Author Topic: Joe Mazzula Wins Coach Of The Year  (Read 1240 times)

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Re: Joe Mazzula Wins Coach Of The Year
« Reply #15 on: Today at 08:10:11 AM »

Offline Moranis

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Mazz is an excellent coach and there was no one else who should have won this award this year. 

The problems we've seen in the playoffs is one of roster construction and talent. 
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Re: Joe Mazzula Wins Coach Of The Year
« Reply #16 on: Today at 08:58:46 AM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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He got the team over achieving for sure,  and this was deserved.

I wonder when these awards are voted on.   Must have been before the playoffs.

You know he was probably mad when he heard he won.
« Last Edit: Today at 09:14:23 AM by Celtics4ever »

Re: Joe Mazzula Wins Coach Of The Year
« Reply #17 on: Today at 01:14:33 PM »

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I think he deserves it. Probably the most under-appreciated coach in the league right now. He is not perfect, but he has been good enough.

He's a very good regular season coach, no question.  He deserved the award.

We've underachieved in the playoffs 3 out of 4 seasons.  He deserves some blame.

Agreed. I think Mazzula deserves another season for what he did last year + during past regular seasons + winning a title. However, if the team underachieves again in the playoffs, I think it is curtains for him in 12 months time.

Next year is a "make or break" season for him.

Re: Joe Mazzula Wins Coach Of The Year
« Reply #18 on: Today at 01:29:55 PM »

Online A Future of Stevens

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I think he deserves it. Probably the most under-appreciated coach in the league right now. He is not perfect, but he has been good enough.

He's a very good regular season coach, no question.  He deserved the award.

We've underachieved in the playoffs 3 out of 4 seasons.  He deserves some blame.

Agreed. I think Mazzula deserves another season for what he did last year + during past regular seasons + winning a title. However, if the team underachieves again in the playoffs, I think it is curtains for him in 12 months time.

Next year is a "make or break" season for him.
What would that look like? Making the ECF?
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Re: Joe Mazzula Wins Coach Of The Year
« Reply #19 on: Today at 01:48:51 PM »

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Now what do they know that we don't  ;)
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Re: Joe Mazzula Wins Coach Of The Year
« Reply #20 on: Today at 02:04:10 PM »

Online ozgod

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In seriousness Joe deserves a lot of credit in papering over the Celtics flaws during the regular season, largely because he got all the players to buy in, particularly the bench and the lesser names, even if some of them sat for long stretches. Players like Q, Walsh, Hugo, Garza, Simons, Baylor and Harper were all instrumental in the team significantly exceeding expectations during the regular season.

Unfortunately the playoffs, being a 7 game series and more about matchups, have a way of unmasking weaknesses. And our weaknesses were unmasked by a team that eventually matched up well against us - we had nobody to defend Embiid, who was at 70%, all our centers got into foul trouble against him. And we had nobody to defend Maxey at the point of attack. And they went away from the strategy they had employed throughout the regular season, which was to take less 3s and more midrange and paint shots, back to one where they took a lot more perimeter shots (and to make it worse they missed them more often than their average).

(click to enlarge)


Fans tend to want to assign a scapegoat, a person they can focus their blame on, but I think Brad will know as well as anyone that blowing a 3-1 lead is rarely due to one person - in our case it was probably a combination of a) missed shots; b) one dimensional play that became predictable and easy to defend; and c) not having the talent necessary to make effective changes. And that's really on all of them - but Joe has command responsibility, he is tasked with finding a way to change the trajectory of games when the team isn't shooting well. It's not good enough to say "make miss league" or "we had the right process but the execution was off" (like Atkinson said). He's a process driven person but this is ultimately a results business and you have to get results.

But I'm probably more forgiving of him than others because half the team was shipped out, we weren't expecting to be as good as we were in the regular season, finishing 2nd seed and the return of Tatum (which in itself brought additional integration challenges) raised expectations and they weren't met. But I don't think he is as dogmatic as people think, I think it's more a function of the players he has. Look at Jaylen, he took the 5th most middrange shots in the league this season and his 3FGA was considerably down on last year. Joe gave him the green light to shoot from the midrange as much as he wanted. If Joe had an Embiid or some other post player (like we had KP in 2024) the team would be running more post actions. I think he will learn and adapt to the team he is given.
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Re: Joe Mazzula Wins Coach Of The Year
« Reply #21 on: Today at 02:07:20 PM »

Online Roy H.

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In seriousness Joe deserves a lot of credit in papering over the Celtics flaws during the regular season, largely because he got all the players to buy in, particularly the bench and the lesser names, even if some of them sat for long stretches. Players like Q, Walsh, Hugo, Garza, Simons, Baylor and Harper were all instrumental in the team significantly exceeding expectations during the regular season.

Unfortunately the playoffs, being a 7 game series and more about matchups, have a way of unmasking weaknesses. And our weaknesses were unmasked by a team that eventually matched up well against us - we had nobody to defend Embiid, who was at 70%, all our centers got into foul trouble against him. And we had nobody to defend Maxey at the point of attack. And they went away from the strategy they had employed throughout the regular season, which was to take less 3s and more midrange and paint shots, back to one where they took a lot more perimeter shots (and to make it worse they missed them more often than their average).

