Patriots 2023 Season

[A Future of Stevens]

Why is there an uproar on Pats twitter about the Ravens poaching Malik? If he gets reps at QB for the Ravens, disaster has struck them. Seems like a good QB to run practice reps with. They might try to develop him long term as a gadget/wideout, but that's what we were angling to do.

Ravens  believe, probably correctly, that Huntley will get a better offer this summer, so I believe the intent with Cunningham is to groom him to be Lamar's backup next year

I honestly think it is a good idea for the Ravens. My confusion is more directed at why some Patriots fans think he is going to be some big miss that immediately great for the Ravens.

[Donoghus]

Why is there an uproar on Pats twitter about the Ravens poaching Malik? If he gets reps at QB for the Ravens, disaster has struck them. Seems like a good QB to run practice reps with. They might try to develop him long term as a gadget/wideout, but that's what we were angling to do.

Ravens  believe, probably correctly, that Huntley will get a better offer this summer, so I believe the intent with Cunningham is to groom him to be Lamar's backup next year

I honestly think it is a good idea for the Ravens. My confusion is more directed at why some Patriots fans think he is going to be some big miss that immediately great for the Ravens.

The allure of potential contrasted with the ineffectiveness of Mac & Zappe.

[Moranis]

I think firing Belichick is going to be a step back, maybe a necessary one, but the short term result is going to be getting worse, not better.  I hope everyone is prepared for that.

If I was Kraft, I would give him one more season.  I have said all along and still believe that this team is not that far off.  Teams can look really bad right up to when things kind of click and the team is good.  It even happened when Brady was here. 

I remember getting totally blown out by KC on a Monday night in 2014.  I think it was the 4th game of the season and it looked like the team was horrible.  Then things clicked and we ended up winning the Super Bowl.

We have a very good defense, even with probably our two best players injured, that is a good start.  I think the OL is just a player or 2 away, we can draft one and maybe sign one.  Maybe draft a receiver, I don't think you need to have superstar receivers, just good solid receivers.  Missing of course is a good QB.  That will probably take more than 1 season to solve but I still trust Bill to build the "infrastructure" of the team and then hand it over to someone to hopefully develop a new young QB.

How can it be any worse?

Ask Lions fans. Having a bad season or missing the playoffs for 3 years is nothing compared to spending 5-10 years as the dregs of the league.

Look how poorly some fans are taking one bad year and just think how poorly they'll process a revolving door of crappy coaches and players.

he said in the short term it is going to be worse, I was asking what that meant. Sure long term they can be bad for years which is worse, but I was responding to an post talking about it being worse in the short term.

What I meant is that if we start over right now, by bringing in a new coach, and new GM, really a whole new organization, than not only will we still have all the problems but some of the things that are actually starting to look OK, will get worse, take a step back.

I use the term building the infrastructure.  I think Belichick is still good at that, historically good in fact.  The infrastructure of the team is building, coming back.  I would rather have Belichick building the infrastructure another year than pretty much anyone else I can think of.  That is why I feel like a change at the end of the season will be a big step back. 

Give Bill one more season and then let Mayo or O'Brien or someone take over.  That may avoid having 5 bad seasons while another coach truncates the current rebuild and starts over and probably doesn't do it as well as Bill is doing it.  I think the team will be in a better place to hand off after one more season.

aside from coaching defense well, what is Bill doing well? What about the roster gives you hope Bill is the right person to go with?  I see a team that lacks talent, has drafted poorly (especially in the 1st couple of rounds),  whose free agent signings have been disastrous, etc.  What is the infrastructure you are referring to?

[Vermont Green]

I think firing Belichick is going to be a step back, maybe a necessary one, but the short term result is going to be getting worse, not better.  I hope everyone is prepared for that.

If I was Kraft, I would give him one more season.  I have said all along and still believe that this team is not that far off.  Teams can look really bad right up to when things kind of click and the team is good.  It even happened when Brady was here. 

I remember getting totally blown out by KC on a Monday night in 2014.  I think it was the 4th game of the season and it looked like the team was horrible.  Then things clicked and we ended up winning the Super Bowl.

We have a very good defense, even with probably our two best players injured, that is a good start.  I think the OL is just a player or 2 away, we can draft one and maybe sign one.  Maybe draft a receiver, I don't think you need to have superstar receivers, just good solid receivers.  Missing of course is a good QB.  That will probably take more than 1 season to solve but I still trust Bill to build the "infrastructure" of the team and then hand it over to someone to hopefully develop a new young QB.

