without PREDICTING injuries where do you rank Celtics out of east?s 15 Squads ?

[Moranis]

Chicago had 24 wins 38 losses last year in early March. Then finished the season on a tear winning 15 of their final 21 games. That took them to 39 wins 43 losses.

Their 24-38 record was a .387 winning percentage. A 32 win team if they had of continued at the same pace.

So a lot depends on the legitimacy / sustainability of that winning tear Chicago had late in the season ... as to whether they are a threat to make the play-in / playoffs or not.

after they got rid of LaVine they improved significantly

[celticinorlando]

Going to be interesting how much the load manage White and Brown.

[Who]

I think they need penalties for teams that tank year after year maybe have your pick placed at the botton of the first round if you're in the lottery three years in  a row or the like.   This is as big as problem as team and aprons but on the other end.

Love that idea.

[Moranis]

I think they need penalties for teams that tank year after year maybe have your pick placed at the botton of the first round if you're in the lottery three years in  a row or the like.   This is as big as problem as team and aprons but on the other end.

Love that idea.

terrible idea. I mean Chicago has won 40, 39, and 39 games the last 3 years but has been in the lottery all 3 years.  How many seasons has San Antonio tanked in the last 6? 

[Who]

I think they need penalties for teams that tank year after year maybe have your pick placed at the botton of the first round if you're in the lottery three years in  a row or the like.   This is as big as problem as team and aprons but on the other end.

Love that idea.

terrible idea. I mean Chicago has won 40, 39, and 39 games the last 3 years but has been in the lottery all 3 years.  How many seasons has San Antonio tanked in the last 6?

They tanked the last 2 with Wemby. Tanked the year before that to get Wemby. I can't remember the prior seasons. I don't think they were tanking then. They were just bad.

Looked it up. Okay so 3 other years in the lottery prior to getting Wemby. Not tanking but bad team.

[keevsnick]

Chicago had 24 wins 38 losses last year in early March. Then finished the season on a tear winning 15 of their final 21 games. That took them to 39 wins 43 losses.

Their 24-38 record was a .387 winning percentage. A 32 win team if they had of continued at the same pace.

So a lot depends on the legitimacy / sustainability of that winning tear Chicago had late in the season ... as to whether they are a threat to make the play-in / playoffs or not.

Personally, I put literally ZERO stock on win streaks and stretches in March/April. There's some team(s) every year that take advantage of that stretch were truly awful teams are tanking and good teams are resting and it never really seems to stick into next year.

[Moranis]

I think they need penalties for teams that tank year after year maybe have your pick placed at the botton of the first round if you're in the lottery three years in  a row or the like.   This is as big as problem as team and aprons but on the other end.

Love that idea.

terrible idea. I mean Chicago has won 40, 39, and 39 games the last 3 years but has been in the lottery all 3 years.  How many seasons has San Antonio tanked in the last 6?

They tanked the last 2 with Wemby. Tanked the year before that to get Wemby. I can't remember the prior seasons. I don't think they were tanking then. They were just bad.

Looked it up. Okay so 3 other years in the lottery prior to getting Wemby. Not tanking but bad team.

They literally traded for Fox during the season last year. Wemby got hurt 5 games or so after and then Fox got hurt.  They definitely did not tank last year, they just lost their best player to injury and then their newly acquired 2nd best player soon after.

That is the problem with that sort of thing.  Some time teams are just bad. Some time good teams tank because of injury (what Boston might very well do this year).  Trying to regulate it just creates too many issues.  The lottery is all the regulation needed as it ensure the worst team nothing more than the 5th pick.

[Who]

I think they need penalties for teams that tank year after year maybe have your pick placed at the botton of the first round if you're in the lottery three years in  a row or the like.   This is as big as problem as team and aprons but on the other end.

Love that idea.

terrible idea. I mean Chicago has won 40, 39, and 39 games the last 3 years but has been in the lottery all 3 years.  How many seasons has San Antonio tanked in the last 6?

They tanked the last 2 with Wemby. Tanked the year before that to get Wemby. I can't remember the prior seasons. I don't think they were tanking then. They were just bad.

