Luka is taking a beating...

[Kernewek]

he's basically White Harden....prove me wrong

I'd say Luka is a superior shot maker. Plus he's vastly superior in the playoffs and mentally tougher, in this regard is not even close and in the scheme of things that matters too much.

In fact, with all his in season accomplishments, is even hard to argue that Harden was even a good player considering that he basically did nothing throughout his whole career in the playoffs. And I'm not even talking about winning or losing, but just showing up to play.

I am a fervent James Harden hater, but this is not accurate.

[Moranis]

he's basically White Harden....prove me wrong

He's made the Finals?

Harden played in the Finals. Wasn't best player on team, of course that team also never went back to Finals after they let Harden go after that run.

[BudweiserCeltic]

he's basically White Harden....prove me wrong

I'd say Luka is a superior shot maker. Plus he's vastly superior in the playoffs and mentally tougher, in this regard is not even close and in the scheme of things that matters too much.

In fact, with all his in season accomplishments, is even hard to argue that Harden was even a good player considering that he basically did nothing throughout his whole career in the playoffs. And I'm not even talking about winning or losing, but just showing up to play.

I am a fervent James Harden hater, but this is not accurate.

What part of it you have a problem with?

[ManchesterCelticsFan]

Luka is a great offensive player and probably the only player on the Mavs team the Celtics would want on their regular rotation. However,  check out Luka's defensive lowlights

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/luka-doncics-defense-hits-shameful-levels-with-mavericks-on-brink-of-being-swept-by-celtics/

[Boston Garden Leprechaun]

[Big333223]

I don't remember seeing a professional basketball player play worse defense than what I've seen from Luka these 3 games. There was about 2 minutes of game 3 where he looked engaged and like he cared on defense and then it went away again.

Totally disengaged, doesn't even seem to care that every Celtic is walking by him. I would be embarrassed if I was him.

[cman88]

I don't remember seeing a professional basketball player play worse defense than what I've seen from Luka these 3 games. There was about 2 minutes of game 3 where he looked engaged and like he cared on defense and then it went away again.

Totally disengaged, doesn't even seem to care that every Celtic is walking by him. I would be embarrassed if I was him.

I wonder if it's because Boston truly may be the first team they faced that is actively attacking him with the plan to make him defend and expend energy.

makes you think what were the wolves doing letting him sit in the corner on a bad offensive player?

also, its funny to me how quick media narratives change from. "best backcourt duo of all time!" to "luka has no help!" to "luka is a disgrace!"

[blink]

It is pretty simple, if Luka doesn't want to take a lot of crap for his low-effort defense, then move your feet! 

get out there and show some effort.  Do anything to get better on def.  Get in better shape, improve your stamina in the off season, become stronger.

I don't feel bad at all for Luka getting roasted, because it is true.

[rocknrollforyoursoul]

I feel like Luka is the typical European player ? silky smooth on offense and a turnstile on defense.

[Kernewek]

he's basically White Harden....prove me wrong

I'd say Luka is a superior shot maker. Plus he's vastly superior in the playoffs and mentally tougher, in this regard is not even close and in the scheme of things that matters too much.

In fact, with all his in season accomplishments, is even hard to argue that Harden was even a good player considering that he basically did nothing throughout his whole career in the playoffs. And I'm not even talking about winning or losing, but just showing up to play.

I am a fervent James Harden hater, but this is not accurate.

What part of it you have a problem with?

It feels pretty indefensible.

Did he fall off a cliff after turning 30? More or less.

Did he earn a reputation for coming up short in elimination games? Of course.

But 23-5-6 for a career playoff stat line is nothing to scoff at, especially when the guy was one statistical anomaly away from taking down the Warriors dynasty - which is just how the game goes sometimes.

[celts55]

Please! This is r just absurd. Without him the Mavs aren?t even sniffing the playoffs, much less the finals. Agreed he?s not a very good defender and watching him constantly argue with the refs is tough. But to blame him for the Mavs being down 3-0 is ridiculous in my opinion. Irving did nothing the first 2 games. No one else on the team has stepped up.
I would say the only reason the games were close at all was do to Luka.
Don?t get me wrong. He?s not my favorite player. He needs to lose weight. He needs not to stay back arguing with the refs while the other team goes down the court for a 5 on 4. I also noticed on numerous occasions he has been stripped and just stood there as the Celtics go down the court for a layup. But, tell me a player that can?t improve?

[Atzar]

The media discourse around this league is incredibly negative, and that has only gotten worse in these playoffs.  Apparently nobody hates this league quite like the people who make a living covering it. 

[Vermont Green]

Luka is very much comparable to Harden, and people are starting to come around to seeing this.  Harden was a very good player in his prime.  An MVP level player.  First team all NBA level.  But because of his style of play, he did not experience the level of team success that other top players do.  All this is also true of Luka. 

The only difference is that this playoff run for Luka was a spot light for his short comings.  I am not surprised, I have been noting this about Luka all along.  Many here also see it, but for the more causal national fans, this finals run has changed their impression of Luka.  The level of coverage means the media is talking about it more.

I think the biggest issue with Luka is conditioning.  He plays decent defense in the 1st quarter (when he isn't pacing himself), but he is gassed by the 4th.  I don't think that his defense is about lack of ability.  The other thing with Luka is the ball domination (again, like Harden).  Who is going to want to play with him?  He has had good players on the team but they all end up leaving.  Harden never figured out how to play any other way.  Will see with Luka.

[cltc5]

Gotta tear him down to build up the Celtics.  Luka complains and doesn?t play offense, kyrie is old, etc.  now media will feel justified with the C?s winning it all because after all the Mavs are such a troubled team.

[BudweiserCeltic]

Luka is very much comparable to Harden, and people are starting to come around to seeing this.  Harden was a very good player in his prime.  An MVP level player.  First team all NBA level.  But because of his style of play, he did not experience the level of team success that other top players do.  All this is also true of Luka. 

The only difference is that this playoff run for Luka was a spot light for his short comings.  I am not surprised, I have been noting this about Luka all along.  Many here also see it, but for the more causal national fans, this finals run has changed their impression of Luka.  The level of coverage means the media is talking about it more.

I think the biggest issue with Luka is conditioning.  He plays decent defense in the 1st quarter (when he isn't pacing himself), but he is gassed by the 4th.  I don't think that his defense is about lack of ability.  The other thing with Luka is the ball domination (again, like Harden).  Who is going to want to play with him?  He has had good players on the team but they all end up leaving.  Harden never figured out how to play any other way.  Will see with Luka.

Luka has had 4 playoffs runs, and has been the best player in the team. Of those 4, he bounced in first round 1 time at 20 years of age against the #2 seeded Clippers. Next year the same thing against the same team in 7 games, 4th seeded then but more than likely as a result of injuries than talent.

He's gone to the playoffs 2 more times. The result? Western conference finals (where they defeated the #1 seed and lost to the eventual champions) and now in the finals.

And in just about every series he's played in the playoffs he's excelled and performed. I get knocking on Luka for his defense, but the proof is in the pudding that he has this team winning and winning when it matters which is the playoffs... and at the very least giving you consistently great offensive performances and incredible clutch moments.

In his short career, can't fathom putting Harden in the same sentence as far as the playoff goes.

Not that I disagree with your takes on things Luka is doing wrong or need to improve on, his conditioning etc., but as far as his impact on the floor it's overselling what his defense deficiencies have meant vs what his offensive proficiency has meant.