hold the team record against Brown or Tatum).

[Csfan1984]

I don't think there are many players in the league in general who actually make guys better on the court. Not even Tatum does it  Guys like LeBron and Jokic do that. They direct guys on the court. Old school PGs used to do this all the time. JB is a scorer pretty much. He has some playmaking but it's at White level. PP and Tatum are better playmakers but not elite at it.

[lbgreen33]

I think both things can be true, JB can be a great 2 way player, but not make others better. I always found JB always found a way to get his own!! Then he would seem to say, look at what I can do!! I am the best 2 way player in the league. All I am saying is, he was quick to build himself up, but true champions build up the players around them! They also did that because losing was just unacceptable to them!! like MJ, no one hated to lose more than he did, at everything!! But, JB said this was his favorite season, that can be perceived as a major flaw. I am just trying to explain what I think some felt.

[jambr380]

I don't think there are many players in the league in general who actually make guys better on the court. Not even Tatum does it  Guys like LeBron and Jokic do that. They direct guys on the court. Old school PGs used to do this all the time. JB is a scorer pretty much. He has some playmaking but it's at White level. PP and Tatum are better playmakers but not elite at it.

Tatum definitely has it. The attention he draws, the advanced passing reads. Maybe he's not CP3 or Nash, but for a big wing, he's in the upper echelon.

Also, White is a really underrated playmaker. He doesn't control the ball nearly as much as Tatum or Brown, but his quick reads and smart decisions lead to easier and open shots for teammates. White's incredible advanced stats aren't because of his supreme scoring ability.

[Goldstar88]

I don't think there are many players in the league in general who actually make guys better on the court. Not even Tatum does it  Guys like LeBron and Jokic do that. They direct guys on the court. Old school PGs used to do this all the time. JB is a scorer pretty much. He has some playmaking but it's at White level. PP and Tatum are better playmakers but not elite at it.

Tatum definitely has it. The attention he draws, the advanced passing reads. Maybe he's not CP3 or Nash, but for a big wing, he's in the upper echelon.

Also, White is a really underrated playmaker. He doesn't control the ball nearly as much as Tatum or Brown, but his quick reads and smart decisions lead to easier and open shots for teammates. White's incredible advanced stats aren't because of his supreme scoring ability.

Thing with JB is his passes are not good a lot of the time. He will hit a wide open shooter, but the ball is thrown to their knees or over their shoulders. He doesn?t get them the ball where they can just go right into their shot.

[byennie]

I thought Jaylen made the players around him better last season because it was a less talented team but on a stronger team he does a lot less to help his teammates.

The reason why he helped his teammates last year was because he allowed them to play roles within their skill-level. By taking a high usage high volume scoring role, he allowed those more limited guys to stay within role player roles where they could still be effective.

Without Jaylen doing that, those role players would have had to extend their games beyond what they were able to do. Their offense (particularly their efficiencies) would have gradually declined / collapsed and the team would have been much worse off.

There was statistical study Kevin Pelton did years ago (maybe 15 years ago now) on Allen Iverson that argued AI had this effect when he played with less talent AI made them more efficient by taking on more responsibility offensively even thought AI himself was an inefficient scorer. That he managed to boost the efficiency of guys around them.

The study also looked at Vernon Maxwell on the 1994 Rockets and noted the same thing. Mad Max was streaky shooter with an itchy trigger finger but HOU's other role players were more spot up shooters who could not create their own offense. Max allowed them to stay within their shooting profile by taking more difficult shots himself. It allowed his teammates to stay efficient but made him look worse because he was more inefficient individually. Yet, it was still an overall positive. Just not easily picked up by looking at individual player's TS% / scoring efficiency.

Jaylen accomplished this for the Celtics last season when he was paired with so many limited offensive teammates (the young wings, Hauser, Queta, Garza). And to a lesser extent D White & Pritchard (good but not great offensive players).

I think what's interesting about this, is it may suggest Jaylen is more valuable as a #1 than as a #2. If he's surrounded by lower usage guys, he can carry a heavy load, put up nearly 30 a night, plays heavy minutes and games... everything he did that resulted in 56 wins this year.

Now, if he's your #2 you don't actually need that buffer and he's reducing the overall efficiency of your team (while soaking up 30% of the payroll).

Notably, Brunson isn't an analytics darling, but clearly shouldered the load as the #1 option in New York, and that worked out pretty well for them this year. The rest of the roster was more efficient at scoring than him.