Looked it up. Okay so 3 other years in the lottery prior to getting Wemby. Not tanking but bad team.

They literally traded for Fox during the season last year. Wemby got hurt 5 games or so after and then Fox got hurt.  They definitely did not tank last year, they just lost their best player to injury and then their newly acquired 2nd best player soon after.

That is the problem with that sort of thing.  Some time teams are just bad. Some time good teams tank because of injury (what Boston might very well do this year).  Trying to regulate it just creates too many issues.  The lottery is all the regulation needed as it ensure the worst team nothing more than the 5th pick.

That is true. I forgot about D Fox.

Last season shouldn't be considered tanking. I was angry with them heading into the season for not getting Wemby a backup or a quality PF to compete with Sochan in case he wasn't ready.

But they did make a major push forward in trying to win by getting D Fox midseason.

[Who]

East Starting Lineups Ranked

1 NYK = Brunson, Hart, M Bridges, Anunoby, Towns
2 ORL = Suggs, Bane, F Wagner, Banchero, W Carter Jr
3 CLE = Garland, Donovan, Stus, E Mobley, J Allen
4 PHI = Maxey, Edgecombe, Oubre, PG13, Embiid
5 ATL = Trae, Dyson, Risacher, Jalen Johnson, Zinger

6 MIL = R Rollins, G Trent, Kuzma, Giannis, M Turner
7 TOR = Quickley, RJ Barrett, B Ingram, S Barnes, Poeltl
8 MIA = T Herro, N Powell, A Wiggins, Bam, K Ware
9 IND = Nembhard, Mathurin, Nesmith, Siakam, I Jackson
10 BOS = A Simons, D White, Jaylen, Minott, Queta
11 DET = Cade, Ivey, D Robinson, T Harris, Duren
12 CHA = LaMelo, Sexton, B Miller, Bridges, M Plumlee

13 CHI = Dosunmu, Coby White, Giddey, Buzelis, Vucevic
14 BKN = T Mann, Cam Thomas, J Wilson, MPJ, Nic Claxton
15 WAS = McCollum, Coulibaly, K George, Middleton, Sarr


Those teams #6 through #12 all look close to one another to my eye. I wouldn't be surprised by any order they finished in.

[slamtheking]

East Starting Lineups Ranked

1 NYK = Brunson, Hart, M Bridges, Anunoby, Towns
2 ORL = Suggs, Bane, F Wagner, Banchero, W Carter Jr
3 CLE = Garland, Donovan, Stus, E Mobley, J Allen
4 PHI = Maxey, Edgecombe, Oubre, PG13, Embiid
5 ATL = Trae, Dyson, Risacher, Jalen Johnson, Zinger

6 MIL = R Rollins, G Trent, Kuzma, Giannis, M Turner
7 TOR = Quickley, RJ Barrett, B Ingram, S Barnes, Poeltl
8 MIA = T Herro, N Powell, A Wiggins, Bam, K Ware
9 IND = Nembhard, Mathurin, Nesmith, Siakam, I Jackson
10 BOS = A Simons, D White, Jaylen, Minott, Queta
11 DET = Cade, Ivey, D Robinson, T Harris, Duren
12 CHA = LaMelo, Sexton, B Miller, Bridges, M Plumlee

13 CHI = Dosunmu, Coby White, Giddey, Buzelis, Vucevic
14 BKN = T Mann, Cam Thomas, J Wilson, MPJ, Nic Claxton
15 WAS = McCollum, Coulibaly, K George, Middleton, Sarr


Those teams #6 through #12 all look close to one another to my eye. I wouldn't be surprised by any order they finished in.

have got to say that not one of those starting 5s blow me away.  also have to say that even with Jaylen and White, I could see the C's in that bottom 3 because the frontcourt is far and away worse than any others listed there. 

[Moranis]

Detroit has a better starting lineup than Boston in part because they have the best player on either team (without Tatum). And before anyone cries foul, Cade was 3rd Team All NBA last year and finished 7th in MVP voting as a rising 23 year old 4th year player.  He is going to better this year.