(click to enlarge)


Fans tend to want to assign a scapegoat, a person they can focus their blame on, but I think Brad will know as well as anyone that blowing a 3-1 lead is rarely due to one person - in our case it was probably a combination of a) missed shots; b) one dimensional play that became predictable and easy to defend; and c) not having the talent necessary to make effective changes. And that's really on all of them - but Joe has command responsibility, he is tasked with finding a way to change the trajectory of games when the team isn't shooting well. It's not good enough to say "make miss league" or "we had the right process but the execution was off" (like Atkinson said). He's a process driven person but this is ultimately a results business and you have to get results.

But I'm probably more forgiving of him than others because half the team was shipped out, we weren't expecting to be as good as we were in the regular season, finishing 2nd seed and the return of Tatum (which in itself brought additional integration challenges) raised expectations and they weren't met. But I don't think he is as dogmatic as people think, I think it's more a function of the players he has. Look at Jaylen, he took the 5th most middrange shots in the league this season and his 3FGA was considerably down on last year. Joe gave him the green light to shoot from the midrange as much as he wanted. If Joe had an Embiid or some other post player (like we had KP in 2024) the team would be running more post actions. I think he will learn and adapt to the team he is given.

It would be nice if he could unmask other teams' weaknesses.


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Re: Joe Mazzula Wins Coach Of The Year
« Reply #22 on: Today at 02:19:43 PM »

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I think he deserves it. Probably the most under-appreciated coach in the league right now. He is not perfect, but he has been good enough.

He's a very good regular season coach, no question.  He deserved the award.

We've underachieved in the playoffs 3 out of 4 seasons.  He deserves some blame.

Agreed. I think Mazzula deserves another season for what he did last year + during past regular seasons + winning a title. However, if the team underachieves again in the playoffs, I think it is curtains for him in 12 months time.

Next year is a "make or break" season for him.
What would that look like? Making the ECF?

It is one thing to lose. It is another to crap the bed.

No playoff losses like losing 3-1 lead to a so-so Philly team, choking 20pt 2nd half leads to NYK, going down 0-3 to a much worse Miami team. Nothing like that.

You can get beat but he can't lose like that. Not again.

Re: Joe Mazzula Wins Coach Of The Year
« Reply #23 on: Today at 02:36:50 PM »

Offline aefgogreen

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I think he deserves it. Probably the most under-appreciated coach in the league right now. He is not perfect, but he has been good enough.

He's a very good regular season coach, no question.  He deserved the award.

We've underachieved in the playoffs 3 out of 4 seasons.  He deserves some blame.

Agreed. I think Mazzula deserves another season for what he did last year + during past regular seasons + winning a title. However, if the team underachieves again in the playoffs, I think it is curtains for him in 12 months time.

Next year is a "make or break" season for him.
What would that look like? Making the ECF?

It is one thing to lose. It is another to crap the bed.

No playoff losses like losing 3-1 lead to a so-so Philly team, choking 20pt 2nd half leads to NYK, going down 0-3 to a much worse Miami team. Nothing like that.

You can get beat but he can't lose like that. Not again.

I'd like him gone too, but what is worse, getting down 3-0 or blowing a 3-1 lead. At the end of the day he's going to be judged harshly for the team losing series they should have won, not series score.

Re: Joe Mazzula Wins Coach Of The Year
« Reply #24 on: Today at 02:53:19 PM »

Online Goldstar88

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Mazz is an excellent coach and there was no one else who should have won this award this year. 

The problems we've seen in the playoffs is one of roster construction and talent.

Yeah, most thought the Celtics would be lucky to make the playoffs and they finished a 2 seed. Also went 9-2 in the games Jaylen Brown did not play in this season. Joe got the most out of the team he was given.
Quoting Nick from the now locked Ime thread:
Quote
At some point you have to blame the performance on the court on the players on the court. Every loss is not the coach's fault and every win isn't because of the players.

Re: Joe Mazzula Wins Coach Of The Year
« Reply #25 on: Today at 04:02:09 PM »

Online Roy H.

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Mazz is an excellent coach and there was no one else who should have won this award this year. 

The problems we've seen in the playoffs is one of roster construction and talent.

Yeah, most thought the Celtics would be lucky to make the playoffs and they finished a 2 seed. Also went 9-2 in the games Jaylen Brown did not play in this season. Joe got the most out of the team he was given.

No, he didn't.  He lost to a #7 seed that promptly got swept by a NY team that wasn't at full strength. 

Joe has only won in the playoffs when we had five guys with all-star talent.  We've been upset three out of four seasons by a lower seed, including losing to the #7 and #8 seed.


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Re: Joe Mazzula Wins Coach Of The Year
« Reply #26 on: Today at 04:05:15 PM »

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Mazz is an excellent coach and there was no one else who should have won this award this year. 

The problems we've seen in the playoffs is one of roster construction and talent.

