Fox to Spurs, LaVine to Kings

[Redz]

Getting threads up for the trades.  Not sure what to make of this one, but Spurs just got more fun.

[radiohead]

San Antonio could be a dark horse in the West. Does this trade make them better than Houston and Memphis now?

[keevsnick]

So LaVine, three firsts and 3 seconds. The CHA 25' first is not going to convey since its lottery protected, that becomes two second rounder's. So really the haul is:

Zach LaVine
2027 SAS 1st
2031 MIN 1st
2026 Cha 2nd
2027 Cha 2nd
2025 CHI 2nd
2028 DEN 2nd
2028 SAC 2nd (Got their own back)

Thats not a terrible haul for 1.5 years of Fox. Zach Lavine is around the same age as Sabonis, so at least those two guys are on the same timeline. They won't be a contender, but when you've been bad as long as the Kings have its really hard to go back to rebuilding.

[Who]

Zach LaVine fits their all-offense no-defense strategy.

Kings just got worse. They gotta get some defenders. They gotta get a PG to replace Fox. They got an abundance of scorers / offense. They need balance. This is the opposite of that. They just doubled down on things they are already good at + doubled down on things they are bad at.

I hope the Kings miss the playoffs / play-in spots now. San Antonio should be good enough now to take it from them.

[Who]

Chicago acquires Zach Collins, Tre Jones, Kevin Huerter, their own 2025 pick back from the Spurs.

Interesting trade for the Bulls. They finally got out from underneath Zach LaVine who they have wanted to dump for 2 years now. They were even willing to take expiring contracts last year for him and still couldn't move him.

So a new dawn. 3 interesting role players. Zach Collins is an okay backup big man. Tre Jones is a useful backup PG but the Bulls have a lot of PGs. Not sure. Huerter is a nice get to replace LaVine on the wing.

I wonder whether Chicago will be play 1 PG and start Huerter at SG or if they will start 2 PGs and bring Huerter off the bench.

G: A Donsummu, Tre Jones
G: C White, Lonzo Ball
F: J Giddey, K Huerter
F: Pat Williams, Jalen Smith, M Buzelis
C: N Vucevic, Z Collins

Others: T Craig (SF), J Green (SF/SG), Jevon Carter (PG)

I'd go small with the 2 PGs. They got 4 of them. 5 if you include Jevon Carter. It seems like the best way to get them on the court. Huerter is big enough to play backup SF. Gives them a sharpshooter there. They can go bigger at times with him at SG alongside 1 PG.

They can also go double big with Jalen Smith / Zach Collins or go smaller and quicker with Matas Buzelis.

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Zach LaVine has been red-hot for the Bulls have a slow start. 24ppg on 51% FG% 44.6% 3PT% on 7.3 attempts per game 63.7% TS% with 4.5apg and 4.8rpg.

I like how they have replaced him. Not with a like for like replacement but with quality depth. That Bulls team looks a solid 10-13 man deep. The number of ball-handlers & passers they have is impressive. They should be able to create offense. Not just their guards but also Giddey and then Huerter. A skilled center in Vucevic. I think they will be able to replace enough of LaVine's offense to maintain their good form this season.

I would be more worried about a drop off if they dump Vucevic as well.

[Who]

So LaVine, three firsts and 3 seconds. The CHA 25' first is not going to convey since its lottery protected, that becomes two second rounder's. So really the haul is:

Zach LaVine
2027 SAS 1st
2031 MIN 1st

[plus 5 2nds]

They got Sidy Cissoko as well in the deal. Promising young forward who is putting up big numbers in the D-League.

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I don't like the trade for Sacramento. LaVine is not what they needed. They already had a surplus of scorers. LaVine's trade value has been in the toilet for the last 2 years. So I don't think they can get much for him if they try to move him on. The 2 firsts. The Spurs one will probably be in the mid to late 20s. A late first. And the Wolves one is a complete unknown. The Wolves pick looks the best asset in the deal.