How can it be any worse?

Ask Lions fans. Having a bad season or missing the playoffs for 3 years is nothing compared to spending 5-10 years as the dregs of the league.

Look how poorly some fans are taking one bad year and just think how poorly they'll process a revolving door of crappy coaches and players.

he said in the short term it is going to be worse, I was asking what that meant. Sure long term they can be bad for years which is worse, but I was responding to an post talking about it being worse in the short term.

What I meant is that if we start over right now, by bringing in a new coach, and new GM, really a whole new organization, than not only will we still have all the problems but some of the things that are actually starting to look OK, will get worse, take a step back.

I use the term building the infrastructure.  I think Belichick is still good at that, historically good in fact.  The infrastructure of the team is building, coming back.  I would rather have Belichick building the infrastructure another year than pretty much anyone else I can think of.  That is why I feel like a change at the end of the season will be a big step back. 

Give Bill one more season and then let Mayo or O'Brien or someone take over.  That may avoid having 5 bad seasons while another coach truncates the current rebuild and starts over and probably doesn't do it as well as Bill is doing it.  I think the team will be in a better place to hand off after one more season.

aside from coaching defense well, what is Bill doing well? What about the roster gives you hope Bill is the right person to go with?  I see a team that lacks talent, has drafted poorly (especially in the 1st couple of rounds),  whose free agent signings have been disastrous, etc.  What is the infrastructure you are referring to?

Teams rebuild all the time.  Most teams are bad a long time.  This is one bad season after 20 historically good seasons and a couple of just OK seasons.  People said that Belichick drafted poorly for 20 years yet the infrastructure of the team was good every year.

I have explained what I mean by infrastructure as best I can.  Defense, OL, special teams, all that is part of the infrastructure.  You can't win without infrastructure, no matter how good your QB and receivers are.  You can win with an average or less QB if you have a good infrastructure though, just ask Brock Purdy or Joe Flacco.

Of course the best is a good infrastructure and a good QB, that is the gold standard (I am not convinced that you need top receivers or backs on top of this, but it wouldn't hurt).  The Patriots were dominant for 20 years with good infrastructure and a good QB, along with in general just decent backs and receivers.  I am happy to have Bill building the infrastructure, the good QB has an element of luck or chance to it.

[johnnygreen]

This team has no infrastructure anymore, which is why Bill has to be let go.

The poor drafting dates back to Brady's last few years in NE. Unfortunately, we're seeing the culmination of that process now. Something like that takes years to prove itself out.

The other area of concern is the coaching staff. When was the last time Bill hired the best assistant coach for the job? In order to qualify for the job the person has to be related to Bill, fired from another team so the Pats don't have to pay them, or willing to be a yes man and not disagree with Bill.

Patriots fans are more than grateful for everything Bill has done for this team. However, he has not adjusted at the same rate as to the way the game is played today. Today's game is about speed and quickness, and this team has neither.

[Vermont Green]

This team has no infrastructure anymore, which is why Bill has to be let go.

The Patriots had the best infrastructure in the league for over 20 years, basically every year.  Who remembers the Dolphins "No Name" defense under Shula.  Shula built teams the same way, without stars, but solid at every position.  Good defenses, good OLs.

The Patriots are not that right now.  They are not solid at every position.  They have some holes, but I think they are closer than many people seem to think.  But do you really think that Belichick has forgotten how to build a defense or an OL?  He is not going to go out and overpay for a big name FA O-Tackle or something like that.  Neither would Don Shula.  And not every draft pick is going to be a solid starter.

We just need a few more solid players to reinforces the infrastructure, particularly the OL.  The defense is fine and will be better next season with Christian Gonzalez back.  And we get Judon another season.  Then hope we can find at least a decent QB, and we will be in the playoffs.  I think we already have good backs.  And even the receivers we have will look better with a solid OL and a decent QB.

We need to move on from Bill, I just don't think this is the time to do it.

[rocknrollforyoursoul]

I definitely don't want to underappreciate Bill, or undersell what he's done for the Patriots. It does seem clear to me, though, that he really isn't very good when it comes to offense. Having Brady and a decent-to-solid O-line resulted in quite a few receivers looking better than they actually were—not that they were bad, but several of them produced a lot less before and after they were with the Patriots.