Also not sure why Ausar Thompson isn"t starting at SF since he did last year in his 2nd year.

Cade, Ivey, Thompson, Harris, Duren. With Hardaway instead of Ivey starting last year, that team won 44 games.  They should win more than that this year given everyone but Harris is still on the upswing.  And with Strasser, Robinson, LeVert, Stewart, Holland, and Reed on the bench, they might be a sleeper to come out of the East if Cade takes the next step up and the other young guys have their natural progression.

[Who]

I was not that impressed with DET's starters last year. I thought they got a lot of added-value from their bench that lifted them to a +.500 team.

I didn't think it was the starters that were driving their success. Obviously Cade was. But the rest of the lineup was (and still is) uninspiring. Cade + depth was their calling card more than having a quality starting unit.

The guard and two forward positions (alongside Cade) rate among the lowest in the league. Duren is an average to slightly below average starting center. Cade was the only above average starter in their team.

[Donoghus]

6 to 8 range.  I still think they could be battling for the 6 seed come March/April

[DefenseWinsChamps]

Detroit has a better starting lineup than Boston in part because they have the best player on either team (without Tatum). And before anyone cries foul, Cade was 3rd Team All NBA last year and finished 7th in MVP voting as a rising 23 year old 4th year player.  He is going to better this year.

Also not sure why Ausar Thompson isn"t starting at SF since he did last year in his 2nd year.

Cade, Ivey, Thompson, Harris, Duren. With Hardaway instead of Ivey starting last year, that team won 44 games.  They should win more than that this year given everyone but Harris is still on the upswing.  And with Strasser, Robinson, LeVert, Stewart, Holland, and Reed on the bench, they might be a sleeper to come out of the East if Cade takes the next step up and the other young guys have their natural progression.

They are pretty clearly still one piece away. They don't have a Jaylen Brown-Jaylin Williams 2nd banana. I don't think Ivey is that guy.

I like their team and how they are building, but calling them a sleeper is a big-time stretch.

[Moranis]

Detroit has a better starting lineup than Boston in part because they have the best player on either team (without Tatum). And before anyone cries foul, Cade was 3rd Team All NBA last year and finished 7th in MVP voting as a rising 23 year old 4th year player.  He is going to better this year.

Also not sure why Ausar Thompson isn"t starting at SF since he did last year in his 2nd year.

Cade, Ivey, Thompson, Harris, Duren. With Hardaway instead of Ivey starting last year, that team won 44 games.  They should win more than that this year given everyone but Harris is still on the upswing.  And with Strasser, Robinson, LeVert, Stewart, Holland, and Reed on the bench, they might be a sleeper to come out of the East if Cade takes the next step up and the other young guys have their natural progression.

They are pretty clearly still one piece away. They don't have a Jaylen Brown-Jaylin Williams 2nd banana. I don't think Ivey is that guy.

I like their team and how they are building, but calling them a sleeper is a big-time stretch.

Ivey is an excellent shooter and certainly has 20 ppg potential, though may be best suited as a 3rd scorer and not 2nd.  I really like Duren down low, but obviously is not a shooter at all. If he can develop a mid range shot, it will really unlock something for them, but even if not he doesnt miss in close.  I think Thompson is the guy that can make some big strides though.  If he can get his scoring up to even like 15 pog, it will help a lot.  So Cade in the upper 20's, Ivey around 20, and then Thompson, Harris, and Duren in the 12-15 range is enough scoring from the starting unit.  They have some solid shooters (Robinson, LeVert) on the bench and Holland who turned 20 last week.  Outside of Harris, Robinson, and LeVert the team is basically all still on rookie contracts and they have a lot of very high draft picks on those rookie contracts.  I think they will be a lot better this year and they won 44 games last year and pushed the Knicks hard. Honestly they should have gone for someone like Holiday. He'd have given them a steady hand, but even without that, I think 50 wins and home court in round 1 is very doable for them. Do that next year in a conference without any dominate teams and who knows what they can do (like the 4th seeded Pacers last year).