Sacramento has no real PG now. I wonder what they will do. Maybe they will try to play Malik Monk there. They can run their offense through D Sabonis so they might be able to get away with it. 4 skilled players PG-PF alongside Sabas.

G: M Monk, K Ellis
G: Z LaVine
F: K Murray, D McDermott
F: D DeRozan, T Lyles
C: D Sabonis, A Len

Keon Ellis is another option. He had a good season last year as a 3+D type SG. A combo guard more than an out and out SG. He should get more playing time post trade.

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The Kings do have a nice set of interesting 3rd stringers. Their injured lottery pick from last year in Devin Carter. He will be rotation PG for them next season. Sidy Cissoko has been putting up big numbers in the G-League. He is an interesting young forward who they picked up in this trade. They also have Colby Jones as a young SG they drafted 2 years ago. Plus their rookie big man Isaac Jones who is a hustle big energizer.

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I think Sac-town should be able to play at a similar level post-trade as pre-trade. Somewhere around .500. A high level potent offensive team with a lousy defense. They still have lots of scorers & shooters.

They just got far weaker long term though. They had 2 legit building blocks in D Fox & D Sabonis. Now they only have 1. The team does not fit well together. They need a lot of trades to bring in some defense and a legit starting caliber PG.

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I am not sure how much more LaVine brings to the table than Malik Monk does.

Monk has been great for the last 18 months. Per 36 minutes, Monk is averaging 20.4 points & 6.6 assists this season. He led all bench players in 4th quarter scoring last year. The Kings had two of the most prolific late game scorers in Fox & Monk.

LaVine and Monk seem duplicative of one another. Monk the better ball-handler & passer. LaVine the more consistent shooter.

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I don't like LaVine for this team. I'd love to see him end up on a veteran team that has everything else but scoring and just lets him concentrate on what he does best.

He could be a positive addition for someone. I don't think Sacramento will be that team.

[Who]

Are the Spurs a legit contender now?

They have a potent 1-2 punch in Fox & Wemby. Similar to Jokic & Jamal Murray. Wemby finally has his Jamal Murray. A prime time ball-handler who can score and create with the best of them.

They have a 3rd option in Devin Vassell who can get 16-18ppg. They have a 4th option in Harrison Barnes. They have a defensive minded glue guy in Jeremy Sochan at PF who has many similarities to Aaron Gordon. They have a top quality backup forward in Keldon Johnson. They have a quality backup SF/SG in Julian Champagnie.

They have a veteran backup PG in Chris Paul. They picked up Jordan McLaughlin in the trade as a 3rd string PG in case CP3 gets hurt. So some injury insurance. They have another interesting bench player in Stephon Castle. He can play PG or SG. A big defensive PG. Not as dependable as the other veterans in the previous paragraph but has potential and can have big games at times.

The only hole I see is the lack of cover at center for Wemby. Someone that can come in for 10mpg and not kill them.

G: D Fox, CP3, J McLaughlin
G: D Vassell, S Castle
F: H Barnes, J Champagnie
F: J Sochan, Keldon Johnson
C: Wemby

They are a backup center away.

I do worry about the maturity of Fox / Wemby. Fox to me feels like a player who is a top 25 player but has the talent to be a year-in-year-out top 10 player. He hasn't quite made that leap yet.

Wemby is probably a top 5 MVP candidate this season but he is still a bit inconsistent offensively. He can do so many different things on the floor that he has trouble prioritizing what he should do. What is his #1 #2 #3 ways to score instead of allowing defenses to dictate him into his 4th 5th options. He doesn't enforce his will onto games yet. He allows his opponent to dictate too much. I also think this makes it harder for the role players to find their offense next to Wemby because they do not know what he will do so they are unsure of what shots they will get playing off of him.

I think the Spurs will come up short in the playoffs.

I trust Memphis more than San Antonio this season. However, I trust San Antonio more than Houston. Houston are too bad offensively. I think they will come undone in the playoffs and fall short.