Yeah, most thought the Celtics would be lucky to make the playoffs and they finished a 2 seed. Also went 9-2 in the games Jaylen Brown did not play in this season. Joe got the most out of the team he was given.

The team overachieved in the regular season and underachieved in the playoffs.  The real team is somewhere in the middle.  Hard to say exactly where.  But if you break down last season's team objectively, there are a lot of weakness:

Solid Playoff Caliber:
Tatum
Brown
White

Fringe NBA Starters:
Pritchard
Hauser
Queta
Vucevic

Fringe Bench Players:
Scheierman
Garza
Walsh
Gonzalez

Fringe NBA Players:
Harper
Williams
Shugla
Banton

Weaknesses get exposed in the playoffs.  BOS had plenty of weaknesses that could be exposed.  It is also true that this is not the first time that this team underachieved in the playoffs, but this current team had holes.  Really only 3 real starters and significant minutes required from some limited players.

So yes, the roster needs some upgrading and Mazzulla needs to make some adjustments to how he is using players.  He used them just fine in the regular season but the league kind of caught up with the overachieving young players.  Then he didn't seem to figure out how to use Vucevic in the playoffs (or maybe Vucevic didn't figure out what he needed to do).  PHI is not that bad of a team.  Paul George played very well.  Embiid played well enough.  Maxey was Maxey.

Re: Joe Mazzula Wins Coach Of The Year
« Reply #27 on: Today at 04:18:06 PM »

Online Goldstar88

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Mazz is an excellent coach and there was no one else who should have won this award this year. 

The problems we've seen in the playoffs is one of roster construction and talent.

Yeah, most thought the Celtics would be lucky to make the playoffs and they finished a 2 seed. Also went 9-2 in the games Jaylen Brown did not play in this season. Joe got the most out of the team he was given.

No, he didn't.  He lost to a #7 seed that promptly got swept by a NY team that wasn't at full strength. 

Joe has only won in the playoffs when we had five guys with all-star talent.  We've been upset three out of four seasons by a lower seed, including losing to the #7 and #8 seed.

I think the roster was exposed in the playoffs. Brad basically said as much in his year end interview. He noted that their record during the season against the top teams in the league was not good.

Brad Stevens noted that despite winning 56 regular-season games, the Boston Celtics were just 3-11 against the other top-three seeds in each conference
Quoting Nick from the now locked Ime thread:
Quote
At some point you have to blame the performance on the court on the players on the court. Every loss is not the coach's fault and every win isn't because of the players.

Re: Joe Mazzula Wins Coach Of The Year
« Reply #28 on: Today at 04:34:01 PM »

Online Roy H.

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Mazz is an excellent coach and there was no one else who should have won this award this year. 

The problems we've seen in the playoffs is one of roster construction and talent.

Yeah, most thought the Celtics would be lucky to make the playoffs and they finished a 2 seed. Also went 9-2 in the games Jaylen Brown did not play in this season. Joe got the most out of the team he was given.

No, he didn't.  He lost to a #7 seed that promptly got swept by a NY team that wasn't at full strength. 

Joe has only won in the playoffs when we had five guys with all-star talent.  We've been upset three out of four seasons by a lower seed, including losing to the #7 and #8 seed.

I think the roster was exposed in the playoffs. Brad basically said as much in his year end interview. He noted that their record during the season against the top teams in the league was not good.

Brad Stevens noted that despite winning 56 regular-season games, the Boston Celtics were just 3-11 against the other top-three seeds in each conference

What is Brad supposed to say?  "Our players choked and Joe sucked"? 

It's interesting that we've had 10+ more regular season wins than every team we've lost to under Joe.

The year we did win, we had 16+ more wins than everybody we faced.
« Last Edit: Today at 05:04:12 PM by Roy H. »


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Re: Joe Mazzula Wins Coach Of The Year
« Reply #29 on: Today at 05:16:29 PM »

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Brad Stevens noted that despite winning 56 regular-season games, the Boston Celtics were just 3-11 against the other top-three seeds in each conference

This is telling.  It shows that the good teams were able to expose the Celtics' weaknesses during the regular season.  There are a lot of regular season nights where the opposing team is flat or doesn't even try.  BOS played hard every night for the most part, scrapped and overachieved.  That is a testament to Mazzulla's coaching and Brown's leadership.  But the roster had flaws.  I think Stevens has this right.

Many don't agree but I think Mazzulla is a good young coach.  I further believe that Brad Stevens believes this too.  Just like the roster has some holes or weaknesses, Mazzulla does too.  But do you throw out the baby with the bathwater and fire Mazzulla?  Are you really sure the next coach will actually be better?  Spoelstra was a good young coach with some flaws at a point also.  This is probably true of all good or great coaches.

It is an old adage that coaches get too much credit for winning and too much blame for loosing.  MIA series, bad coaching or nobody MIA players shooting 50% from 3?  DAL series, good coaching or team that won in spite of bad coaching?  PHI series, bad coaching or a team/roster that wasn't as good as it seemed?  You can play any of these any way you want.