Basically, I'm fine with Bill staying on if he's just the coach and not the GM. Well, I'd be fine with him giving draft input on defensive players, because he's picked quite a few really good defensive players, even in recent years (Barmore, Gonzalez), but he seems to have very little talent for evaluating receivers, and his failure to sufficiently address the O-line over the last couple years is a big issue. I think Mac Jones, as he demonstrated in his rookie season, could've been at least a decent QB for this team, but Bill's failure with the O-line and his completely ridiculous decision to have defensive coaches run the offense last season have ruined Mac for this team, thus setting back the rebuild by at least two full seasons.

[johnnygreen]

The unsung hero on the Patriots coaching staff during their great run was Dante Scarnecchia with the offensive line. No matter who the team drafted, Dante made it work. During his hiatus between 214-2015 and since 2020, the line has been an issue. Does the team simply need to draft better lineman or hire a legitimate offensive line coach?

[SparzWizard]

I don't want anymore no names or guys from 711. Or overpaying bums like JJSS or obtaining has-beens like Nelson Aghalor. We need guys who can play and are reputable.

Also we need coaches outside of the Belichick tree. Poach someone from the Shanahan tree. Grab Jim Harbaugh as a head coach. I'm down. Fresh start.

[A Future of Stevens]

I don't want anymore no names or guys from 711. Or overpaying bums like JJSS or obtaining has-beens like Nelson Aghalor. We need guys who can play and are reputable.

Also we need coaches outside of the Belichick tree. Poach someone from the Shanahan tree. Grab Jim Harbaugh as a head coach. I'm down. Fresh start.

Ben Johnson is the hot name for most vacancies. He was viewed as the big prize LAST offseason and chose to stay as the OC for the Lions.

[Birdman]

NFL announce a game in Brazil next season & 9 international games in 2025… u know players & coaches hates it & if u an season ticket holder or fan, u lose one home game as well as the city losing cash…NFL want more cash overseas.. MLB & NBA be playing more games also in the future

[Amonkey]

NFL announce a game in Brazil next season & 9 international games in 2025… u know players & coaches hates it & if u an season ticket holder or fan, u lose one home game as well as the city losing cash…NFL want more cash overseas.. MLB & NBA be playing more games also in the future

My brother went to the game in Germany and he said it was awesome. The closest thing to a World Cup atmosphere with bars having all kinds of NFL promotions, flags all over and people really excited about the whole thing. I think if fans have the money for it, it can be a real experience and the promotion of teams overseas can be a bigger investment than losing a home game.

However, Sao Paulo is not necessarily the most beautiful city in Brazil. It's huge and very international, but it may be like going to Chicago or even NYC compared to a Miami or LA in terms of entertainment value.

[Goldstar88]

I think firing Belichick is going to be a step back, maybe a necessary one, but the short term result is going to be getting worse, not better.  I hope everyone is prepared for that.

If I was Kraft, I would give him one more season.  I have said all along and still believe that this team is not that far off.  Teams can look really bad right up to when things kind of click and the team is good.  It even happened when Brady was here. 

I remember getting totally blown out by KC on a Monday night in 2014.  I think it was the 4th game of the season and it looked like the team was horrible.  Then things clicked and we ended up winning the Super Bowl.

We have a very good defense, even with probably our two best players injured, that is a good start.  I think the OL is just a player or 2 away, we can draft one and maybe sign one.  Maybe draft a receiver, I don't think you need to have superstar receivers, just good solid receivers.  Missing of course is a good QB.  That will probably take more than 1 season to solve but I still trust Bill to build the "infrastructure" of the team and then hand it over to someone to hopefully develop a new young QB.

How can it be any worse?

Ask Lions fans. Having a bad season or missing the playoffs for 3 years is nothing compared to spending 5-10 years as the dregs of the league.

Look how poorly some fans are taking one bad year and just think how poorly they'll process a revolving door of crappy coaches and players.

he said in the short term it is going to be worse, I was asking what that meant. Sure long term they can be bad for years which is worse, but I was responding to an post talking about it being worse in the short term.

What I meant is that if we start over right now, by bringing in a new coach, and new GM, really a whole new organization, than not only will we still have all the problems but some of the things that are actually starting to look OK, will get worse, take a step back.

I use the term building the infrastructure.  I think Belichick is still good at that, historically good in fact.  The infrastructure of the team is building, coming back.  I would rather have Belichick building the infrastructure another year than pretty much anyone else I can think of.  That is why I feel like a change at the end of the season will be a big step back. 

