This trade signals to me they are tanking next year, which I think means they are trading Brown.
I don't see that. I don't feel that these trades make it any more or less likely that they trade Brown than before the trades.
The core is Tatum - Brown - White. How many teams have a better big 3 than that? Not OKC I don't think. Not IND for sure. There may not ever be a team as good as the 2023-24 Celtics again, as long as these salary and tax rules remain.
OKC clearly and by a wide margin has not only a better top 3, but also a younger one and a much deeper supporting cast. It isn't close. The Lakers have a better top 3 right now. The Warriors do as well. The Nuggets probably do as well (though that is as much because of just how better Jokic is than Tatum). Houston does, at least for next year (and a much deeper and younger team with many more high end assets to trade).
Tatum, Brown, White simply isn't a championship core. It really wasn't one when they won, they were just 6 deep in a strange year, but now they have 3 maybe 4 depending on how good Simons is. They aren't going to have the best player on the floor in the truly meaningful series, they have to beat those teams with depth and they just don't have it. The team needs a real and true reset and a full-blown 1-year tank.
I am not worried about the Lakers or GSW. We are talking about 2026-27. Durant probably is not a factor by then either. Denver and OKC are at least worth debating. Jokic and Murray are only in the discussion if Murray is healthy. I expect DEN to be in the mix for sure, but I feel Tatum-Brown-White are right there with them at worst (assuming Tatum returns to form).
I don't buy that OKC with SGA-Williams-Holmgren are any better than Tatum-Brown-White. OKC is going to be facing the same issues of resigning their players and dealing with the 2nd apron. Right now, all the supporting cast are on rookie contracts, but that doesn't last forever.
They are all potential 30%, not 35% players at the top (aside from SGA). That matter a lot. They also have a lot more young players and future draft picks. They are much better positioned to keep their core in tact that Boston is right now. They are much more similar to Boston from 2021, except that SGA is significantly better than Tatum was in 2021 (well pretty much everyone is better) and they have much better draft capital. Boston had a very nice run beginning that very next year making the Finals in 22, losing a heartbreaking game 7 in the ECF in 23, and then winning in 24. The team choked away this year. Pretty unacceptable, but it showed pretty clearly the cracks in the armor. The team is done as currently constituted. Team needs a full reset this year and the best way to do that is trade Brown and restock the assets. There are plenty of potential trades that can do that out there.
You have been wanting to trade Brown for many years. You said over and over that JT and JB can't win a title together, they are a bad fit, they can't do anything together...Well they win the title, JB is the East Finals MVP, and the Finals MVP and here you are still with the same dog and pony show. I mean everyone is welcome to their opinion. But it doesn't seem logical to me. It seems EXTREMELY unlikely that the C's are going to trade Brown at this point. They already traded Jrue and KP. That got them where they needed to go salary wise.
Those awards are nonsense. Everyone agrees Tatum is a better player than Brown and in both those series, Tatum scored more points, grabbed more rebounds, and dished out more assists. The writers got cute and got it wrong. Perhaps the worst voting for finals mvp ever and that is saying something considering Iguodala won it over both Curry and Lebron.
Brown played much more complimentary during that whole run to the championship. He didn't do that very much before that run and he didn't do that last year, which is why the team flamed out in the 2nd round.
And yes I would have traded Brown for Kawhi in the summer of 2018 and the Celtics would almost certainly have won the 2019 title had they done that and had at least as many as they have now (and who knows what Kawhi and Kyrie would have done after winning the 2019 title). We might very well be sitting on a dynasty right now. The great what if.
The numbers support that Boston wins at about the same rate whether Brown plays in the game or is out. It has been that way since his 2nd year when he became a starter. He just doesn't impact the game like he should. If they keep him this year, I fully believe it will become very apparent that I have been correct in this. He simply isn't good enough to be a #1 and his skill set doesn't compliment Tatum all that well so he isn't the correct #2 on this team (he'd be pretty good next to someone like Jokic or Giannis though). White is a much better complimentary piece, he just isn't good enough as a player to be a #2.
More of the same I hate Brown propaganda. We heard if for years, all of us have eyes and know what happened for us to win the title. It must have been really painful for you to have to watch JB have so much success and play so well. I will just say that I disagree with almost everything you wrote. I will stop engaging you about it.
I don't hate Brown as a player at all. I just don't think he is a great compliment next to Tatum and don't think he is a #1 type player. I don't see that as a controversial take at all. He played great last year in the playoffs I said that, but it still doesn't change the fact that Tatum out scored, out rebounded, and out assisted him in both the ECF and Finals. That is simply a fact. It is certainly my opinion that the voters got it wrong, but given the better player had better stats and didn't win the awards, I feel pretty confident in that opinion. Put it this way, do you know how many times a player has led his team in the Finals in points, rebounds, and assists, while being on the winning team and not won Finals MVP? Give you a hint, there is 1 player on that list.
I generally agree with your Brown evaluation.
When Brown makes defense his priority it works much better. I think we did see that in the 2024 season and certainly in the 2024 finals. He's also a better midrange shooter than Tatum and that ability to go get tough buckets is important to have. We saw the value of that in the 2024 finals too. Those tough contested middies weren't falling for Tatum, but Brown was able to find offense for us during cold stretches.
This playoffs we didn't see as much of that from Brown I don't think he trusted his lift and burst with the injured knee.
All that said, my issue with blowing the team up, is that I think Tatum is and can still be post-achilles that #1 championship player. Brown isn't the ideal #2, but he's within the range of reasonable #2s. If a team can give you something that projects to be a cheaper or better or better fitting #2 then obviously I'm accepting. But if a team is just going to give us a hodge podge of picks and cap space (which I think is the most likely return) than I worry that we'll be stuck without enough top end talent to take advantage of Tatum's prime.
Guessing at specific offers is always silly, but the picks/guys I'd take just aren't realistically going to be offered. Obviously I'd pull the trigger for Flagg or Harper but it's just not happening. I don't see a star for a star deal anywhere that makes sense (Bam is my absolute dream here) and the alternative is really a hodgepodge of picks. I think most offers would generally fit the format of a Raptors offer which may be 9, Barrett, and a few future picks that project outside the top 10.