Yeah so, a backup center + some growth in maturity from their 2 stars. They are pretty much there, darn close, to being a title caliber team.

[Roy H.]

Are the Spurs a legit contender now?

Are they now? 

I don't think so.  My very basic thinking is that Collins for Fox doesn't turn a below .500 team into a top tier team.

But, the foundation is there.

[Donoghus]

Bulls should've moved on from Lavine like 3 years ago.  Have to imagine Vucevic is next.

[dannyboy35]

  I thought the Warriors would have really went for Lavine . I think he?s really underrated . But I can see how he?s earned the reputation he has. On paper he?s great.

[dannyboy35]

Are the Spurs a legit contender now?

Are they now? 

I don't think so.  My very basic thinking is that Collins for Fox doesn't turn a below .500 team into a top tier team.

But, the foundation is there.

   Yeah . Exciting day for Spurs fans. Wemby makes play easier for everyone. They?re off and running for the future and I think they?ll be an exciting playoff team.

[Who]

Spurs kept their best 8 players and all of atlanta's firsts. Insane. Best trade in franchise history. Still enough gunpowder to add another star if they desire

They own the Hawks 1st rounder this season. Jalen Johnson just went down for the season. That has a good chance of being a lotto pick. Another quality youngster to add to their roster.

GM Brian Wright knew Spurs were in the driver's seat. Told teams Castle and Hawks picks were off limits. But to get a player like Fox AND not have to give up either Vassell, Johnson, Sochan, or Castle? That's gold! AND they even got rid of that awful Zach Collins contract. Wright wins GM of the Year

Spurs GM Brian Wright- "The game is chess, not checkers."

Mavericks GM Nico Harrison- "What is chess?"

An underrated benefit of this for the Spurs is that Fox will take a lot of the offensive burden off Wemby's hands. He usually has to be the best offensive AND defensive player for us to have a chance to win. This has led to him being gassed in the 4th.

The Jamal Murray to Wemby's Jokic.

Denver were what a 46-48 win team and 1st round / 2nd round and out team without Jamal Murray. With Murray, they are a 55-60 win caliber team that can win titles.

That is the type of leap I expect D Fox to bring to San Antonio.

I think Fox has shown enough clutch gene through his career to make a significant impact in crucial moments of playoff games if given the opportunity.

Fox is one of the leading clutch scorers / 4th quarter scorers in the NBA over the last few years.

Bulls got 0 first rounds in return for DeMar DeRozan, Alex Caruso, and Zach LaVine

Not sure they are going to get one for Vucevic either.

[Phantom255x]

The Alien and the Fox

I love it for San Antonio. They can still try and add a 3rd star at some point next offseason or in 2026 and then have a Big 3 with Wemby (in his prime), Fox and 3rd acquisition. They already have some nice bench pieces too.

I would not want to play San Antonio in the play-in this year, even with their inexperience. But that said, Fox, CP3, Barnes, etc. have a lot of playoff experience as well which can help Wemby's growth and the growth of others on that team if they make it.

[Goldstar88]

Are the Spurs a legit contender now?

Are they now? 

I don't think so.  My very basic thinking is that Collins for Fox doesn't turn a below .500 team into a top tier team.

But, the foundation is there.

   Yeah . Exciting day for Spurs fans. Wemby makes play easier for everyone. They?re off and running for the future and I think they?ll be an exciting playoff team.

Can?t believe how little the Spurs had to give up to get Fox. Thought at least one of Castle, Vassell, or Johnson would be included in the trade.

[keevsnick]

Are the Spurs a legit contender now?

Are they now? 

I don't think so.  My very basic thinking is that Collins for Fox doesn't turn a below .500 team into a top tier team.

But, the foundation is there.

I tend to agree, they are set up to become contenders but aren't there yet.

They need shooting. They have ONE guy who is an above average shooter for their position, and that's Wemby. Its going to make having an elite offense fairly difficult.