Give Bill one more season and then let Mayo or O'Brien or someone take over.  That may avoid having 5 bad seasons while another coach truncates the current rebuild and starts over and probably doesn't do it as well as Bill is doing it.  I think the team will be in a better place to hand off after one more season.

aside from coaching defense well, what is Bill doing well? What about the roster gives you hope Bill is the right person to go with?  I see a team that lacks talent, has drafted poorly (especially in the 1st couple of rounds),  whose free agent signings have been disastrous, etc.  What is the infrastructure you are referring to?

Teams rebuild all the time.  Most teams are bad a long time.  This is one bad season after 20 historically good seasons and a couple of just OK seasons.  People said that Belichick drafted poorly for 20 years yet the infrastructure of the team was good every year.

I have explained what I mean by infrastructure as best I can.  Defense, OL, special teams, all that is part of the infrastructure.  You can't win without infrastructure, no matter how good your QB and receivers are.  You can win with an average or less QB if you have a good infrastructure though, just ask Brock Purdy or Joe Flacco.

Of course the best is a good infrastructure and a good QB, that is the gold standard (I am not convinced that you need top receivers or backs on top of this, but it wouldn't hurt).  The Patriots were dominant for 20 years with good infrastructure and a good QB, along with in general just decent backs and receivers.  I am happy to have Bill building the infrastructure, the good QB has an element of luck or chance to it.

You mean good infrastructure and the greatest QB to ever play the game? 

In all seriousness, giving Bill one more year to fix the team would make sense if they were trending in the right direction. Unfortunately they are not and a big part of that is Belichick’s inability to draft offensive players. He’s set the team back years with that. Bill is still a great defensive coach, but he can’t be GM going forward. Drafting well is a big part of building the infrastructure and he’s been failing at that for many years now. Also,  Onwenu and Trent Brown are going to be free agents this off-season. Both are ranked in the top 5 for best free agents OT’s for 2024. Need to start hitting in the draft.

[green_bballers13]

I guess I don't understand why they wouldn't move on from BB now. He's in his 70's and the team hasn't had a chance to bottom out like this in 31 years.

It would be interesting if they hire Ben Johnson from the Lions (a former walk-on UNC QB) to coach Drake Maye and another Tarheel WR Tez Walker in the 2nd round.   

[KG Living Legend]

I think firing Belichick is going to be a step back, maybe a necessary one, but the short term result is going to be getting worse, not better.  I hope everyone is prepared for that.

If I was Kraft, I would give him one more season.  I have said all along and still believe that this team is not that far off.  Teams can look really bad right up to when things kind of click and the team is good.  It even happened when Brady was here. 

I remember getting totally blown out by KC on a Monday night in 2014.  I think it was the 4th game of the season and it looked like the team was horrible.  Then things clicked and we ended up winning the Super Bowl.

We have a very good defense, even with probably our two best players injured, that is a good start.  I think the OL is just a player or 2 away, we can draft one and maybe sign one.  Maybe draft a receiver, I don't think you need to have superstar receivers, just good solid receivers.  Missing of course is a good QB.  That will probably take more than 1 season to solve but I still trust Bill to build the "infrastructure" of the team and then hand it over to someone to hopefully develop a new young QB.

How can it be any worse?

Ask Lions fans. Having a bad season or missing the playoffs for 3 years is nothing compared to spending 5-10 years as the dregs of the league.

Look how poorly some fans are taking one bad year and just think how poorly they'll process a revolving door of crappy coaches and players.

he said in the short term it is going to be worse, I was asking what that meant. Sure long term they can be bad for years which is worse, but I was responding to an post talking about it being worse in the short term.

What I meant is that if we start over right now, by bringing in a new coach, and new GM, really a whole new organization, than not only will we still have all the problems but some of the things that are actually starting to look OK, will get worse, take a step back.

I use the term building the infrastructure.  I think Belichick is still good at that, historically good in fact.  The infrastructure of the team is building, coming back.  I would rather have Belichick building the infrastructure another year than pretty much anyone else I can think of.  That is why I feel like a change at the end of the season will be a big step back. 

Give Bill one more season and then let Mayo or O'Brien or someone take over.  That may avoid having 5 bad seasons while another coach truncates the current rebuild and starts over and probably doesn't do it as well as Bill is doing it.  I think the team will be in a better place to hand off after one more season.

 Absolutely out of your mind. How did he do at building the offense the last 4 years? The dude is washed. Embrace change.

 The new GM could be bad,  but he also could make a very quick turnaround.  Football you can make changes fast unlike basketball.